should and would are two very different thing.
AT&T is not known for doing something that benefit the customer at the cost of its profits.
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Carrier Do you want AT&T, Verizon and Sprint to adopt T-Mobile uncarrier strategy?
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should and would are two very different thing.
AT&T is not known for doing something that benefit the customer at the cost of its profits.
I think it should be illegal to carrier lock phones, and they should be line items on the bill that get dropped off once the contract is done with. But AT&T and Verizon make tons of easy cash off people who don't upgrade as soon as they can and keep paying the subsidized rate.
We've been on AT&T for years, and they were a better deal when they had yearly iPhone upgrades at the normal $199 price. Now they are $450 'early upgrades'. But I don't think their rates are that bad if you account for the subsidy built into their pricing. We pay $145 a month in mobile share, and if you take off $40 because we got iPhone 5's for $199 it comes out to $55 a line (2 lines $110) with unlimited talk, text, and 4GB shared which is enough for us most of the time. $55 is not really that bad considering they have great coverage, tethering is included, and we can upgrade or downgrade our mobile share data at will.
I am currently testing a T-Mobile SIM because we decided to get unlocked 5S so we could keep our options open, and for travel. I also wanted to see for myself what their coverage was like, and so far 95% of the time I've gotten LTE. Their pricing model is better but I think coverage scares people off. We need the competition though. If the US is stuck with only 2 carriers who actually can build a good network, and attract customers we're going to be screwed in the long run. Competition is what drives down prices and keeps carriers somewhat honest. So far that I'm willing to give T-Mobile a shot...but I admit if I get screwed because of coverage it is what it is, and we'll have to stick with AT&T. I keep my AT&T sim in my wallet with a SIM tool just in case.
We've been on AT&T for years, and they were a better deal when they had yearly iPhone upgrades at the normal $199 price. Now they are $450 'early upgrades'. But I don't think their rates are that bad if you account for the subsidy built into their pricing. We pay $145 a month in mobile share, and if you take off $40 because we got iPhone 5's for $199 it comes out to $55 a line (2 lines $110) with unlimited talk, text, and 4GB shared which is enough for us most of the time. $55 is not really that bad considering they have great coverage, tethering is included, and we can upgrade or downgrade our mobile share data at will.
I am currently testing a T-Mobile SIM because we decided to get unlocked 5S so we could keep our options open, and for travel. I also wanted to see for myself what their coverage was like, and so far 95% of the time I've gotten LTE. Their pricing model is better but I think coverage scares people off. We need the competition though. If the US is stuck with only 2 carriers who actually can build a good network, and attract customers we're going to be screwed in the long run. Competition is what drives down prices and keeps carriers somewhat honest. So far that I'm willing to give T-Mobile a shot...but I admit if I get screwed because of coverage it is what it is, and we'll have to stick with AT&T. I keep my AT&T sim in my wallet with a SIM tool just in case.
What you're saying about how it effects people who upgrade often isn't necessarily a plus for AT&T like you argue. You have to wait 2 years minimum with AT&T to receive the subsidized pricing. T-Mo people can upgrade whenever they want, they just have to pay off the phone. I am switching to T-Mobile and I can assure you my bill is 20% cheaper per month even with the monthly phone payment included (which is payed off in 2 years). And the iPhone is $100 down, rather than the "$200" total price you pay at the beginning of a 2 year contract. You can consider paying off the rest of the phone when you want to upgrade early on T-Mobile as equivalent to paying a cancellation fee before your 2 year contract ends on AT&T OR not paying the subsidized price (If I remember correctly the iPhone was like $450 if you wanted to upgrade before 2 years).
EDIT: I did the calculations. Considering that I am paying 20% cheaper per month for my service + phone payment, if I increased my monthly phone payment so that my overall monthly T-mobile bill was the same as what I'm paying with AT&T, I would have my phone cost payed off in <1.5 years. It is actually more beneficial to go the T-Mobile route if you want "early upgrades".
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I don't think you understand how T-Mobile works. You pay $100 down for the phone and pay the rest of it off interest-free in monthly installments for up to 2 years (how fast or slow you want to pay it off is up to you). Your monthly plan + monthly phone payment combined will still be significantly cheaper (15-20%) than AT&T/Verizon. So what you are saying here is completely irrelevant. I think the problem is purely psychological, people hate the idea of spending $600 on a phone, but they don't realize that the overall cost with AT&T/Verizon (although they sell the phone for $200) is SIGNIFICANTLY more expensive. Not only that, you get more freedom, and after you pay off your phone, you don't have to pay for an inflated cell phone bill that steals money from you because of subsidized phone pricing.
I agree. The AT&T/Verizon duopoly over 700 MHz spectrum band towers needs to end. The government needs to allow T-Mobile, Sprint, and other carriers to bid on these spectrums so that there can be competition. Without competition, we all get screwed in the end because AT&T/Verizon can charge whatever they want since the other networks can't create equivalent coverage areas. It is IMPOSSIBLE for a carrier like T-mobile to cover more rural or even ALL suburban areas if they aren't allowed to use the 700 MHz spectrum.
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Let's say what you were saying was somehow true (not sure how you can prove this, but we do know for sure that AT&T/Verizon/Sprint inflate their monthly service plans to cover the cost of subsidized phones and even probably interest too -- what would prevent them from collecting interest either?). The fact that I am paying about 20% less monthly for my service + phone payment still holds.
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Doesn't AT&T already have this with their prepaid plans? I gave my wife my out-of-contract iPhone 4s and put her on a $60/mo. prepaid plan, so no contract, unlimited talk & text, 2GB data per month. Is $60/mo. a good price for this considering I own the phone outright and it's unsubsidized?
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Why is that the only advantage? Think about it this way, if you save $20 a month, and use that $20 to pay off your phone faster, you will be able to upgrade your phone probably about 6 months faster (1.5 years) rather than 2 years like AT&T.
i've priced out a 4 line family plan on t-mobile since i'm on AT&T now. once you add in the extra data past 500MB and the phone payments its the same price as AT&T. the interest is in the price of their service which should be cheaper.
For me, that's not the case and I find it hard to believe that the pricing is the same if you do not consider special discount codes for where you work. Other people on this thread have already established that it is in fact cheaper. We must be receiving different rates for each carrier (which is probable and not surprising). I suggest each person do the math depending on a family or single (whichever type of plan they have) and compare. If the price is significantly cheaper than AT&T, and your area has T-Mobile coverage, it's only a plus to go the T-Mo route. And even if it doesn't work out for you, this cellular model represents transparency and reduces the likelihood that more money will be taken from you by a carrier. I find it bizarre that so many people are against this model, America is the only country in the world that does the cellular model the way it is today. AT&T, Verizon, & Sprint do not practice in this way to benefit the consumer, they do it to make more money. In Europe, and the rest of the world they are all laughing at us right now. The consumer protection laws in Europe and other places would make AT&T and Verizon's business practices in the US illegal. I can't believe many people on this forum do not understand that, and even further advocate for this bunk model we have now that screws over the consumer and increases profits for these companies.
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You conveniently say "you just have to pay off the rest of your phone"... the iPhone 5S right now is $149.99 down with $20.83/month phone payment for 24 months ($499.92) = ~$650 (just checked their website for my zip code, that's the price). Ok, you can trade in your phone every 6-months (or year) to pay off your old phone... but you still have to pay the phone down payment again and keep with your monthly phone payments. so, trade your phone in twice a year, that's $300/yr in down payments (assuming the iPhone 5S price above) plus your $20.83/month in phone payments ($20.83x12=$249.96). that's ~$550/year (just on the phone) if you get a new phone twice a year (~$400/year for yearly upgrades). not that bad of a deal if you really want 2 new phones (or even 1 phone) a year, but still a lot of money to have "freedom" (i.e. monthly phone payments). Here's how it works for me... buy the $200 subsidized phone (if I for some reason hang on to a phone for 2 years). or, use for a year, sell for ~$450, buy a new one at the early upgrade price of $450... If I buy a phone again in another year, it's just $450 (but I've sold the previous year's model again for $450 before buying). This model works for me. The best thing is being able to sell your used phone for nearly the same amount as an early upgrade priced phone.
Also, my AT&T bill comes out to ~$163/month AFTER taxes (and after discount) for my wife and I to share 10GB of data. T-Mobiles "unlimited" plan for 2 lines, 2 iPhones (with the phone monthly payment) comes to $161.66 BEFORE taxes. I pay that price after taxes with AT&T... and guess what, I'm not limited on how much data I can tether to my devices. T-Mobile limits tethering in their plans to 2.5GB per line, AT&T doesn't. That's huge for me! Plus the better coverage of AT&T is the most beneficial reason for me to stay with them. I have much better coverage than T-Mobile (trust me, I've tried it when I owned a Nexus 4... I was on EDGE a lot when AT&T would be HSPA+). The coverage argument is a big deal for me.
I get that for some (maybe even most) people, T-Mobile works out to be cheaper than AT&T, but for me it isn't. I was merely stating that the T-Mobile case just doesn't work out for me (the coverage being the biggest issue). I did my homework, tried out T-Mobile, but in the end, AT&T wins my business. But enjoy your T-Mobile! I hope it works out for you.
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4 line t-mo plan is $215 for me including payments for 4 smart phones. plus taxes. AT&T is $220 plus taxes and includes a FAN discount.
but with AT&T and verizon i can go into best buy or another retailer which is always having sales and get a nice discount on the phone. in the end the small savings with t-mo aren't worth it to switch
i've lived in europe and i like the phone service a lot better here in the USA. Europe is tiny compared to the USA and a lot of those cheap prices they pay don't include roaming
but with AT&T and verizon i can go into best buy or another retailer which is always having sales and get a nice discount on the phone. in the end the small savings with t-mo aren't worth it to switch
i've lived in europe and i like the phone service a lot better here in the USA. Europe is tiny compared to the USA and a lot of those cheap prices they pay don't include roaming
Don't know where the claim of "interest in the service" is coming from. The service itself is already cheaper than the 3 other carriers. There is NO INTEREST on the price of the phone. It's $649 whether you finance it or pay full price upfront. So their claim of no interest is true.
I'm interested in seeing this 4 line AT&T family plan that is comparable to a 4 line Tmobile plan with 2.5GB/per line. That would equate to 10GB on AT&T's shared data plans.
AT&T: 4 Lines, 10GB Shared data - $280/mo (plus $15/GB overages if you go over)
Tmobile: 4 Lines, 2.5GB Data per line, financing 4 iPhone 5S - $220/mo (plus throttled speeds if you go over, no overages)
That $60/mo difference is a whopping $1440 over the course of 2 years. I sure can think of something better to do with that kind of money than give it to a cellular company.
People are factoring in corporate discounts as if Tmo doesn't have them as well. So those are irrelevant.
The only instance where AT&T/Verizon Share plans begin to compete with Tmobile in price is if you have several people on the plan who barely use data. That way you can get away with having several phones and a low shared data allotment. So if you're a very light data user, that may be better for you.
Now coverage is a different matter. If T-Mo coverage sucks where you live or travel then you are pretty much stuck with the overpriced duopoly. But in no way are either Verizon nor AT&T competing on price.
People in the US have been trained and conditioned to think that these phones really only cost $200 and that they are entitled to "free" or cheap phones for signing a contract. What T-Mo is doing is the way it works in most of the world and is actually far more consumer friendly than the other carriers when you really look at the math. I hope they continue to take customers from AT&T/Verizon so that they will change some of their policies as well.
I'm interested in seeing this 4 line AT&T family plan that is comparable to a 4 line Tmobile plan with 2.5GB/per line. That would equate to 10GB on AT&T's shared data plans.
AT&T: 4 Lines, 10GB Shared data - $280/mo (plus $15/GB overages if you go over)
Tmobile: 4 Lines, 2.5GB Data per line, financing 4 iPhone 5S - $220/mo (plus throttled speeds if you go over, no overages)
That $60/mo difference is a whopping $1440 over the course of 2 years. I sure can think of something better to do with that kind of money than give it to a cellular company.
People are factoring in corporate discounts as if Tmo doesn't have them as well. So those are irrelevant.
The only instance where AT&T/Verizon Share plans begin to compete with Tmobile in price is if you have several people on the plan who barely use data. That way you can get away with having several phones and a low shared data allotment. So if you're a very light data user, that may be better for you.
Now coverage is a different matter. If T-Mo coverage sucks where you live or travel then you are pretty much stuck with the overpriced duopoly. But in no way are either Verizon nor AT&T competing on price.
People in the US have been trained and conditioned to think that these phones really only cost $200 and that they are entitled to "free" or cheap phones for signing a contract. What T-Mo is doing is the way it works in most of the world and is actually far more consumer friendly than the other carriers when you really look at the math. I hope they continue to take customers from AT&T/Verizon so that they will change some of their policies as well.
How are they irrelevant? AT&T is the only cell network to provide corporate discounts for my wife and I... completely relevant to us
how do you get $280 for AT&T unless you are including taxes and not including them for t-mobile
Even better if you don't want 2.5GB data on a particular line (light data user), you can just subtract it and save $10.
Example:
Line 1: unlimited talk, unlimited text, 2.5GB data ($50 + $10)
Line 2: UT, UT, 500MB data ($30 )
Line 3: UT, UT, 500MB ($10)
Line 4: UT, UT, 2.5GB ($10 + $10)
$120 for 4 lines with unlimited talk, unlimited text and selected* data plan above.
I don't know why you brought up upgrading every 6 months. Although what you are saying could be true for that case, it's a bit extreme. I realistically like to upgrade earliest after a year or year and a half (and choose to wait it out 2 years with AT&T). You must be using some kind of fan discount. I am jealous of you. AT&T has better coverage overall and I wish they were the same price for me. I'll let you know how this T-Mobile jig pans out.
comparing a fan discounted plan to a non-fan discounted plan (t-mobile has discounts too!)...
Right on. +1
(that is, if I'm reading you and the quoted correctly)4 lines x $30 = $120
10GB data allotment = $120
total per month (before taxes) = $240
http://www.att.com/shop/wireless/data-plans.html#fbid=WACk79as1FN
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yep... I stated that in my OP that you quoted...
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comparing a fan discounted plan to a non-fan discounted plan (t-mobile has discounts too!)...
why can't I? T-Mo doesn't offer a discounted plan to me or my employer
seriously though, good luck. just don't assume what works for you works for everyone else
I know that's not the case with what I have working for me... yay for FAN discounts
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4 lines x $30 = $120
10GB data allotment = $120
total per month (before taxes) = $240
http://www.att.com/shop/wireless/data-plans.html#fbid=WACk79as1FN
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yep... I stated that in my OP that you quoted...
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why can't I? T-Mo doesn't offer a discounted plan to me or my employer
seriously though, good luck. just don't assume what works for you works for everyone else
I wasn't addressing that point to you in particular, but yeah its no problem to consider that individually to each person. However, we're trying to have an objective way to compare the plans for everyone -- it should be assumed that some people get a work discount for AT&T or a work discount for T-Mobile no problem. But for the sake of general comparison for everyone on this forum, you shouldn't use a fan discount. Like I said before, glad you're getting a great deal
I wasn't addressing that point to you in particular, but yeah its no problem to consider that individually to each person. However, we're trying to have an objective way to compare the plans for everyone -- it should be assumed that some people get a work discount for AT&T or a work discount for T-Mobile no problem. But for the sake of general comparison for everyone on this forum, you shouldn't use a fan discount. Like I said before, glad you're getting a great deal
true... but I was using the FAN reference for my use-case only, therefore being quite biased towards what works for me
(but I know what you are saying)I read that T-Mobile is starting to move grandfathered plans into more expensive plans, eliminating the grandfathered plans. I really hope AT&T/Verizon don't follow T-Mobile strategy, otherwise us grandfathered plans on AT&T/Verizon will be gone and we're forced to pay more for the plans and the phone.
I don't know about you guys but I got into a family plan and it looks like this:
Line 1 +$50 UT, UT, 500MB
Line 2 +$10 UT, UT, 500MB
Line 3 +$10 UT, UT, 500MB
Line 4 +$20 UT, UT, 2.5gb
Line 5 +$30 UT, UT, Unlimited Data (free 2.5gb mobile hospot)
So we are paying $130 for 5 lines (I used to pay $100 for just 1 line and thats with 950 minutes and 2 gig of data...wtf?) - and I get unlimited data and mobile hotspot with 2.5gig AND unlimited data and text in over 100 countries?
Thats really great even if the overseas data is slow - it's good enough for iMessage, emails, and light browsing - I don't see how you can go wrong with T-Mobile. All with no contract!
Line 1 +$50 UT, UT, 500MB
Line 2 +$10 UT, UT, 500MB
Line 3 +$10 UT, UT, 500MB
Line 4 +$20 UT, UT, 2.5gb
Line 5 +$30 UT, UT, Unlimited Data (free 2.5gb mobile hospot)
So we are paying $130 for 5 lines (I used to pay $100 for just 1 line and thats with 950 minutes and 2 gig of data...wtf?) - and I get unlimited data and mobile hotspot with 2.5gig AND unlimited data and text in over 100 countries?
Thats really great even if the overseas data is slow - it's good enough for iMessage, emails, and light browsing - I don't see how you can go wrong with T-Mobile. All with no contract!