Department of Justice and FTC Looking Into Beeper iMessage Controversy

[5232152]

Then license it. No reason Apple should have to give it away.

License what? RCS is an open standard. You think Apple is not already using open source code or standards?

 

[BuffaloTF]

Geeze the requirements for this to work , just use an iPhone. As someone stated on here, if you want an open system buy an android, we all have that choice, but personally I like the Apple walled garden. I equate this whole fiasco to having a BJ's membership and demanding that Costco let you shop in their stores 🤷‍♂️

Seems a step further than that, no? Both those memberships come with a fee to be a member. They're charging monthly for Beeper Mini... Apple does not charge. So in my eyes it's more like selling a Costco or BJ's membership to then say we'll let you shop at Target with it. I can just go to Target on my own.

 

[ozaz]

And there are sms apps on the App Store

Which apps? My understanding is the only iOS app allowed to handle SMS is Apple Messages. If you're referring to apps like WhatsApp, FB Messenger, Signal etc - those aren't using SMS.

 

[I7guy]

Which apps? My understanding is the only iOS app allowed to handle SMS is Apple Messages. If you're referring to apps like WhatsApp, FB Messenger, Signal etc - those aren't using SMS.

My carrier has an app in the App Store whereby I can send messages (not iMessages) point being so there are ways to send sms from an iPhone other than from messages.

 

[EM2013]

Agreed. And if we put 1% of the effort to tackle ISP monopolistic practices that are actually harmful that would be great. I shouldn’t need to move to get something other than Spectrum that goes down every week for hours.

And I bet there will be a price hike for hbo max coming not long after

 

[sideshowuniqueuser]

For those who are on the side of Apple and wants to keep iMessage on their iPhones... need to understand that allowing iMessage on Android benefits you (shocker!).

You won't have to be concerned about "oh, they have an Android... I don't care to message them." Look at the data from teenagers and especially in the dating world. It removes that barrier. And I know you might be wondering... well, there's plenty of other messaging platforms to exchange messages with for Android users.

But the issue is that most iPhone users IN THE US... gravitate toward iMessage. If we (in the states) can agree to move to a cross-platform messaging app... this whole situation would be mute.

I'm not in the US, so don't have to suffer this insane Android "racism", but if I did live in the US, I would be drawn to an Android as a way of filtering out shallow people from my life. If they don't want to know me because of the phone I use, then good, saves me the trouble of working them out.

 

[sideshowuniqueuser]

That's Apple's proprietary system. If they wanted it open to others, it would be. They don't, so it won't be. It's that simple.

Well, clearly the DOJ doesn't agree that it's simple. But hey, maybe you are a lot smarter than them

 

[sideshowuniqueuser]

This isn't Apple using their size to put another company out of business; this is them stopping someone from trying to backdoor themselves into a proprietary system.

Whatever your opinion of whether Apple should support iMessage on Android or not, going about it this way was never going to work in the end.

Correct. However, if Apple wasn't so anti-competitive about iMessage, then attempts like this would never occur. Beeper has successfully done it's job of highlighting the issue enough to tip it over the edge into the DOJ's hitlist.

 

[DakotaGuy]

Correct. However, if Apple wasn't so anti-competitive about iMessage, then attempts like this would never occur. Beeper has successfully done it's job of highlighting the issue enough to tip it over the edge into the DOJ's hitlist.

Yes and Apple will respond they plan to integrate RCS into Messages which will have similar features as iMessage when an iPhone and Android phone text each other. Like I've said as an Android user I'd prefer to be able to use the stock Google Messages app and have full featured texting regardless of platform. RCS with SMS fallback does that. A standalone iMessage app doesn't.

 

[ozaz]

My carrier has an app in the App Store whereby I can send messages (not iMessages) point being so there are ways to send sms from an iPhone other than from messages.

What's it called? I haven't managed to find any app other than Apple Messages that's able to send or receive SMS on iPhone.

 

[bcortens]

Correct. However, if Apple wasn't so anti-competitive about iMessage, then attempts like this would never occur. Beeper has successfully done it's job of highlighting the issue enough to tip it over the edge into the DOJ's hitlist.

Beeper is stealing from Apple.
They are using apples server time and Apple is incurring maintenance and support costs on behalf of beeper users.

iMessage isn’t required for cross platform messaging, it isn’t some backbone feature of the internet (like an ISP). It’s a messaging protocol that provides some creature comforts to iPhone users.

If beeper wins this it essentially means that companies are allowed to steal from other companies…

 

[mookc1]

Apple won't license iMessage.

And they don't have to. That is where the negotiation needs to go. Apple implements SMS. Apple can talk to Android and vice versa. No need for a bunch of left wing lawyers and special interest groups in trying to force a company to give away tech.

 

[mookc1]

License what? RCS is an open standard. You think Apple is not already using open source code or standards?

RCS isn't what this is about. This was about iMessage and the iBeeper servers. I am not saying that RCS shouldn't be included or at least an app the the USER deccides to download. USER CHOICE. Not government mandates.

 

[1129846]

And they don't have to. That is where the negotiation needs to go. Apple implements SMS. Apple can talk to Android and vice versa. No need for a bunch of left wing lawyers and special interest groups in trying to force a company to give away tech.

Minus the fact Apple sms is of lower quality than Android to Android sms and iMessage. It is gimp and runs intentionally at low quality.

 

[mookc1]

Is there an alternative? Yup! Send an email. And BTW, you can encrypt it too. You just need to follow RFC 8551 or 9052, regardless, encryption methods have a standard.

Bottom line, Apple developed iMessage, it is far superior to whatever android has AND Apple gets to decide where to deploy.

It will be interesting to see where the RCS debate heads.

 

[MNGR]

You mean like drug patents?
According to the US government they should be given away even though the companies spent billions to develop them

 

[DakotaGuy]

Minus the fact Apple sms is of lower quality than Android to Android sms and iMessage. It is gimp and runs intentionally at low quality.

Apple has already stated they plan to fix this in 2024.

 

[Radon87000]

And they don't have to. That is where the negotiation needs to go. Apple implements SMS. Apple can talk to Android and vice versa. No need for a bunch of left wing lawyers and special interest groups in trying to force a company to give away tech.

SMS is an archaic standard which needs to die. I am satisfied Apple implemented RCS which all but resolves this issue but at the end of the day, it's the lawyers and the politicians in the EU who forced Apple's hand here.

It's incredible that in 2023, if an Android user wants to talk to an iPhone user, you can't send high quality images and Group chat features don't work.

Even with USB C, lawyers had to save the day.

I really don't get what Apple was so insecure about. If they have to rely on a messaging app to keep users on their platform, maybe iOS just isn't as great as they make it out to be

 

[Radon87000]

Is there an alternative? Yup! Send an email. And BTW, you can encrypt it too. You just need to follow RFC 8551 or 9052, regardless, encryption methods have a standard.

Bottom line, Apple developed iMessage, it is far superior to whatever android has AND Apple gets to decide where to deploy.

It will be interesting to see where the RCS debate heads.

iMessage isn't even used anywhere outside the US. On what grounds is it superior to Signal, WhatsApp, Telegram etc.

If iMessage was superior, the entire world outside the US would have adopted it by now.

 

[Radon87000]

My carrier has an app in the App Store whereby I can send messages (not iMessages) point being so there are ways to send sms from an iPhone other than from messages.

The messaging experience feels like we are in the 1990s in that case.

 

[mookc1]

iMessage isn't even used anywhere outside the US. On what grounds is it superior to Signal, WhatsApp, Telegram etc.

If iMessage was superior, the entire world outside the US would have adopted it by now.

I wasn't comparing iMessage to Signal, WhatsApp, Telegram etc, these are third party apps that are available for both platforms. I just said that it was superior to whatever Android has.

 

[Radon87000]

I wasn't comparing iMessage to Signal, WhatsApp, Telegram etc, these are third party apps that are available for both platforms. I just said that it was superior to whatever Android has.

That's precisely what I am questioning. There is nothing iMessage offers which these third party apps cannot do. On what grounds is it superior.

 

[I7guy]

That's precisely what I am questioning. There is nothing iMessage offers which these third party apps cannot do. On what grounds is it superior.

Don’t care if it’s superior or not. Use what you want, just leave it alone.

 

[I7guy]

The messaging experience feels like we are in the 1990s in that case.

Being in the 1990s is retro.

 

[MrSkoTA]

Then there's something fishy about Apple's claim about end to end encryption. I can use PGP/gpg+email over _public_ networks and keep the encryption.

I imagine spoofing UUIDs is what does it?