did apple solve keyboard issues for MBP 2016

[Hook87]

Hey guys,

the MBP 2016 had some serious issues for some people regarding the keyboard. Many people had problem with clicking sounds (which is not so serious but can be annoying) but also many had the problem that the keys remained sticked in etc. I personally had a lot issues with my keyboard but they somehow resolved on their own because they likely were caused by dust particles. However, sometimes they return and can remain again and not always you can resolve it with blowing air.

One issue that is always reproducible for me:

When my MBP turns warm, some keys always make loud clicking sounds. I planned to lead this fix by apple as soon as they have more control over the keyboard issues.

My questions is:

Do you know if apple fixed their problems with the keyboard so that the chances are very high I will get a good keyboard back? because I do not want to risk having to replace it several times or get again a keyboard with some issues. Because I paid 3000 Euros so this really has to work...

Also does anyone know what gets replaced? Do they replace the whole cover or only the keyboard? I know that for they 2013 Macbook they even replaced the battery.

If that would be the case it might be smarter to wait until shortly before the guarantee is over because the functionality is not impaired by that problem currently...

Best regards

 

[Poki]

From reports I heard, Apple will replace the whole top part of the case with the one from the 2017 model. This might help, however the failure rate is still higher due to the Skylake CPUs running a little hotter than Kaby Lake in certain situations.

 

[eddjedi]

1) There is no 2017 MBP keyboard, it's the same as the 2016 MBP keyboard
2) You can't demand something won't break, a million dollar Bugatti Veyron can break down just like any other car, throwing money at something doesn't guarantee you won't have issues
3) My 2016 MBP keyboard works just fine

 

[maflynn]

1) There is no 2017 MBP keyboard, it's the same as the 2016 MBP keyboard

Actually Apple is fixing them by adding a shim and the 2017 keyboards have this updated design, its not the same keyboard - at least that's the opinion of many people including myself (clarification: I don't own either). The number of keyboard failures in the 2017 appear to be less then that of the 2016 model - at least to my very unscientific observation

2) You can't demand something won't break, a million dollar Bugatti Veyron can break down just like any other car, throwing money at something doesn't guarantee you won't have issues

No, but by paying such a high amount for your Bugatti or MBP, you should expect not getting a product with a design flaw.

3) My 2016 MBP keyboard works just fine

That's good news, but sadly it seems many people are not so lucky. Just because you don't have hte issue, means the problem does not exist.

 

[eddjedi]

There is an iFixit teardown which proves it is identical. I'm not going to post the link again because I've already posted it approximately seven thousand times, every time somebody else says there is a 2017 keyboard.

 

[Hook87]

lol... https://9to5mac.com/2017/06/08/fixit-2017-macbook-and-macbook-pro-teardown/

 

[eddjedi]

One interesting tidbit is that the 2017 12-inch MacBook has seen an upgrade to the more responsive second-generation butterfly keyboard design. This change comes following a growing number of complaints from MacBook users concerning the original keyboard. The second-generation butterfly keyboard originally debuted with the 2016 MacBook Pro

It says that the 12" Macbook (NOT Macbook Pro) now has the second generation butterfly keyboard as found on the 2016 Macbook Pro. In other words the Macbook has a new keyboard in 2017, the Macbook Pro does not.

 

[Hook87]

It says that the 12" Macbook (NOT Macbook Pro) now has the second generation butterfly keyboard as found on the 2016 Macbook Pro. In other words the Macbook has a new keyboard in 2017, the Macbook Pro does not.

Read the full ifixit article...The 2017 has almost no changes but the keyboard is one of the changes...

So if poki is right, maybe then I could get the newer keyboard. And regarding the comment that you dont have any issues. Good for you...

 

[eddjedi]

No it doesn't, read it again. MACBOOK.

The only real change, beyond fan coloration, seems to address the lackluster keyboard action from last year’s MacBook. Users now inherit the more-responsive, second-gen butterfly key switches already found in last year’s MacBook Pro with Touch Bar.

 

[Hook87]

No it doesn't, read it again. MACBOOK.

https://ifixit.org/blog/9185/2017-apple-laptop/

they talk about both macbooks and I also read the ifixit article about the mbp 2017. They do not mention that the keyboard is the same...So you are doing some good work here by posting a link thousands of times that u never read urself...
[doublepost=1514909370][/doublepost]https://www.reddit.com/r/apple/comments/6hwsj7/macbook_pro_2017_keyboard_is_much_better_than_2016/


here is another link...

 

[eddjedi]

As the saying goes, you can't argue with stupid

 

[Hook87]

yeah the saying of your link right? I stop wasting time with commenting on this haha. Thanks everyone...

 

[eddjedi]

That's good news, but sadly it seems many people are not so lucky. Just because you don't have hte issue, means the problem does not exist.

Context is important. Half a dozen people on here have had problems with their keyboards. I agree, that is unfortunate for those people. But it shouldn't result in the amount of scare mongering I'm seeing on this forum, mostly by people like yourself that don't even own one. I am simply saying that I have one and it works, so I feel it's important to give a balanced view as if people take this forum a bit too literally nobody would buy one.

 

[maflynn]

Half a dozen people on here have had problems with their keyboards.

Its more then 6 people and a simple googling shows a lot of other people on other sites are reporting issues/

so I feel it's important to give a balanced view a

Nothing wrong with providing a balanced view, I fully understand that many owners, probably the majority have no issues, but yet there are many people who are. The issue cannot be cast aside as ramblings of a 6 people and a bunch of non-owners.

 

[eddjedi]

Yep, you can do that for just about any Apple product. Here's the 2011 Macbook Pro keyboard:

 

[OriginalAppleGuy]

As someone who has been involved in enterprise hardware support for a number of years and has been to manufacturing facilities of vendors suppling hardware, it would be difficult to back up anything eddjedi is saying. Manufacturers have stated to me they make manufacturing changes all the time when they receive feedback from their support organization. Many times, those changes are not broadcast. Many times, they are not seen by customers or people like iFixit as eddjedi seems to be so fixated by.

My take is the second 2016 version had changes made to the keyboard and the 2017 model had further changes. There could have even been changes made in between. Maybe not major changes, but changes to improve reliability all the same.

In another thread an individual stated their 2016 MacBook PRO (15") keyboard was replaced with a 2017 model. How did he know? The labeling on the keys was the same as that on the 2017. Of which, iFixit noted those changes as "They now mark keyboard shortcuts rather than translating for PC users." So to the OP, it would seem there is a high probability the whole top of the laptop will be replaced if you seek service and they find fault with your keyboard.

To say there have been no changes to the original 2016 keyboard is just plain ignorance of manufacturing design processes/lifecycles.

 

[mj_]

In another thread an individual stated their 2016 MacBook PRO (15") keyboard was replaced with a 2017 model. How did he know? The labeling on the keys was the same as that on the 2017.

That's not true, they are very easy to tell apart because the labeling is different between the 2016 and 2017 model.

2016: CTRL key says "control" at bottom, OPTION key says "option" at the bottom and "alt" at the top.
2017: CTRL key now says "control" at the bottom and has a ^ symbol at the top, OPTION key says "option" at the bottom and has a ⌥ symbol at the top.

I just got my 2016 MBP nTB back from its third keyboard repair in 8 months, and they've finally decided to honor me with a 2017 keyboard instead of the 2016 keyboard I've had before.

 

[New_Mac_Smell]

I think there was a minute manufacturing change on the 2017 compared to the 2016 (Both still identified as gen 2). Regardless of having or not having problems, I don't think anyone has gotten to the bottom of what causes it in the first place. There's wild speculation everywhere which usually boils down to an Apple fanboy argument. But I and many others have had zero issues with the 2016 keyboards so to say there is a design flaw or defect is premature, there could be a certain manufacturer of the keys themselves which were defective - and have now been removed from the supply chain. Perhaps it's heat or certain use cases, there's very likely a large degree of paranoia about it, but I haven't seen any evidence that the keyboard issues have decreased as there's still plenty of people with a 2017 complaining. So it's not like they've fixed whatever the inherent issue is.

Quite honestly my personal take is on the metal keycaps themselves, under heat it could affect the properties of it causing it to ever so slightly bend/flex in a different way, causing it to 'pop'. Keys getting stuck though is often just a result of ingress, which can usually be solved by cleaning the thing. To say it should never require any attention is just silly, and complaining on the internet, taking it all the way to an Apple store just to have them spray it with compressed air is also silly. But that's just subjective speculation which we can all do.

Anyway, if it's a genuine fault they get repaired just fine. I wouldn't stop myself using it just for the off chance of possibly sticking once in a blue moon though, and as I said zero issues with mine.

 

[Hook87]

thanks mj_ for your experience. When was your last repair when you still got the old one? Because I wonder if that is the new standard procedure or if they only do it occasionally....

 

[maflynn]

Yep, you can do that for just about any Apple product. Here's the 2011 Macbook Pro keyboard:

I'm not looking to win an argument. I'm of the opinion that there is an issue, you don't think there is, other then 6 people. I'll step away at this point, as its quite evident that nothing I say or produce will alter your opinion.

Regards

 

[mj_]

@Hook87:

Last keyboard replacement was in July 2017 and even then some people were already getting the 2017 keyboards while I got a 2016 replacement. It's hard to tell whether they finally ran out of 2016 keyboards or whether they still have some in stock somewhere and I just got lucky.

Either way, it doesn't matter to me anymore. I'm getting rid of that PoS MBP with its keyboard that is defective by design and have reverted back to a 2015 model.

2016 MBP i7/8GB/512GB with brand-new 2017 keyboard and brand-new battery, anyone?

 

[Falhófnir]

Anyway, if it's a genuine fault they get repaired just fine. I wouldn't stop myself using it just for the off chance of possibly sticking once in a blue moon though, and as I said zero issues with mine.

If only it was that simple. Apple’s solution is, due to the design of the machine, to replace the whole topcase - that is not an insignificant amount of money if you are out of warranty.

 

[New_Mac_Smell]

If only it was that simple. Apple’s solution is, due to the design of the machine, to replace the whole topcase - that is not an insignificant amount of money if you are out of warranty.

True, but I meant design defect as people throw around. As in if the design is defective then the product is defective at launch, so there will be something around that. Anyway the 2016's are just coming to the end of the warranty period so we'll see what happens over the next few years.

 

[OriginalAppleGuy]

That's not true, they are very easy to tell apart because the labeling is different between the 2016 and 2017 model.

2016: CTRL key says "control" at bottom, OPTION key says "option" at the bottom and "alt" at the top.
2017: CTRL key now says "control" at the bottom and has a ^ symbol at the top, OPTION key says "option" at the bottom and has a ⌥ symbol at the top.

I just got my 2016 MBP nTB back from its third keyboard repair in 8 months, and they've finally decided to honor me with a 2017 keyboard instead of the 2016 keyboard I've had before.

That's what I said. The keyboard he received on his 2016 was the same one they install on the 2017 as denoted by the key differences you repeated. But I can see how you may have read that wrong.

 

[mj_]

Darn... you're right I misread that... my bad.