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Just to clarify, I read somewhere that the new 256GB Samsung SSD is MLC. What I don't understand is the (unconfirmed) price...

SanDisk is coming out with a 240GB SSD (MLC) for an agreeable $499 in mid-2009. Here is what the SanDisk website says...

"SanDisk G3 SSDs stand to get five times as fast as the fastest 7,200 RPM HDDs, clocking in at up to 40,000 vRPM(2,5) and anticipated sequential performance of 200MB/s read and 140MB/s write4.
Three key features developed by SanDisk enable this exciting performance: ExtremeFFSTM, a new SSD algorithm, allows random write performance to potentially improve by as much as 100 times over conventional algorithms; reliable 43nm multi-level cell (MLC) all bit-line (ABL) NAND flash; and SanDisk’s new SSD controller, which ties together the NAND and the algorithm."
 
SLC is better. When an SLC dies you can still read from it to recover data. When an MLC dies you can neither read or write to it so the data is lost. SLC drives cost a lot more though, usually at least twice as much than a same sized MLC.

When either drive dies, you will need to desolder the chips and mount them on another device to read them. SLC just means there is only 1-bit per cell which means less room for error. As you know cells use voltages, so with only 2 voltages, it's hard to get it wrong; with MLC it's at least 4 voltages if not more, so the higher you go, the more error prone the drive is. Don't forget when you change data in 1 cell, you affect all the bits; with SLC, if you have data to write to a specific set of cells, you only affect the information you need; with MLC you may affect other information the same cells—if you write another piece of data to the same cells, you are using the same cells twice, which equates to extended and greater wear on the cells themselves.

So Apple's option is $500 more ($900) total, and you get something that's worse? :(

Not really surprised. It is Apple, after all. I just didn't know this about these things about SSDs until I read these posts.
 
Just a quick question: regular HDD's last from 2-4 years before failing, how about SSD's?

MLC has a life expectancy of 10,000 cycles of write (only write wears out in SSD drives), while the SLC cells wear out after 100,000 cycles.

Anyways the intel guarantees that their x25-m's (MLC) controller are so efficient at erase/writing that they guarantee more than 100gb writes per day for 5 years.

I probably write to my SSD drive 100gb once every couple of weeks so just do the math! :D

Here is the full article/review and explanation if your interested:

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/intel/showdoc.aspx?i=3403&p=4
 
Haha I can't wait for someone to say that it's worth it to pay 500$ more for the SSD, just because OS X is that much better. Or that it's magical Apple built components..

Cmon, you know you want to say defend this...

Who cares? You can upgrade your Mac after anyway. Buying directly from Apple is stupid.
 
Who cares? You can upgrade your Mac after anyway. Buying directly from Apple is stupid.

Tell that to the people who buy anything but the lowest end barebones model of any Apple product. The add-ons are so marked up it's not even funny.
 
Who cares? You can upgrade your Mac after anyway. Buying directly from Apple is stupid.

Yes if it is the 15", what about the 17"? Isn't the fixed battery obstructing
the HD, making it impossible to swap drives at home?
 

I'm sure they'll survive - for a while. It's just that a company can only suffer so many quarters/years of losses. At some point, something has to happen. Dell's not been doing well for a couple of years now, and Apple has passed them in market value. Apple continues to go up, Dell continues to go down. Dell's laid off a lot people in the last year or so.
 
man transfer speed is fast as hell from my intel x25-m SSD via firewire 800 to my external 1tb hdds.

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Surprised? Don't you remember the price of "apple" memory with the hardware in the previous generation?

Don't even tell me about it :| I bought my current MacBook late of '07 and I didn't do enough research on those prices, so it ended up being around 2,500$ for 4GB RAM and 250GB HDD. While the base price was what, 1,300$? But now I've learned, and before I buy anything Apple related I always check for cheaper places :p (like AppleCare on eBay).
 
I also really hope that there can be two people found on this forum. One with the 256 GB SSD and one with the new MBP SSD. Then they can tell us which uses what :p Isn't the MBP supposed to be shipping like in a couple days? :eek:
 
How does anyone know this? Are you looking at the SSD option in the MBA? Does anyone have the new 17" upgrade option yet?

If the new 17" MBP comes with a SSD it has to be GSkill, Super Talent, FileMate, or Samsung.

So far, those are the only brands with a 256 SSD drive out. Of course this is constantly changing really fast, so by the time you read this there might be more out. However, I think Apple will be sticking with a major manufacturer/supplier instead of smaller one which in this case will probably be Samsung (I'm just speculating on this however.)

Now, all of those 256 SSDs are in fact MLC. The reason is that since MLC technology is cheaper, it makes more sense to manufacture and then sell drives with such technology instead of the way more expensive SLC.

That's why (so far) you will only see lots of SSDs with higher storage capacities but with MLC technology, and only a few SLC drives with small storage capacity.

I also would like to restate, in a broad and simpler sense, a few things already said:

It is true that MLC technology is cheaper than SLC, but it is also slower and more prone to errors (which accounts for its reduced lifespan compared to SLC). That's why MLC is used more. However, high quality manufacturers such as Intel and Samsung have been developing better drive controller circuits for their drives with better algorithms for better and more efficient cell use. This dedicated development from those manufacturers plus high quality MLC NAND flash memory allow their drives to perform and last nearly as well as SLC drives but with the benefit of being cheaper.

With that said, if your new 17" MBP comes with a 256 GB Samsung SSD you can rest assure that it is gonna perform really good.

Oh, and by the way, there is only one 256 GB SSD drive from Samsung so far, and it's of course MLC. This means that if Dell is offering a 256 GB Samsung SSD for $400, and you paid Apple $900 for a 256 SSD, and your MBP comes with a Samsung, then yep you got ripped off. However, if your MBP comes with another brand like the ones I mentioned before, then you got ripped-off even harder because those drives cost right now around $500 at newegg.com and wont perform as fast as the new Samsung drive.

Sooooo.... my recommendation for those who already ordered their new 17" Macs would be to cancel their orders if they still can and then make a new one but this time select the cheapest hard drive and then wait until Samsung makes its new drive available for retail.

Like some said before... Always build the most basic Mac available then buy your upgrades somewhere else. And for that guy who said that the new 17" MBP can't be upgraded because of its non-replaceable battery let me tell you that, while it wont be easy, it will be possible. You can try to figure out how to disassemble your mac yourself, but if you are too lazy or you don't want, then you can wait until someone figures it out and post it on internet as a guide or as a video on youtube.

I used to have a 24" - 3 ghz iMac which (apparently) you cannot upgrade its hard drive. However, with the help of one of a ton of guides on internet, I was able to change its cheap 500gb with a new faster Velociraptor (albeit smaller in capacity). Later, when I decided to sell it, I followed the same guide again to extract my Velociraptor and replace it with the stock 500gb drive.

If this sounds too complicated for you, or you are too lazy, or you just have tons of money to burn, then I guess paying the $900 that Apple ask you to hand them will not be a problem at all.

How do we know this? Well my friend, there is a plethora of information all over the internet. For starters, I recommend you google as your new best friend. There is also wikipedia which will give you a general idea, and then if you want to delve deeper you can go to anandtech.com or to tomshardware.com

There are plenty of other sites with more detailed information, I just gave you some points to start.
 
I'm sure they'll survive - for a while. It's just that a company can only suffer so many quarters/years of losses. At some point, something has to happen. Dell's not been doing well for a couple of years now, and Apple has passed them in market value. Apple continues to go up, Dell continues to go down. Dell's laid off a lot people in the last year or so.

I'm not a financial expert, but I looked up their page on wikipedia and it appears that theyre making money. They have a net income of a couple billion dollars (which, incidentally, has increased, as has the revenue). Looks fine to me? :confused:
 
I'm not a financial expert, but I looked up their page on wikipedia and it appears that theyre making money. They have a net income of a couple billion dollars (which, incidentally, has increased, as has the revenue). Looks fine to me? :confused:

I'm sure they'll be around for awhile. They just get nothing but bad news - declining profits, lying to their customers, etc. You know, the usual things that happen when a company is on the decline.
 

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