CPU prices are outrageous

Discussion in 'Mac Pro' started by Beta Particle, Dec 19, 2013.

  1. Beta Particle macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2012
    #1
    $3500 plus the cost of the quad-core it's replacing for a CPU that Intel sells for $2600!?

    Apple are almost certainly getting a discount on buying in bulk from Intel, so that's a minimum of a $1200 mark-up.

    Outside the US, it's even more ridiculous - the cost of upgrading to the 12-core CPU is $4600!

    I get that you're paying a premium for the Apple name, and the form-factor of the machine, but these are standardized components from Intel.
     
  2. paukivbashne macrumors member

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    Sep 16, 2012
    Location:
    Ukraine
    #2
    After looking at all the images available online i get the impression that the processor is not soldered to main board.
    im a wrong?
    i mean it will be a lot cheaper to upgrade it yourself
    been doing it on iMacs quite a lot
     
  3. ybz90 macrumors 6502a

    ybz90

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    Jul 10, 2009
    #3
    This is standard pricing practice for workstations across vendors, not just Apple. The Apple tax may not be a myth in general, but it's less applicable at the high end. Historically, Dell and HP workstations have cost roughly the same, if not more.
     
  4. Celedral macrumors 6502

    Celedral

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    May 29, 2008
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    Los Angeles
    #4
    It happens all the time. But this is just too obvious in terms of price difference between retail and oem. Just like paying $2,000-$3000 for a navigation unit in a new car when in actuality they cost $200-$300.

    Looks like my limit is a 6core. That 8core is way overpriced to us humans.
     
  5. DJenkins macrumors 6502

    DJenkins

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    Sydney, Australia
    #5
    I don't see this as a bad thing. You can always buy the components and build your own. Don't have time? Apple have done the hard work for you at a premium price ;)
     
  6. Gav Mack macrumors 68020

    Gav Mack

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    #6
    If it was my money and the teardown shows CPU swaps are straightforward I would go for the quad and hunt for an octo E5 on the grey/oem market to drop in, keeping the quad for any AppleCare moments.
     
  7. haravikk macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    May 1, 2005
    #7
    Definitely agree; in the UK the difference between the 4-core and 6-core models is £800, meanwhile the 8-core upgrade on the 6-core model is £1200!

    I mean, if your work is desperately CPU bound then maybe you can justify paying it, but if that's the case then the new Mac Pro isn't really a good option even before you consider the cost, as a dual CPU workstation will either cost less or do more.

    However, the GPU pricing by comparison is pretty damned reasonable, especially for adding D700's to the six-core model, so if you've got any good OpenCL powered software then that's going to make a far bigger difference than a CPU upgrade ever could.

    I really see it as just another sign that Apple's direction is all about OpenCL; in such a setup 6-core should be more than enough, but for this initial model the barrier to entry for Mac users with high CPU requirements has gotten pretty high.
     
  8. KBS756 macrumors 6502a

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    Jan 27, 2009
    #8
    If anyone can confirm the CPU will be user replaceable (from hex core to 12 core) I may just find a way to afford one of these! and upgrade in the future (while keeping my 2009 2x 3.33GHZ X5680 16 GB Ram GTX Titan equipped Mac Pro on hand for rendering

    though I do wonder what I could sell it for
     
  9. Beta Particle thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    Jun 25, 2012
    #9
    I can understand paying a higher base price for the machine because it's custom designed hardware by Apple, but the CPU is a stock part.

    It doesn't cost them anything extra beyond the processor cost itself whether they put in a 4, 6, 8, 10, or 12-core CPU.

    If it's socketed rather than soldered onto the board, they're completely ripping you off. It's $2750 to buy on Newegg right now, rather than the ~$3800 Apple is charging. (the quad core CPU has a list price of $300, so Apple are going to be charging at least that much for it on the base spec machine)

    Keep in mind that you are probably also paying £200+ for the base spec quad-core CPU as well. So add £200 to each of those prices to see what you're actually paying for the 6, 8, or 12-core models.

    I really think the Mac Pro should have offered dual GPU or dual CPU configurations. 2x 6-core CPUs are cheaper than a single 12-core CPU - and they're clocked higher.

    It's only reasonable pricing if they are actually workstation-class cards with ECC memory. If they're just rebranded consumer cards without ECC memory - which might explain why they seem to be such good value - then they're also overpriced.

    The problem is that very little is using OpenCL in a meaningful way today, only Final Cut really. By the time OpenCL takes off - if it ever does - you'll probably want a faster machine.
     
  10. jblagden macrumors 65816

    jblagden

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    Aug 16, 2013
    #10
    I gotta admit, you’re right. I’ve been looking over prices, particularly of laptops, from other vendors, and Apple’s prices are about the same as those from other vendors, at least when you’re comparing computers of equal specs.
     
  11. cynics macrumors G3

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2012
    #11
    This.

    If something is intended for professional use a premium is tacked on. I do technical work an our company has a different rate for residential vs commercial vs industrial even if the equipment is identical. So this practice isn't even limited to products but services too.

    That price is likely a double premium too, Intel sells it at a premium since its directed to professionals and then Apple does it again.

    Sometimes there are some benefits that come with it though. Like a no questions asked replacement for zero downtime. On site repairs etc. This can be factored into that premium.
     
  12. jblagden macrumors 65816

    jblagden

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2013
    #12
    Yeah, industry-specific stuff like that is often priced higher. Chemdraw comes to mind. And let’s not forget Quadro GPUs.
    --- Post Merged, Mar 5, 2017 ---
    By “build your own”, are you talking about building a Hackintosh? Or are you talking about building a Windows PC?
     
  13. AidenShaw macrumors P6

    AidenShaw

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2003
    Location:
    The Peninsula
    #13
    In California, you can get discount electrical rates for the grow lights for your marijuana.

    http://govnews.us/id/17149895695

    Strange pricing happens all over - especially when the per-unit cost of the product is a small part of the overall cost.
     
  14. orph, Mar 5, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2017

    orph macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Location:
    UK
    #14
    wow @AidenShaw that's just odd, im still amazed on Americas 180 turn :eek: must be tempting to get one plant+light to save bills on power :p

    The dual cpu configs are out of fashion now, and the heat/size envelope of the nmp id gess

    also if you have a read at some of pugetsystems articles on video editing and cpu utilization you will notice that the single cpus tend to beat dual cpu setups a lot and some apps dont seem to be able to "see" past the first cpu a lot of the time so iv got to asume that programing and utilization of dual cpu's is even worse than just using more than 4 threads on a single cpu
    https://www.pugetsystems.com/all_articles.php

    vary few apps seem to be able to scale well past one cpu never mind more than 4 cores.

    or if you relay need it make a hackintosh

    edit here's one that shows 2 cpu's can be slower than 1
    https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Adobe-Premiere-Pro-CC-2015-3-CPU-Comparison-849/
     
  15. William_si macrumors regular

    William_si

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2016
    Location:
    Croatia
    #15
    No, not in encoding to final output or decoding video stream, as this scales across all cores.

    The CPU amount is, unless the app specifically reads it out, transparent to the OS and application and the access speed/time is the same so this is a stupid programming problem (cpumax = 4), not a CPU/design problem in any way.

    Dual CPU hacks are not working very well, single you have some options but these generally limit you to ~64GB RAM with reasonable pricing.
     
  16. orph macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Location:
    UK
    #16
    1 depends on video codec/app, but i do think your correct in general final encode on cpu scales well with low core counts but i see all the time in benches that large core count cpu's dont scale well
    https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/a...o-CC-2015-3-CPU-Comparison-849/#Exportingto4K
    the 28 core cpu seems to full behind the 10 core cpu way to often.

    2 yep ;3 we dream of CPU scaling like GPU scaling

    3 i know almost nothing of hacks so my bad, was mostly thinking about all the good cpu's that are faster than the ivy bridge gen, that cost almost nothing compared to the cost mentioned by the op.
     
  17. ApfelKuchen macrumors 68020

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2012
    Location:
    Between the coasts
    #17
    Yeah, you're probably joking, but this is one of the ways "fake news" circulates. Nothing fake about bulk electrical discounts, but the implication that anyone other than commercial growers qualify for this deal... misleading.

    Sure, a commercial farmer can get reduced rates for power and water; part agricultural subsidy, part bulk discount. It's not like Mary Jane Doe will qualify for the light she's shedding on a few potted plants in her basement (and the savings are probably not good enough to offset the electrician's bill for setting up the separate meter, breaker panels, etc. required)
     
  18. flyinmac macrumors 68030

    flyinmac

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2006
    Location:
    United States
    #18
    Interesting resurrection and detour to a thread that died 4 years ago.

    CPU upgrade prices to Mary Jane's growing operation. :p
     

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