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rubberducker

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Nov 5, 2017
26
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Whilst I’m happy there is a patch for my new i9 - the thing i find most depressing is Dave Lee’s video. It shows all these YouTube Influencers are all for sale.


Look at his words carefully, you can smell the script has been vetted by Apple’s PR, with some minor criticisms of Apple negoiatied back in by Dave to save his creditablity. Yuk. Its all so dishonest.

Take everything you see on YouTube with a HUGE Grian of salt. These guys are all just another source of advertising for these large companies.
 
I don’t think he has any affiliation with Apple or “bought off”. I think he is just horny that Apple reached out to him.
 
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He has definitely been reimbursed (!) for his time - and this is how all influencers make money. Look at the change in his tone, language and rhetoric - his script and delivery have definitely been vetted by Apple’s PR. Anyone in marketing can see it a mile off.

I get it, we all need to earn money, its just the lack of honesty that riles. And YouTube is rife with it - all these guys are FOR SALE. But some of them are just more honest about it.
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I personally find conspiracy theorists like you depressing.
You clearly don’t understand how YouTube INFLUNCERS make money.

Ignorance is depressing.
 
Yeah, I don't see it. He explicitly says the MacBook Pro is the least powerful of the six laptops in front of him. That doesn't sound like Apple marketing speak to me. If any praise is obvious evidence of being paid off, and any criticism is obviously just trying to salvage his credibility, then it sounds like you've already predetermined how you want to interpret it.
 
Just watched the video, doesn't seem scripted - reads very similar to other of his video's. I mean it seems obvious he will create a sequel to his original video given that Apple had directly contacted him. I also don't see Apple as the kind of company who would even pay Dave Lee for his time, but only he can confirm that.
 
Just watched the video, doesn't seem scripted - reads very similar to other of his video's. I mean it seems obvious he will create a sequel to his original video given that Apple had directly contacted him. I also don't see Apple as the kind of company who would even pay Dave Lee for his time, but only he can confirm that.
If they’d paid him with anything it would be something like a hotel booking for the stay of the next keynote and a front seat, that way he would automatically promote them by vlogging about his experience.
 
He mentions how Apple denied that this addresses the VRM issue that's on reddit (and here), and after seeing my results, I tend to agree. I'm happy Dave is pleased with his i9, but at the risk of beating a dead horse, I'd rather see better temps then eek out the last bit of performance, that's just me.
 
The big Corps are paying all these guys to promote their products. You think Unbox Therapy does his thing because he buys all that stuff? Or do you think he takes a fee to feature a certain product that week?

Its much cheaper and effective for corporations than traditional advertising - and most users think it seems more authentic than a normal commercial. These influencers are hitting huge numbers of potentials buyers - its no conspiracy- its the simple economics of the market.
 
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He’s generally very good at balancing criticism with praise, I don’t feel this video is an exception to that
 
He mentions how Apple denied that this addresses the VRM issue that's on reddit (and here), and after seeing my results, I tend to agree. I'm happy Dave is pleased with his i9, but at the risk of beating a dead horse, I'd rather see better temps then eek out the last bit of performance, that's just me.

Yep. I am not a logic board expert - but some have mentioned that due to how hot the VRM becomes, the longevity is potentially affected.
 
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Yep. I am not a logic board expert - but some have mentioned that due to how hot the VRM becomes, the longevity is potentially affected.
Definitely and that has me a bit worried, which is why I'm using the Volta app. I have it set to 30 watts, and right now on battery (I'm traveling today), I'm seeing 35c for temps. I'm more pleased with that, as my tasks today are needing to remotely access my work station so CPU cycles is not really needed
 
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Hired by apple PR..are you high? He is telling the result a ton of other people got and reported after the patch. What, the marketing now is to do a horrible job on day one and fix it on day two? :D that has never worked for anyone.
And looking at his different tone - well of course it is different, as we (humans of planet Earth) usually use different tones for when we are complaining about something and when we are praising something.
 
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Its much cheaper and effective for corporations than traditional advertising - and most users think it seems more authentic than a normal commercial. These influencers are hitting huge numbers of potentials buyers - its no conspiracy- its the simple economics of the market.

OF COURSE that’s how it works. Thanks Sherlock...

Where you’re wrong is in claiming this de-facto means there is a lack of honesty in these kind of reviews. Certainly there could be, but is is not necessary the case. Go to any big YTer channel and most have a video breaking down how they choose to partner with sponsors and what proportion of their income is based upon those sponsorships. Judge for yourself. FWIW, I think you’re being pretty unfair to Dave.
 
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Yep. I am not a logic board expert - but some have mentioned that due to how hot the VRM becomes, the longevity is potentially affected.

Definitely and that has me a bit worried, which is why I'm using the Volta app. I have it set to 30 watts, and right now on battery (I'm traveling today), I'm seeing 35c for temps. I'm more pleased with that, as my tasks today are needing to remotely access my work station so CPU cycles is not really needed

Unless your seeing the VRM throttling signature the load is expected to be normal. VRM"s are extremely durable and designed for high fluctuations in load, although flipping from full Turbo down to 800Mhz and back to full Turbo is pushing it...

In short if the VRM's do become too hot they will just throttle back.

Q-6
 
In short if the VRM's do become too hot they will just throttle back.
I'd rather not deal with the high temps. I understand it will throttle back but that's not acceptable to me.

With using the Volta app, I'm on battery this morning as I'm out and about, and I'm seeing temps in the mid thirties, and tbh, I'm tickled pink at seeing that. My task list today is rather low key so I'm not looking to push the laptop and its running cooler then my 2012 machine right now.
 
I'd rather not deal with the high temps. I understand it will throttle back but that's not acceptable to me.

With using the Volta app, I'm on battery this morning as I'm out and about, and I'm seeing temps in the mid thirties, and tbh, I'm tickled pink at seeing that. My task list today is rather low key so I'm not looking to push the laptop and its running cooler then my 2012 machine right now.

It's perfectly fine, especially of you don't need the full performance on tap continuously. My W10 primary has a TDP Down feature which accomplishes the same without nixing the Turbo. Switching PL-1 from 45W to 35W (CPU long-term steady state)

Q-6
 
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OP of the original post here :)

Regarding Dave Lee's second video ... I will admit that I am a bit disappointed in the comment of "Apple said that the reddit post was wrong". Anyone who was paying attention pre-patch could plainly see what was happening, and anyone who looks now can compare the Cinebench scores which I stated in the original post to the Cinebench scores people are getting with Apple's release. Anyone can also take my Intel Power Gadget graphs which are timestamped on imgur, and compare it to what you see on your own machines, and see that the graphs look remarkably similar. Obviously, I was, at least, very close to right.

To me, it felt like Dave's comment there came off like "I was the one person outside of Apple who was involved in this viral issue, and was the sole hero in helping Apple figure out what went wrong". I think Dave did have a key role in this story, bringing it to mass attention. He was also less right than I was in his first video -- he basically said this was CPU thermal throttling, and the system could only meet the stated performance goals if the machine was in a freezer. Obviously, from what *everyone* knows today, that is not true. Anyone who thinks that Apple could only debug this because Dave Lee told him what camera settings he used, is a fool.

I sort of half-wish that I made the announcement using a Youtube video, rather than a reddit post, but, here we are.

The one thing which I was probably wrong about that I probably should have figured out before I posted, is that this issue was actually happening elsewhere in the power delivery system, not the VRM. It would have been more accurate to call it "Power Throttling" -- and the main point really was that it was clearly not a CPU Thermal throttling issue. I'm sure at this point that people are going to be saying "VRM Throttling" for years now about this 2018 MBP -- so I can just cringe every time I read it :)

As far as the rest of the tone -- I think most people are here ultimately because they are to some extent an apple fanboy. Myself included. Was I disappointed in Apple at the time that I posted the original work -- of course. Has my viewpoint evolved today? Yes.

Definitely and that has me a bit worried, which is why I'm using the Volta app. I have it set to 30 watts, and right now on battery (I'm traveling today), I'm seeing 35c for temps. I'm more pleased with that, as my tasks today are needing to remotely access my work station so CPU cycles is not really needed

In my opinion, there's no need to worry about longevity with Apple's patch in place -- Certainly no more than you might have with a 2017 or 2016 MBP, and I haven't heard of any problems with people blowing up power components of those systems.

If you want to use Volta just to keep the system cooler while it's on your lap, or get slightly better battery life while traveling, that's a valid use case -- but I honestly would feel bad if you felt that you had to neuter the full potential of your system all the time because of what I posted. In fact, that was contrary to the point of what I posted, and why the settings I suggested allowed for full turbo for 8 seconds.

I am personally very much enjoying how my system can turbo up and for burst workloads is much faster than my 2013 Mac Pro with a 6-core Xeon.
 
that's a valid use case -- but I honestly would feel bad if you felt that you had to neuter the full potential of your system all the time because of what I posted.
No, your information did not color my opinion or moved me to be overly cautious. I've long held the philosophy that computers that are constantly near the threshold temps may have longevity issues. The CPU/GPU are just one piece of the puzzle, there are other components that will be incurring the heat which may be a bit more sensitive to heat then the CPU/GPU. I'm sure my opinion is against the grain for many people and that's fine.

I'm more then happy with the performance of my MBP, Its faster then my iMac and old 2012 MBP and with using Volta, I have a nice balance of performance and heat. I'm not computing the mass of the universe of decoding the genome of the woolly mammoth, so I don't need that much cpu power :D
 
No, your information did not color my opinion or moved me to be overly cautious. I've long held the philosophy that computers that are constantly near the threshold temps may have longevity issues. The CPU/GPU are just one piece of the puzzle, there are other components that will be incurring the heat which may be a bit more sensitive to heat then the CPU/GPU. I'm sure my opinion is against the grain for many people and that's fine.

I'm more then happy with the performance of my MBP, Its faster then my iMac and old 2012 MBP and with using Volta, I have a nice balance of performance and heat. I'm not computing the mass of the universe of decoding the genome of the woolly mammoth, so I don't need that much cpu power :D

The CPU is not the concern, more the surrounding components which will fold far sooner. More to the point Thermal Shock where mechanical stress is incurred due to rapid and or continuous temperature cycling with associated significant Delta.

Some notebooks employ a 3rd fan for this reason to reduce temperature of VRM's, Cap's etc as in general the primary cooling system is a closed loop inclusive to the CPU & dGPU. All electronics are graded & rated, nor do consumer grade come close the top of the pile. A consumer grade component may be rated to 80C -100, Mil Spec 150C, special purpose 175C, just like Apple higher you go by far the more you need to pay in magnitudes :p

By cutting Turbo your not only reducing the operating temperature, also the maximum permissible current draw, which makes sense as some applications will pull as much as possible. Games are a good example as very few indeed benefit from a Hex core CPU running a full Turbo with often the base frequency being more than enough, even on a quad core.

Q-6
 
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