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AH! It DOESN’T exist. And, going from today’s reality to “something else”, would be what’s commonly referred to as a “new feature”.
A new feature is when you add something, removing limitations is not adding anything. You know they can do this without even needing to update iOS? Simply provide everyone a free or paid certificate that can be used for mass app distribution without limitations
 
You bought something knowingly with limitations in it's use. You have a 14 day window to return if said device didn't suit your requirements. My point was that a resourceful person could figure a way around those limitations and do whatever they wanted to with iphone hardware (or microwave hardware)
Artificial limitations on hardware shouldn't be allowed, that's the point I'm trying to convey. It's one thing when I'm trying to do something that doesn't work but another when it would work if they didn't put an unbypassable barrier on it.
 
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Artificial limitations on hardware shouldn't be allowed, that's the point I'm trying to convey. It's one thing when I'm trying to do something that doesn't work but another when it would work if they didn't put an unbypassable barrier on it.
Whether it should be allowed or not, Apple has a bunch of limitations in place. One could try to sue. Get legislators to write laws that forbid it, etc. But I can just image the hue and cry when one has to load their own firmware on a microwave.
 
Fair enough. Kinda defeats your argument though. Since we are still talking about you wanting to do something that requires modifying Apple's code.
At the first sight yes, why bother installing a new OS when I could buy another phone? It's deeper than that. If I can install another OS, there's nothing preventing me from installing a modded iOS. I'd be breaking the TOS, but I'm not breaking a law doing that, and I'm doing it anyway when jailbreaking.
 
Artificial limitations on hardware shouldn't be allowed, that's the point I'm trying to convey. It's one thing when I'm trying to do something that doesn't work but another when it would work if they didn't put an unbypassable barrier on it.
Artificial? Are you claiming a secure boot change has no legitimate purpose?
 
Whether it should be allowed or not, Apple has a bunch of limitations in place. One could try to sue. Get legislators to write laws that forbid it, etc. But I can just image the hue and cry when one has to load their own firmware on a microwave.
I'm not a lawyer nor do I live in the US, so I don't know what's legal or not, I'm arguing purely from how I think things should be
 
Artificial? Are you claiming a secure boot change has no legitimate purpose?
Its purpose is preventing you from loading untrusted code. Which I should be able to do on my hardware.

A non-artificial limitation would be trying to install software that wasn't made to work on that hardware.

In a few words, if the software supports the hardware, I should be able to install it.
 
At the first sight yes, why bother installing a new OS when I could buy another phone? It's deeper than that. If I can install another OS, there's nothing preventing me from installing a modded iOS. I'd be breaking the TOS, but I'm not breaking a law doing that, and I'm doing it anyway when jailbreaking.
Installing a modded version of iOS is certainly a violation of copyright law unless it fall under specific fair use exceptions.
 
Its purpose is preventing you from loading untrusted code. Which I should be able to do on my hardware.

A non-artificial limitation would be trying to install software that wasn't made to work on that hardware.

In a few words, if the software supports the hardware, I should be able to install it.
You're playing with words a bit there. You are obviously aware of security benefits of preventing untrusted code from running. Improving security isn't "artificial".
 
Distributing is, if I mod it myself it isn't
Nope. There is no fair use exemption for modifying copyrighted software for personal use. You can create copies of software you own for personal use. But you don't have the right to modify it.

 
You're playing with words a bit there. You are obviously aware of security benefits of preventing untrusted code from running. Improving security isn't "artificial".
Maybe "artificial" is not the right word to convey my message? Maybe "active limitation" is better? When something would work but there's a barrier that prevents it to, then "active", if the software doesn't work because it wasn't designed to run then "passive", in other words it's not the fault of the hardware designer.

Regardless of wording, I think you get the point.
 
Nope. There is no fair use exemption for modifying copyrighted software for personal use. You can create copies of software you own for personal use. But you don't have the right to modify it.

Why is jailbreaking legal if jailbreaking modifies Apple code (without distributing Apple code)?
 
Name a company that has 60% share of a particular market within which there are only two major players, and wouldn't be considered as having a dominant position or monopoly power?
Historically, there has never been a company that has only 60% share of a particular market within which there are only two major players where legal action was taken based on their “dominant position”. Apple would be the first IF it goes forward.

Just thinking about the marketshare thing… If Apple were to restrict sales of the iPhone in the US such that it drops below 40%, then all the lawsuits would drop, right?
Unless that grocery store (chain) happens to own/control 60% of commercial land in the U.S., it's not the same thing.
No, it’s the same thing. I can understand how, for the point you’re attempting to make, it would be very convenient if it weren’t the same thing. But, for purposes of bringing forth legal action, in the history of both “monopoly power” and “dominant position” it is indeed the same. Which is why, since their inception, no legal action had been taken against Apple until recently.
 
Maybe "artificial" is not the right word to convey my message? Maybe "active limitation" is better? When something would work but there's a barrier that prevents it to, then "active", if the software doesn't work because it wasn't designed to run then "passive", in other words it's not the fault of the hardware designer.

Regardless of wording, I think you get the point.
I understand your point, but I disagree with it. I don't think Apple should degrade the security of their product, so you can hack it to work how you want. Especially since it's pretty clear what you want is to modify their IP to work how you want. :p
 
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I understand your point, but I disagree with it. I don't think Apple should degrade the security of their product, so you can hack it to work how you want. Especially since it's pretty clear what you want is to modify their IP to work how you want. :p

It wouldn't degrade security, it would make it optional. If you don't want it, don't use it. (Before you tell me "what if someone steals my phone and installs a modified iOS to steal my data, simple solution, require the passcode before the user is able to disable security)
 
Yes, like “adding-sideloading-that’s-not-like-the-current-sideloading-but,-instead-a-different-sideloading-that’s-the-kind-of-sideloading-a-particular-user-likes”.
Removing the 7 day limitation doesn't make it a different kind of sideloading. Sideloading simply means installing apps outside the centralized store. With or without limitations, it's still sideloading.
 
Why is jailbreaking legal if jailbreaking modifies Apple code (without distributing Apple code)?
Jailbreaking isn't legal for most use cases. However, there is a specific DMCA exemption to allow jailbreaking in order to install apps that would otherwise work except for the DRM. Jailbreaking to modify iOS is still illegal. Strangely, the exemption only applies to smartphone, not tablets.
 
It's about the iOS apps market

It's essentially both but really being driven by Apple's dominant position in the mobile OS market.

I find it similar to the Microsoft DOJ case in the 1990s which wasn't so much about browsers but rather the desktop OS market which MS dominated and their (alleged) anticompetitive behavior related to Windows access, restrictions, etc. of things like alternative browsers.

In the Apple situation here, it's about the mobile OS market in which Apple has a dominant position and their alleged anticompetitive behavior related to iOS access, restrictions, etc. of alternative app stores.

If Microsoft only had 20% share of the desktop OS market, there wouldn't have been a case. If Apple only had 20% share of the mobile OS market, there wouldn't be a case here.
 
Jailbreaking isn't legal for most use cases. However, there is a specific DMCA exemption to allow jailbreaking in order to install apps that would otherwise work except for the DRM. Jailbreaking to modify iOS is still illegal. Strangely, the exemption only applies to smartphone, not tablets.
Lol, modifing iOS not a use case, jailbreaking IS modifing iOS. Jailbreaking can't work without modifying iOS. The moment you click jailbreak you're modifying iOS. It can't be that hard to understand.
 
It's essentially both but really being driven by Apple's dominant position in the mobile OS market.

I find it similar to the Microsoft DOJ case in the 1990s which wasn't so much about browsers but rather the desktop OS market which MS dominated and their (alleged) anticompetitive behavior related to Windows access, restrictions, etc. of things like alternative browsers.

In the Apple situation here, it's about the mobile OS market in which Apple has a dominant position and their alleged anticompetitive behavior related to iOS access, restrictions, etc. of alternative app stores.

If Microsoft only had 20% share of the desktop OS market, there wouldn't have been a case. If Apple only had 20% share of the mobile OS market, there wouldn't be a case here.
You've said multiple times there wouldn't be a lawsuit if this or that, but in my eyes it's still unfair even if they had 20% of the mobile market and 100% of the iOS apps market
 
Lol, modifing iOS not a use case, jailbreaking IS modifing iOS. Jailbreaking can't work without modifying iOS. The moment you click jailbreak you're modifying iOS. It can't be that hard to understand.
Correct. The exemption gives you permission to modify iOS (aka jailbreak) for the specific purpose of bypassing DRM requirements on apps.
 
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