He makes two main points.
I would agree on the not as fast point, but I don't agree on that not as flexible.TB isn't as fast as PCIe, and not as flexible. It puts the user in the position where they are forced to upgrade the computer in a few years if they want new technology.
It's going to have to be Apple that offers upgrades. I've been trying to get a confirmation, but so far I've just been getting a run around. Which I suppose is still better than a no. My guess is there won't be a confirmation until Apple ships the first upgrade card.We also don't have confirmation yet about the upgradeability of the GPUs, but it will certainly be a while before someone does offer one. Remember how long it was when there were no video upgrade options for the current MPs, except for extremely expensive pro video ones?
Quite possibly, since it appears that it's a custom card size and such.It's going to have to be Apple that offers upgrades. I've been trying to get a confirmation, but so far I've just been getting a run around. Which I suppose is still better than a no. My guess is there won't be a confirmation until Apple ships the first upgrade card.
I think unless Apple makes this new style of PCI card a standard for PCs too (which they could do with Intel pushing everyone along with them) third parties might make a card. But I don't see that as likely. I do think Intel is eventually going to have to deal with this problem, as it's present in any machine with Thunderbolt, but I don't see Apple pushing to make this a standard.Quite possibly, since it appears that it's a custom card size and such.
It will be a while in any case before a 3rd party had reason to make upgrades for it. That's part of the reason I'm thinking of springing for the D500s.
I think that it would be prudent to wait for the teardowns before claiming that the graphics cards are "easily removable". The also need to be "easily reassembled" to be swappable in a practical sense.In the pro-upgrades column, I think if Apple had intended for these GPUs not to be swappable, they wouldn't have put them on easily removable cards in the first place.
The "card" in the case of the CPU is a proprietary form factor motherboard. It's a "card" simply because the Mac Mini Pro has to be assembled, and needs to be repaired.I think (personally) that it's also interesting they put the CPU on a card, because that's another thing they seriously did not need to do if that wasn't intended to be upgraded.
for clarity.. in my case, it was always the access latch at the top of the list then the screws were next..Some here have been pointing at the screws that hold the Mac Mini Pro together as proof that it's upgradeable. To me, it just means that the robots that build the Mac Mini Pros use those screws to put it together. It says nothing about end-user upgradeability.
I don't think the cards will be user upgradable. That said, that's different than upgradable.The general concept of "user upgradeable" means not only that the parts can be removed and replaced without specialized tools -- but also that upgraded parts are available to buy. Until Apple, OWC or others put those upgraded parts on the market, it's pointless to debate about how easy it is to replace a graphics card on the Mac Mini Pro.
Right, but those are the same requirements for upgradability. And the mount is very... particular for something that's not intended to be removed after purchase at any time. Apple could have done a lot more screws, or bolted it more directly into the case. Usually in things Apple doesn't intend to be swappable, they're buried somewhat into the case.The "card" in the case of the CPU is a proprietary form factor motherboard. It's a "card" simply because the Mac Mini Pro has to be assembled, and needs to be repaired.
Again, not "user upgradable", but upgradable.It's fine for Apple to streamline its repair process by treating the mobo+CPU as the FRU. But unless the CPU is socketed and the mobo can be removed and replaced without special tools or skills - it's hard to consider that the CPU is upgradeable.
Yes, but it's interesting that IS the design to start with. Apple didn't have to build a case that was user accessible with the cards front and center. Just look at the disks in the Mac Mini. They're buried under piles of boards.Some here have been pointing at the screws that hold the Mac Mini Pro together as proof that it's upgradeable. To me, it just means that the robots that build the Mac Mini Pros use those screws to put it together. It says nothing about end-user upgradeability.
Let's all repeat again: "User upgradable" is not the same thing as "upgradable."If you can't buy the upgraded parts, and if the disassembly/reassembly process it too difficult for even the skilled tinkerer to attempt, then in practice one would have to conclude that it is not user-upgradeable.
Which is exactly what I said (at least the Apple having upgrades and doing them in store part.)Perhap in a year from now the Apple store (or OWC and....) will have GPU and CPU and other hardware upgrades for the Mac Mini Pro - and those of us with doubts will be proven wrong.
that's preaching to the choirI don't think the cards will be user upgradable. That said, that's different than upgradable.
I think that we're on the same page then....Let's all repeat again: "User upgradable" is not the same thing as "upgradable."
Sure. I don't think Apple's upgrade prices would necessarily be dirt cheap. They'll probably keep the same premium they've had, and tack on service fees. But it's still a cheaper choice than replacing the whole machine.A forklift picked it up, and dropped it in the dumpster. The upgrade was $60K for 80 TB (expandable to 2 PB), and occupied 6 RU.
Unless they change the socket every revision, there will be newer cards that fit and can be installed into the same socket. And those cards will make their way into the market, just like every Apple OEM part does, because Apple does have individual parts. No way around it.And Apple? There's basically no chance they're going to release upgrades either.
why owc? do they even sell gpus? (real question.. i don't know)Guys,
I really wouldn't hold your breath for upgradable cards. Basically the only group with the resources, interest and history to do an upgrade is OWC.
it's proprietary though..However In an earlier interview with this same guy (the CEO of OWC) soft panned the idea they'd make one. Consider, the engineering effort would be significant. The connector is custom, one way or another, even if the lines are standard PCI.
for gpus? small.. probably too small for someone like nvidia to move into the game and even then, apple has the power(trademark) to deny them entry.. which would likely happen if there's some sort of political (not literally political) bullying going on in the background (such as cuda)Second, how big is the market place?
you're in the majority here.. most people are going to agree with that statement..There's basically no chance they're going to release upgrades either.