Cube upgrade assistance needed!

[Jiggly Billy]

After picking up a Cube today (in order to play games from our childhood), I'm now ordering all the upgrades that can possibly be done to it. 1.5GB of RAM is already on the way, we have a spare 120GB SSD and a SATA-IDE adapter for it, and I *THINK* (for now), we are ordering an XFX 6200 for it. Now all is left is the processor upgrade.

Now, I can not find a proper upgrade for it. This website (https://www.tamayatech.com/parts.php) has "new" and "refurbished" (whatever that means) Encore ST/G4 upgrades, but none of the cube specific upgrades. Is it possible to used the regular kits and swap the headsink from the factory card to the Encore unit? Or will we run into VRM issues?

Thank you all!

 

[mode11]

I couldn't see any upgrades at your link, but yes, it is possible. I've got a non-Cube Sonnet Encore ST 1.2GHz G4 upgrade in my Cube. It attached fine to the Cube heatsink once the Sonnet's regular purple heatsink was removed. Fitting a base fan is essential though, and adding heatsinks to the VRM chips on the DC-DC board is a good idea.

 

[Jiggly Billy]

Good to know that they will work! If you search Encore ST, they pop up. I may just end up getting the $200 1.0GHZ, maybe the 1.2ghz. I really only plan on using this for some early-mid 2000s gaming & managing our 120GB iPod Mini (SD card mod) and 40GB 3rd gen iPod, so a ton of power isn't necessary

 

[LightBulbFun]

Good to know that they will work! If you search Encore ST, they pop up. I may just end up getting the $200 1.0GHZ, maybe the 1.2ghz. I really only plan on using this for some early-mid 2000s gaming & managing our 120GB iPod Mini (SD card mod) and 40GB 3rd gen iPod, so a ton of power isn't necessary

I recommend holding out, $200 is a bit much for a 1Ghz CPU upgrade I would recommend waiting for a cheaper sonnet to show up, they do show up from time to time

if you dont mind going a bit DIY tho:

a popular upgrade people do is to fit a 450/500Mhz Dual G4 CPU card from the PMG4 GigE to their G4 cube

it does require a bit of soldering however to relocate an inductor choke coil on the Card and some bodging to make the heatsink fit however theres a few guides on how to do this on the web

if you dont want to go through all of that, you could buy a single CPU 533Mhz DA CPU card and overclock it to 600-650Mhz giving you a nice little speed bump

 

[Jiggly Billy]

I recommend holding out, $200 is a bit much for a 1Ghz CPU upgrade I would recommend waiting for a cheaper sonnet to show up, they do show up from time to time

if you dont mind going a bit DIY tho:

a popular upgrade people do is to fit a 450/500Mhz Dual G4 CPU card from the PMG4 GigE to their G4 cube

it does require a bit of soldering however to relocate an inductor choke coil on the Card and some bodging to make the heatsink fit however theres a few guides on how to do this on the web

if you dont want to go through all of that, you could buy a single CPU 533Mhz DA CPU card and overclock it to 600-650Mhz giving you a nice little speed bump

I've read about the dual CPU card install, though since most games don't utilize both processors I'm not sure I would get a big boost? The 533MHZ CPU idea is a pretty good inexpensive place to start. Kind of hard to find the CPU though. There is 1 logic board from a DA G4 with the 533mhz attached to it, I'd hate to waste a whole board for just the CPU :\

 

[mode11]

This guy: http://www013.upp.so-net.ne.jp/cyberdog7/pl1.6ghz.html (translate with Google) found no difference in practice going from a single 1.2GHz to a dual 1.6GHz in a Cube.

This is likely because for older software, single threaded performance is more important. Also, the faster clocked G4s are the 7447 variety, which lack the 2MB L3 cache of the slower clocked 7455 chips. The cache helps a lot, especially in 100MHz bus machines like the Cube.

A CPU upgrade does make a big difference, but I wouldn't spend too much money. There are easier ways of playing old games with good performance (e.g. a G4 tower / PowerBook, or emulation). Make sure you look internationally for auctions - I got mine from Germany.

 

[Jiggly Billy]

This guy: http://www013.upp.so-net.ne.jp/cyberdog7/pl1.6ghz.html (translate with Google) found no difference in practice going from a single 1.2GHz to a dual 1.6GHz in a Cube.

This is likely because for older software, single threaded performance is more important. Also, the faster clocked G4s are the 7447 variety, which lack the 2MB L3 cache of the slower clocked 7455 chips. The cache helps a lot, especially in 100MHz bus machines like the Cube.

A CPU upgrade does make a big difference, but I wouldn't spend too much money. There are easier ways of playing old games with good performance (e.g. a G4 tower / PowerBook, or emulation). Make sure you look internationally for auctions - I got mine from Germany.

That's why I figured, as cool as it would be to have one, to pass on a dual CPU card for this purpose. Just a single quick CPU would work nicely! I think I read somewhere that the DA Processor required additional 12v? Or should I just be able to overclock it and call it good? I'm assuming that you'd have to do the conversion to overclock a 533MHZ CPU to 600/650 taking into consideration the 100mhz bus of the Cube vs 133mhz bus of the DA?

There are easier ways of playing games, but I ALWAYS wanted a G4 cube! And I'm quite stubborn, so I'll find a way to make this work

 

[mode11]

I think the DA is basically the same as the QuickSilver. If so, perhaps a 933MHz CPU from a QS would work (though watch out for heat). And yeah, the DA CPU needs 12V, on one of the mounting screws I believe.

 

[LightBulbFun]

I think the DA is basically the same as the QuickSilver. If so, perhaps a 933MHz CPU from a QS would work (though watch out for heat). And yeah, the DA CPU needs 12V, on one of the mounting screws I believe.

uhh not quite

its the QS CPU that needs 12V the DAs dont need 12V

but any DA/QS CPU faster then the 533 single wont fit in a cube due to it running into the ATA connector IIRC (much like a Sawtooth)

 

[Jiggly Billy]

uhh not quite

its the QS CPU that needs 12V the DAs dont need 12V

but any DA/QS CPU faster then the 533 single wont fit in a cube due to it running into the ATA connector IIRC (much like a Sawtooth)

Hmm. At that point I may as well hold out for a full-on upgrade as opposed to overclocking a DA CPU? There is a 533mhz DA CPU on ebay right now for $18, but only going from 450mhz-600mhz wouldn't open the door to anything new in terms of what games I could run on it (most start requiring 733mhz+)

 

[bunnspecial]

FWIW, a 533mhz card out of a DA will run at 400mhz if dropped in a Cube unmodified.

 

[Jiggly Billy]

FWIW, a 533mhz card out of a DA will run at 400mhz if dropped in a Cube unmodified.

I figured I need to change the resistors for a 6x multiplier. Maybe push my luck with 6.5x? But I’ve never heard of anyone pushing those that far before

 

[bunnspecial]

I figured I need to change the resistors for a 6x multiplier. Maybe push my luck with 6.5x? But I’ve never heard of anyone pushing those that far before

You can certainly try. I'd think it would be okay with a base fan, although I've never tried it.

Honestly, up in that range I'd hunt down a Sonnet in the ~800mhz range. The one I have has L3 cache(I forget if it's 1 or 2mb) which actually makes more of a real world difference than the faster clock speed.

 

[LightBulbFun]

I figured I need to change the resistors for a 6x multiplier. Maybe push my luck with 6.5x? But I’ve never heard of anyone pushing those that far before

iv seen a few 533Mhz 7410s hit 650Mhz

I even saw one guy hit 700Mhz on a 7410 ZIF with some beeftastic cooling and voltage mods in a G3 BW but in the end it blew the arse end out of the G3 BWs VRMs must of been quite fast tho

ill also mention clock for clock a 7410 is faster then a 7450 but a 7450 can hit higher clocks

(the 7410 has a nice short 4 stage pipe line where as the 7450 is 7 stages)

 

[AphoticD]

Have a wade through this thread on my 2x Sawtoothen;
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/my-powermac-g4-lucky-dip-twins.2070101/

The TL;DR of it is on a 100Mhz System bus, a 6x multiplier on a DA 533Mhz card (7410 with 1MB L2 cache) benchmarks only slightly under a 733Mhz DA Card at 7x multiplier (7450 with 256k L2 + 1MB L3 cache). However the 7450 produces significantly more heat, even at the slightly underclocked rate.

In real world use, the 7450 with the L3 cache does make a noticeable difference, but the 7410 is a great performer (and a cheap upgrade) nonetheless.

Edit: I added 2x 60mm 12v cooling fans on the front and back of the stock heatsink in my now 700mhz unit to increase air flow. This is in the fairly roomy Sawtooth, so I can only imagine the little cube will suffer in the heat of the 7450.