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CVS and Rite Aid Officially Disable Apple Pay Support At Stores Nationwide

KdParker said:
Have you seen that systems proposed interface?

And the information they want from the consumer is crazy. Plus, do you really believe you prices will go down if they cut out the credit card swiping process?
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Yes I have seen that interface. No biggie and I'm sure that if need be it can be changed. It's not about the interface for them: it is about what they are trying to achieve.

If the retailers said: "For the next year if you use this system to pay you get a 3% discount" people would use it no matter what its interface. There is very little doubt about that.

And, yes, I do believe in a competitive market prices would go down, at least somewhat, if the fees for debit and CC transactions did not exist. But more importantly why would I, as I consumer, want a portion of the money I am spending at a retailer to go to a bank, or even Apple, for providing much less of a service than the store I am shopping at in the first place?



Michael
 
Totally weird. I guess CVS, Rite Aid, etc. don't want to pay the associated in-store fees to host Apple Pay?

Instead, they must be getting a sweeter deal from some NFC producing partner who'll probably offer a crappier and less reliable consumer experience. But hey, who's to judge—seems like they'll be saving money??

What a joke.
 
TomTomHatesCats said:
I think his point was that iPhone users DID speak up before it affected them by saying they didn't care about NFC and openly mocking Google Wallet. I can't really argue that because it's true.
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iPhone users stood up for NFC. That's also true.

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mozumder said:
Guess what? You're still going to buy things at CVS because paying by credit card is fine.
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Not me either. You're not very good at guessing.
 
Tinmania said:
MCX has one primary goal: take the banks and credit card companies out of the equation due to the fees on debit and credit card purchases.

As a consumer, I want that too. Those fees started many years ago due to the cost (remember paper credit card slips?) and risk associated with credit cards (non payment, fraud, etc.). Well now it is almost all automated and, at least with debit cards, the risk to the banks for non payment is very low. So no wonder retailers are trying to cut them out of the equation.

So why does everyone want a system where Apple takes a cut out of what you buy? Seems bizarre to be advocating that.
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I will never, ever give a retailer access to my checking account. If I wish to challenge a purchase on a credit card, I can do so before I pay the bill. With ACH, my money is gone and I have to fight (with no advocate on my side) to recover it.

Apple has come up with a system that is more secure than me swiping my card (or in some cases actually having to hand it over to a cashier) and as a result, protects my identity and makes it less likely that I will become a victim of fraud.

If Apple gets a small percentage of the fees (whether I swipe my card or use ApplePay, the fee is the same to the retailer) for providing me, and my credit card company, a little extra security... then I say more power to them. You bet I'm on board with that.
 
ok... No one shop there again...

The irony of all this is no one ever stops plastic cards :) *even though their less secure* it's not like a merchant will just stop supporting all plastic cards Cash only..

It's a transition, but in the end, the plastic still wins.... one being we'll still be having issues, and two, plastic cards just work ....
 
dotme said:
I will never, ever give a retailer access to my checking account.
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If they have your account and routing number, they have access but not authorization to make a transaction.

In the last week, I've seen a person whip out a checkbook, yes, a checkbook to make a purchase at Best Buy, Target & Bed, Bath & Beyond.
I though most merchants stop taking checks but I guess not.

*Talk about a long wait...

May be people are going low tech to prevent getting their CC accounts compromised.
 
bawbac said:
If they have your account and routing number, they have access but not authorization to make a transaction.
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Little consolation to someone who's had their checking account cleaned out though. It's a matter of recourse, or lack thereof.

I use checks still. To pay my credit card bills. After I have inspected them.

Maybe I'm a control freak, but I don't allow very many entities to furtle around in my back account. In fact I only allow one - my mortgage company. Never want to miss that payment. Everyone else gets to send me a bill, which I'll pay once I'm sure I agree with it.
 
"still in the process of evaluating mobile payment options."

This is a bizarre statement considering they were already accepting NFC payments without hesitation. How can you evaluate the payment system when you disable the system, which was previous working, completely?

They've signed a contract and are now stuck with an anti-consumerist policy. A shame.
 
dcorban said:
"still in the process of evaluating mobile payment options."

This is a bizarre statement considering they were already accepting NFC payments without hesitation. How can you evaluate the payment system when you disable the system, which was previous working, completely?

They've signed a contract and are now stuck with an anti-consumerist policy. A shame.
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No they aren't. They want to block consumer choice. However, we can block them by not shopping at their stores.
 
Tinmania said:
Those fees started many years ago due to the cost (remember paper credit card slips?) and risk associated with credit cards (non payment, fraud, etc.). Well now it is almost all automated and, at least with debit cards, the risk to the banks for non payment is very low.
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It seems you aren't familiar with the complexities of high volume, real time billing.

I started my career doing this, at a company called Portal Software, and I can tell you from personal experience that doing balance checks and fraud detection for tens or hundreds of millions of accounts requires very large and expensive systems. You have to pull balance, rate a transaction, evaluate it for fraud against the existing spending patterns, and update the balance, all in less that about three seconds. And you have to do this under a load of thousands or tens of thousands of transactions per second.

I have close friends who implement these systems today. Payment processors are spending a LOT of money on this, and planning on spending more. Even with all of that, they still don't have sufficient compute power to evaluate every single transaction for fraud, and they amount they eat on fraudulent transactions is staggering.

So, if payment companies can save many millions of dollars per quarter by giving Apple a fraction of a percent, it is well worth it to them. That's why they are eating the cost.

For me, the consumer, this means that my CC details are protected, and I won't have to change my card numbers again. Under the current system, I have to do it once or twice a year. This costs me nothing. This is a win for everyone.
 
BruiserB said:
There's nothing to "hold on" about. They already evaluated the NFC systems and enabled them for Google Wallet and NFC Credit Cards (PayWave, PayPass). ApplePay is not a new protocol and it just is like taking another card via NFC. It would be like CVS and RiteAid saying hold on because now Citibank is issuing NFC cards when only Chase and Amex did in the past. Are they going to take a time out every time a new company using the same protocol comes on board?
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caesarp said:
What are you talking about? What is the right way? NFC isn't any special magic that requires some testing all of the sudden. Apple Pay and Google wallet via NFC worked fine. This isn't about approaching the "right" way, its about the MCX consortium and their interest in reducing interchange fees and obtaining consumer data. Haven't you been paying attention?
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Yes, I have been paying attention - since I have been using NFC for payments for quite some time now.

The fact of the matter is now with Apple on board, NFC traffic will spike. There is nothing wrong with retailers who by the way, are not obligated to have these terminals, to take a step back and re-evaluate this method of transacting business.

This whole thread is filled with entitlement posts - oh just because Apple says you can use something now every other company should just say "OK!" and be done with it? I visited a store this weekend that I've been able to use NFC in the past and guess what! Yep, it was turned off. So I did what any sane person would do, and not throw a hissy fit and pay in pennies or take my business elsewhere, but used my credit card that was in my wallet.

I'll repeat - just because Apple tells you that you can now do something (welcome to 2011!) does not mean you are entitled to actually do so.
 
mrothroc said:
It seems you aren't familiar with the complexities of high volume, real time billing.
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Actually I am.

You act as if retailers don't already have POS systems in place that are evaluating a huge array of factors: everything from customer tracking, rewards spending patterns, inventory management, productivity tracking, and much more.

You are thinking of their system as a generic debit/credit processing system when it is not. It doesn't have to consider if Jane Doe from Nebraska bought fuel in Florida and Georgia the day before at Joe's mini mart and Texaco. Or if perhaps she spent $2,000 on watercraft rental. She won't be doing that with this system.



Mike
 
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#BoycottCVS #BoycottRiteAid
 
Just read the TechCrunch article. Them cutting out merchant fees and wanting to push loyalty programs and ad campaigns doesn't surprise me, nor does most of the opt-out data collection...

But them collecting health/fitness data? That's creepy.
 
Tinmania said:
If the retailers said: "For the next year if you use this system to pay you get a 3% discount" people would use it no matter what its interface. There is very little doubt about that.
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No they won't.

If 5% at Target isn't enough to get them to leave their rewards CC behind, then 3% won't do it either.

I deal with this every time I go to work. I hear it, they aren't "excuses" they are just the facts. 5% is not worth getting a red card for - and we have debit or credit.

The merchants are delusional, just like my higher ups that think I can get 5 people every 100 to sign up. I'm honest, I explain, I don't coerce or lie. No ones grandma comes thru my line and leaves thinking she signed up for a rewards card not a credit card. Seriously, I have had a few that have no idea they got a CC.

But 3% isn't going to cut it today.... nope.
 
Tinmania said:
Actually I am.

You act as if retailers don't already have POS systems in place that are evaluating a huge array of factors: everything from customer tracking, rewards spending patterns, inventory management, productivity tracking, and much more.

You are thinking of their system as a generic debit/credit processing system when it is not. It doesn't have to consider if Jane Doe from Nebraska bought fuel in Florida and Georgia the day before at Joe's mini mart and Texaco. Or if perhaps she spent $2,000 on watercraft rental. She won't be doing that with this system.



Mike
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POS Systems do a lot more than most people think. When I worked at Walmart, that touchscreen marvel would allow us to get our tasks, without having to report to a manager, tell the system you've completed the task, call for help, get a spill cleaned up and more. If it can do this stuff for the associates, I'm pretty sure it does more than take money when it comes to customers.
 
Praesto said:
5 years in retail myself. I am perfectly fine with doing this to the employee. If everyone did it all employee's would be so frustrated the corporation would no longer have people to work their stores.

It might be the childish way to go about it, but I would laugh as I walked out with my items.
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If everyone did it, maybe. But not enough people would. And in retail, for every employee that quits or is fired, there are plenty of people waiting in line to take their place.

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firewood said:
Actually it does for the bigger corporations. Because store efficiency metrics are computer monitored. Doesn't matter what the clerk says, because the efficiency of his/her register (item and customer transactions per hour, restocking man hours, customer loyalty rate, etc.) shows up on HQs computer monitors.
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Maybe if enough people did it. But one guy coming in a few times with a PITA transaction they would probably just deal with it or management would speak to him one-on-one.

They wouldn't see it as an Apple Pay situation and rectify Apple Pay. They would see it as a frustrated customer and deal with the customer.
 
Tinmania said:
If the retailers said: "For the next year if you use this system to pay you get a 3% discount" people would use it no matter what its interface. There is very little doubt about that.
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TraceyS/FL said:
No they won't.

If 5% at Target isn't enough to get them to leave their rewards CC behind, then 3% won't do it either.

I deal with this every time I go to work. I hear it, they aren't "excuses" they are just the facts. 5% is not worth getting a red card for - and we have debit or credit.....

But 3% isn't going to cut it today.... nope.
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Exactly.

There are a million offers of this or that incentive card programs, and most consumers pick one to focus on and max out their rewards from.

3% is not especially competitive these days, especially with a card that isn't universally accepted.
 
Tinmania said:
Actually I am.
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Oh, cool! Do you work for one of the billing vendors, like Amdocs or Oracle, or one of the major payment processors? Either way, we probably have mutual contacts.

Tinmania said:
You are thinking of their system as a generic debit/credit processing system when it is not. It doesn't have to consider if Jane Doe from Nebraska bought fuel in Florida and Georgia the day before at Joe's mini mart and Texaco. Or if perhaps she spent $2,000 on watercraft rental. She won't be doing that with this system.
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It is a payment system for retail that debits your bank account. It IS a debit card processing system, and should be developed and managed like one. If someone uses it to buy cigarettes from CVS in GA in the morning and groceries from Walmart in CO in the afternoon, it will need to catch that.

It is also being presented as a tool for affinity programs. This means that it will also have to track point balances in real time. It will also have to rate in real time at the time of purchase.
 
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