Do you think kids today are spoiled?

[Macaddicttt]

I read an article the other week about how parents today "just want their kids to be happy" whereas practically no one fifty years ago would have made that the number one priority for their kids.

I think this truly is a generational shift. It's a result of increased prosperity where kids don't really need to work that hard to get a good job (the former wish of parents for their kids). Since that part is much easier, they focus on the "happiness" thing.

Unfortunately "happiness" turns out to mean "getting and doing whatever they want." Kids put emphasis on values less and less, but instead focus on "happiness" which translates in most cases to "material/physical happiness." Of course this isn't true of every kid, but it is indicative of the generation. You can see it empirically in the huge rise in cheating in school and small theft among kids (from stores, from friends, from parents, etc.).

 

[11800506]

I feel that in some senses people who say that this generation is spoiled are simply overlooking the kids who aren't spoiled and just seeing those that are. Not every kid these days is spoiled and I know that is not the point being made but I feel that it is all stereotyping. I'm sure that every generation has had spoiled people, those that rely on their parents and when they get into the real world they are the ones who are poor. I work very hard to get good grades, and I behave well and so my parents pay for some of the things I own, but I also have worked to buy things I've wanted (like my eMac for example). I don't take for granted everything that I have and I appreciate what my parents do for me. I feel that often, the people who aren't spoiled are overshadowed by those who are, thus creating the impression that the entire generation is spoiled. I remember my dad told me that when he was my age, the previous generation worried how the then current generation would turn out, and while the world isn't perfect, it turned out alright. It's one of those things where the previous generation believes that the current generation is spoiled. It's happened with almost every generation before, and will continue to happen. It is not something new.

(I'm 15 by the way)

 

[dmr727]

Like badandy mentioned - it's all just a sliding scale anyway. I do feel the level of douchebaggery tends to scale linearly with a sense of entitlement, but one person's douche is another person's frat brother.

 

[JavaWizKid]

I'm 15 and I think some kids are spoilt with expensive electronics, however there are some tech geek kids around that can only fulfill their interest by purchasing expensive electronics that they make full use of (like me). I think they should pay at least half if they are going to claim it's theirs. I just hate the way some kids get everything paid for them when they don't work for them, and most of all don't use the gadget to its full potentia so the gadget is wastedl!!! For my MacBook Pro I had to save up a LOT of my money to split half the price with my dad and his donation was my birthday present and some of my Christmas money.

 

[No1451]

Some are, some aren't.

I wasn't(21 now), everything I had that was more than I NEEDED, so anything aside from food, clothes and a place to sleep. My xbox, tv and computer were all bought and paid for by myself. Pretty sure I enjoyed them more for it.

 

[Mitthrawnuruodo]

Do you think kids today are spoiled?

No, not at all...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfFav34KDz4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5jxvEs3hYk

 

[.Andy]

I read an article the other week about how parents today "just want their kids to be happy" whereas practically no one fifty years ago would have made that the number one priority for their kids.

I can tell you 100% percent that parents have always wanted their kids to be happy.

 

[uiop.]

No, not at all...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfFav34KDz4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5jxvEs3hYk

It's those types of kids who cause these threads to start.

I'm trying not to get too involved in this conversation because I'm just a kid, and my opinion doesn't matter. Yeah, yeah I get it.

I'm 15. My parents purchased me a $2400 MacBook Pro in May...I was beyond happy with it. I then sold it and upgraded to the new MacBook Pro last month, the difference will be paid by myself. I maintain a GPA of 3.7+ regularly, I have an iPhone 3G as a result. My sister is living free of monthly rent in Manhattan as a full-time chef, my other is attending Purdue University, completely free of charge to her. My dad emphasizes work ethics to an extreme, by no means am I "lazy" nor do I expect things to be given to me. I've seen his success in his businesses, and I strive to live up to him one day.

My question is this. When you "older" folk (I can't believe there are 18 year olds ranting about "kids" in this thread.) were younger and your parents had the resources to pay for your stuff, would you have accepted it? I highly doubt you would have said "No mom, I don't think I should have that, let me do some more chores first." I think not. If your parents can pay for your college education, would you not accept it? If your parents buy you a new BMW, are you going to make them return it to the dealer?

</end thought, kids say the darndest things>

Glad I left everyone speechless.

 

[Macaddicttt]

I can tell you 100% percent that parents have always wanted their kids to be happy.

Perhaps, but it was never the number one concern of parents they way it is today. My number one concern for my kids would be to be a good person. Happiness would follow. People these days put the horse before the cart and focus on the "happiness" part and not the "be a good person" part.

I found a link to the article I was talking about. I never usually agree with this guy, but I found him to be right on with this one.

 

[.Andy]

Perhaps, but it was never the number one concern of parents they way it is today. I found a link to the article I was talking about. I never usually agree with this guy, but I found him to be right on with this one.

I think the article is splitting hairs a bit. Cooper (who is publicising her self-help book in the article) asserts that "wanting to be kids happy" is somehow circumventing and providing the quick way to happiness through purchasing things for them.

I think you'll find with most parents "wanting their kids to be happy" means letting them pursue any lot in life that they wish. Not being forced into a specific occupation, not being forced to play specific sports, not being forced to conform to antiquated social norms (i.e. embracing their sexuality, pursuing their own spirituality, travelling, growing their hair how they like, getting tattoos). This means pursuing their own happiness. And this is by no means mutually exclusive to being a capable, responsible, and mature individual. Representing "wanting their kids to be happy" as buying them anything they want is disingenuous and condescending and patronising towards parents. I can bet that of all the parents on these boards, not a single one would claim they think the route to their children's happiness is through buying them stuff. Parents on the whole are far more intelligent and savvy than the article gives them credit.

 

[Macaddicttt]

I think the article is splitting hairs a bit. Cooper (who is publicising her self-help book in the article) asserts that "wanting to be kids happy" is somehow circumventing and providing the quick way to happiness through purchasing things for them.

I think you'll find with most parents "wanting their kids to be happy" means letting them pursue any lot in life that they wish. Not being forced into a specific occupation, not being forced to play specific sports, not being forced to conform to antiquated social norms (i.e. embracing their sexuality, pursuing their own spirituality, travelling, growing their hair how they like, getting tattoos). This means pursuing their own happiness. And this is by no means mutually exclusive to being a capable, responsible, and mature individual. Representing "wanting their kids to be happy" as buying them anything they want is disingenuous and condescending and patronising towards parents. I can bet that of all the parents on these boards, not a single one would claim they think the route to their children's happiness is through buying them stuff. Parents on the whole are far more intelligent and savvy than the article gives them credit.

I agree that Cooper's remarks don't apply to all parents, but I think that poor parenting in the way that Cooper describes and that is being discussed in this thread is leading to the measurable, undeniable increase in the percentage of people, children in particular, who are obese, thinking cheating is okay, and think that occasional stealing is okay.

I think that making "happiness" the end goal of parenting is wrong, and while some parents manage to do it okay and produce good kids, the average person probably doesn't. Why isn't "raising good kids" the number one goal of parents? Why is it "happiness"? You're quick to point out that having happiness as the number one goal doesn't necessarily lead to bad kids, which means you definitely give it some value, if not view it as essential to good parenting. Then why isn't it the number one goal for parents?

EDIT: And Cooper isn't publicizing a book in the article. The author of the article is merely referencing it.

EDIT 2: And while no one probably sees buying their kids stuff as the route to their children's happiness, many do end up going that route because they don't want their kids to be upset. It's not as if parents say, "I want my kid to be happy; I'll buy them an iPod." It's more like, "My kid is so upset that I didn't buy him an iPod. I can't stand him being angry with me and upset; I guess I should buy him that iPod."

 

[mikeyredk]

Voa

I was checking on what the kids wanted and I saw more then one wanted Wii games… seriously who is going to buy these kids video games… clothing i can see but video games… (if you where wondering they were pokemon games… wow those things wont' go away…)

I did my part I picked up a guitar for some kid it was on sale it was only $50 on woot.

 

[FF_productions]

Yes we are spoiled compared to previous generations. In the future when our generation gets older, we will look at the younger generation as spoiled and how hard we had it. I think that's one way of looking at it.

 

[.Andy]

poor parenting in the way that Cooper describes and that is being discussed in this thread is leading to the measurable, undeniable increase in the percentage of people, children in particular, who are obese, thinking cheating is okay, and think that occasional stealing is okay.

Is there any evidence that there's been a statistical increase in the proportion of kids that think cheating or stealing is OK?

As for obesity that's across the whole population. It's not a parenting problem. It's a problem of the whole of western society, which no matter what our weights are, includes you and me.

I think that making "happiness" the end goal of parenting is wrong, and while some parents manage to do it okay and produce good kids, the average person probably doesn't.

Who makes happiness the end goal of parenting? You're reading it far too literally. I doubt that any parent that says they "just want their kids to be happy" means that they want to provide their kids happiness at the expense of all other social skills and endowing them with a proper education to pursue that happiness on their own.

I completely and utterly agree with you that happiness being the only goal of parenting doesn't work. However this is a strawman we could both knock over with no effort. There would be very few, if any parents that would believe this. I'd wager that you couldn't find me a single one.

Why isn't "raising good kids" the number one goal of parents? Why is it "happiness"?

I'm not sure that when parents say they want their kids to be happy they mean it at the detriment to being a good kid. Do you seriously think that parents try to raise their kids to be anything other than "good" (as they see it)?

"Good" is also a rather vacuous and subjective word. Who's to say that a parent's idea of "good" is any better than what their adolescent/young adult's idea of "good" is? To use a current example kids are far more likely to be accepting of the civil rights of homosexuals. That's a "good" that they largely didn't learn from past generations.

You're quick to point out that having happiness as the number one goal doesn't necessarily lead to bad kids, which means you definitely give it some value, if not view it as essential to good parenting. Then why isn't it the number one goal for parents?

I'm not sure what you're arguing here . Having a happy kid and "good" kid are by no means mutually exclusive. In fact as you point out they are considerably synergistic.

 

[Macaddicttt]

Is there any evidence that there's been a statistical increase in the proportion of kids that think cheating or stealing is OK?

I probably should have provided this earlier (you can find this article at multiple sites):

Link

Who makes happiness the end goal of parenting? You're reading it far too literally. I doubt that any parent that says they "just want their kids to be happy" means that they want to provide their kids happiness at the expense of all other social skills and endowing them with a proper education to pursue that happiness on their own.

I completely and utterly agree with you that happiness being the only goal of parenting doesn't work. However this is a strawman we could both knock over with no effort. There would be very few, if any parents that would believe this. I'd wager that you couldn't find me a single one.


I'm not sure that when parents say they want their kids to be happy they mean it at the detriment to being a good kid. Do you seriously think that parents try to raise their kids to be anything other than "good" (as they see it)?


I'm not sure what you're arguing here . Having a happy kid and "good" kid are by no means mutually exclusive. In fact as you point out they are considerably synergistic.

Saying, "I just want my kid to be happy" is making happiness of the kid the end goal of parenting in my book. My point is not that to say that parents want their kids to be happy to the detriment of being a good person. My point is that in the end, a lot of parents focus solely on the "happy" part, not recognizing that, "If I scold my kid now, he'll be a happier, better person in the future." A lot of parents see their kid pouting, can't stand it, and immediately bend to the kid's ever whim, thinking that it's serving the kid's happiness. And really, "I just want my kid to be happy."

Parents don't want their kids to be happy at the expense of other goals, but focus on the "happiness" part and think they're failing as a parent if their kid is upset for just a minute. "Aww... You're crying because you didn't get ice cream? I'll buy you some even though it's bad for you and you had some earlier."

I am by no means saying that wanting your kid to be happy is not a noble goal, but like all noble goals, it gets watered down and twisted by a large part of society. Many people are too short-sighted to see that instant happiness now does not equal actual happiness. It's like credit card debt. No one wants to have credit card debt and know they'd be happier without it in the long term, but they can't put off buying that huge TV they can't afford. Similarly, a kid would be better off and happier if his parents saved to send him to college and got him a good education so he gets a good job, etc., but can't put off buying their kid a new phone every year and a new computer and a car, etc.

 

[.Andy]

I probably should have provided this earlier (you can find this article at multiple sites):

Link

I read this a few days ago. There are two problems with the survey that I can see. Firstly it doesn't give you any historical data (except 2004 and it doesn't give you any idea of the error of their calculations). It by no means answers any question of kids behaviours in the current day compared with the past. You've no data to back up your assertion of an "undeniable increase". It also was carried out by an institute that supplies ethical services to schools. i.e. Not to be too flippant about it but institute does survey that finds out that it's services are required in schools. I wouldn't give that any weight at all unless it is verified by an impartial third party. Just as I wouldn't statistical research in any field.

Saying, "I just want my kid to be happy" is making happiness of the kid the end goal of parenting in my book.

Which is a simplistic literal reading. It's a strawman.

My point is not that to say that parents want their kids to be happy to the detriment of being a good person. My point is that in the end, a lot of parents focus solely on the "happy" part, not recognizing that, "If I scold my kid now, he'll be a happier, better person in the future." A lot of parents see their kid pouting, can't stand it, and immediately bend to the kid's ever whim, thinking that it's serving the kid's happiness. And really, "I just want my kid to be happy."

"A lot", "a lot", "a lot". These are just weasel words to push your perception. "A lot" isn't a number. It's a argumentative device designed to give your opinion weight when you can't back it up.

Again you're throwing up strawmen arguments in this paragraph. Parents saying "they just want their kids to be happy" by no means infers that they do not scold or chastise their kids for bad behaviour. The two are by no means mutually exclusive. You can scold and chastise your kids, educate them and give them the tools to succeed in life, and give them the range to pursue their own happiness where they see fit.

Parents don't want their kids to be happy at the expense of other goals, but focus on the "happiness" part and think they're failing as a parent if their kid is upset for just a minute. "Aww... You're crying because you didn't get ice cream? I'll buy you some even though it's bad for you and you had some earlier."

This is the worst strawman yet. This is bad parenting no matter who does it. And your assertion that it's done by parents who want their kids to be happy is indefensible. As I explained in a previous post parents that say "they want their kids to be happy" usually aren't referring to buying them whatever they want whenever they want. They are referring to giving their children the range to pursue happiness wherever they want to in life. The sport they want to play, the occupation they want to pursue, the country they want to live in etc.

Many people are too short-sighted to see that instant happiness now does not equal actual happiness.

I'm not sure what this has to do with parenting. Again this is pervasive across the whole of society. Again neither you or I are exempt from this.

Similarly, a kid would be better off and happier if his parents saved to send him to college and got him a good education so he gets a good job, etc., but can't put off buying their kid a new phone every year and a new computer and a car, etc.

Have college applications dropped off lately because parents have spent too much money on phones, computers, and cars for their kids?

 

[Macaddicttt]

Which is a simplistic literal reading. It's a strawman.

No, it's not a strawman since I've seen this "simplistic literal reading" in practice in the ways I describe below. Of course it doesn't fit everyone, but to deny it any merit just because not everyone thinks of it this way doesn't make any sense.

"A lot", "a lot", "a lot". These are just weasel words to push your perception. "A lot" isn't a number. It's a argumentative device designed to give your opinion weight when you can't back it up.

Again you're throwing up strawmen arguments in this paragraph. Parents saying "they just want their kids to be happy" by no means infers that they do not scold or chastise their kids for bad behaviour. The two are by no means mutually exclusive. You can scold and chastise your kids, educate them and give them the tools to succeed in life, and give them the range to pursue their own happiness where they see fit.

You seem to be arguing merely that there can be no opinion of the general merits of parenting in the US/Western World. This is no research paper, I didn't do the statistical analysis, and yes, this is mostly anecdotal. That doesn't mean I can't have an opinion. I'm not going to start drafting legislation based on it, but I see no reason why I cannot hold my opinion that is based on my own observations. Maybe the pervading thought in parenting 50 years ago was regarding happiness is exactly the same as it is now, maybe not. In my experience I've never seen or read anything from 50 years ago that ever expressed "I just want my kids to be happy" in any way shape or form (that's not to say it doesn't exist).

But it is still my opinion that it's a bad idea for people to go around saying and thinking, "I just want my kid to be happy," because it is open to misinterpretation and distorting, especially by the uneducated and by kids themselves. I also feel as though the number of utterrances of "I just want my kids to be happy" per year has been on a steady increase over the past fifty years. Yes, I know I don't have statistical evidence to back it up, but this isn't a scholarly research journal, but a discussion board where it's nice to discuss things, not just shoot down anyone's opinion just because they haven't done a proper statistical analysis of the entire population.

 

[.Andy]

You seem to be arguing merely that there can be no opinion of the general merits of parenting in the US/Western World.

Not at all. However you appear to be misinterpreting "wanting their kids to be happy." (and also a reminder that you've made assertions that go far beyond "opinion" and into the realm of fact so don't try and back away from scrutiny)

I'll put it to you again. When parents say they want their kids to be happy they mean that they wish to give their kids the autonomy (where possible) to pursue their own happiness in life. To pursue their own education, to pursue their own dreams, to pursue their own sport, to pursue their own occupation, to pursue whatever. This is by no means to the detriment of any other part of making them whole, intelligent, responsible, "good" human beings.

Your assertion is that when parents say they want their kids to be happy they mean that they'll buy them whatever they want at a whim to keep them happy in the short term without any consideration for the long term consequences (see your ice-cream anecdote). I've no beef at all that this is the wrong way to parent (or approach anything), but it is largely something that you've completely synthesised to maintain your rage. You'd be hard pressed to find a single parent that adheres to this parenting philosophy.

 

[iJohnHenry]

I can tell you 100% percent that parents have always wanted their kids to be happy.

Yes, and so did mine. And I earned everything I wanted.

It's Society that interferes in the manner of the up-bringing. I never spoke back to my parents, ever.

Have we improved on that model lately?? I think not.

 

[Macaddicttt]

Not at all. However you appear to be misinterpreting "wanting their kids to be happy."

I'll put it to you again. When parents say they want their kids to be happy they mean that they wish to give their kids the autonomy (where possible) to pursue their own happiness in life. To pursue their own education, to pursue their own dreams, to pursue their own sport, to pursue their own occupation, to pursue whatever. This is by no means to the detriment of any other part of making them whole, intelligent, responsible human beings.

This might be true for you.

You're assertion is that when parents say they want their kids to be happy they mean that they'll buy them whatever they want at a whim to keep them happy in the short term without any consideration for the long term consequences (see your ice-cream anecdote). I've no beef at all that this is the wrong way to parent (or approach anything), but it is largely something that you've completely synthesised to maintain your rage. You'd be hard pressed to find a single parent that adheres to this parenting philosophy.

And this is how some people act. It's not a "parenting philosophy" and it probably mostly applies to people who don't have a "parenting philosophy." The very fact that you're talking about "parenting philosophies" shows that you're way ahead of a lot of people. (I know I've said "a lot" again, but I don't have any numbers about how many people are advanced enough to think about "parenting philosophy"; heck, if you were to ask the question, "Do you have a parenting philosophy?" you've already tainted the results by implanting the idea in their head.)

My point is that there are a lot of idiots out there, and when they think, "I just want my kid to be happy," a lot of bad things can happen. I have personally seen people use that excuse for buying their kid something expensive or unhealthy. I don't know how indicative that is of society, but it does seem like a pervading idea and problem.

P.S. And I have no "rage." If anything, I'm just a little frustrated with your responses. I feel like we're not really arguing about anything meaningful.

 

[leekohler]

My nieces and nephews get very spoiled by the whole family. We're always buying them things. My niece and her Mom came up last summer and I think I bought her one of everything in the city. Kids are great as long as you can give them back.

 

[Melrose]

Yes, and so did mine. And I earned everything I wanted.

It's Society that interferes in the manner of the up-bringing. I never spoke back to my parents, ever.

Have we improved on that model lately?? I think not.

+1.

oh, crud. There I go again...

 

[Plymouthbreezer]

Let's see, I have two DSLRs, lots of lenses, a MBP (and aside from the MBP and iMac G4 in my sig, the other computers and D50 were purchased with money I made working taxable jobs), a nice car, iPods, a cell phone, good clothes, money for coffee and food, etc... I even contribute to my college loans and give to charities. Gasp.

I pay my own insurance ($2,200 a year) and all of my gas. While I was given my car and MBP, most all of my other "luxuries" have been self provided. I work my butt off to afford it all, but I'm happy in the process. Since January 1st of 2008, I've made $9,760.90 in taxable income while a full time student (And probably another $3,000 or so "under the table" from art sales and photography); pretty good for an HS senior/college freshmen.

The use factor also comes into play... I use my car, computer, and cameras for work and schooling, so they are worthy investments. For work, I spend a lot of time in a vehicle, so having a comfortable, large sedan makes sense... I make more money on photography, thus the DSLRs, and my MBP, well, that's a basic for college thesedays. If I was a lazy videogame playing 18 yearold, it'd be a different situation.

Anyway, that's my defense, seeing as I got lumped into a cohort of "spoiled" brats.

Have college applications dropped off lately because parents have spent too much money on phones, computers, and cars for their kids?

No, but, more familes are in debt than ever before... Which can probably be attributed to this overspending on their kids before they even get to college.

 

[GfPQqmcRKUvP]

I don't begrudge the kid (this was you, I presume)

No, it was not me.

But you're kidding yourself if you think it doesn't affect the kid's personality somewhat.

It might, it might not. Some kids have nice things and don't develop a sense of entitlement.

Yes, and so did mine. And I earned everything I wanted.

I'm sure you were given things as a child that other kids in the world did not have access to. You can romanticize the past all you want, but the simple fact is that what you see as excessive might be par for the course now days, and all that matters is the attitude the child takes when being given nicer things than someone else.

Did you earn toilet paper? Did you earn a meal every night? Well guess what, there's a kid out there who doesn't have those things who tried to earn them just as well.

 

[sangosimo]

kids mature alot faster now then before imo.