Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
All these issues demonstrate that the "Developer" only testing strategy Apple uses is not getting the job done.

Put IO7 in the hands of several hundred average Joes, and all these problems will have been resolved long ago.

The beta was in the hands of thousands of average Joes who bought UUID slots from other developers. But rather than be constructive and report issues to Apple, most of them just complained on here about everything.
 
Visual design is always subjective, but objectively sometimes it has to change, because people get tired of it, the attraction is lost,

So in other words, 'change for its own sake'.

and the functionality behind it needs to change - all of that came to a head with IOS 7 and it needed to happen, take it from someone that's been using IOS solidly since 2008.

iOS 7 is functionally not very different from iOS 6. The visual redesign is the main part. Besides a few things like control centre, there is really not much to learn.

Apple have never supported downgrading IOS, to do so weakens the platform for everyone.

"Weakens the platform for everyone"? What have you been drinking?

It wasn't that great either, basically just a warmed over IOS 5 with a bunch of new bugs and a broken maps app. The wifi issues were quite real and bugged a lot of people, just not everyone annoyingly. I think if so much development effort hadn't had to go into de-googlifying IOS with maps etc, 6 probably would have seen more interesting changes - I'm not saying it would have been IOS 7 a year earlier as obviously that was Jony Ive's baby, but it would have been more "different" and therefore bothered many of the same people the same way. It certainly bothered many people that it wasn't.

I think if so much development effort hadn't had to go into de-skeuomorphizing (I can make up words too) IOS with white backgrounds etc, 7 probably would have seen more interesting changes.
 
So in other words, 'change for its own sake'.



iOS 7 is functionally not very different from iOS 6. The visual redesign is the main part. Besides a few things like control centre, there is really not much to learn.



"Weakens the platform for everyone"? What have you been drinking?


I think if so much development effort hadn't had to go into de-skeuomorphizing (I can make up words too) IOS with white backgrounds etc, 7 probably would have seen more interesting changes.

Jynto, you don't seem very knowlegeable about much. The person you are quoting is making very valid points.

The previous visual aesthetic of iOS is dated.

If Apple supported downgrading, it WOULD weaken the iOS platform, because developers wouldn't be obliged to develop for the most recent update. There'd be apps being written that work on older versions but not new versions, and vice versa. Apple solves this by keeping everyone on the latest possible iOS version available for their device.

It's true that a large portion of the Apple software engineers efforts have been devoted to revising the visual appearance and visual functionality of iOS. But this is an important aspect of iOS that needed changing (as I said, the previous aesthetic is outdated, thus less desirable by consumers)
 
Last edited:
Jynto, you don't seem very knowlegeable about much. The person you are quoting is making very valid points.

Okay-Guy-Meme-Face.jpg
 
I didn't aim to make a persuasive argument. Just saying my bit. If you don't want to upgrade to iOS7, then don't. But Apple is their own company. If you don't like their products, don't buy their products.

All initial releases of software contain bugs. If your opinion is that Apple release more buggy software than other software engineering companies, then don't buy Apple products.

It all comes down to this: if you don't like Apple's products, don't buy their products. Too many whiners. I have my criticisms of iOS7. And it is nice to be able to downgrade back to a previous version of iOS if one so wishes. But that's not what Apple is offering. Don't like it? Don't buy Apple's products.

EDIT: Also, I'm not saying people should upgrade if they're happy with iOS6. I'm telling those who already have upgraded to get used to it (obviously because they can't downgrade). Just trying to give them some hope because there's a lot of people moaning about iOS7.

If you are speaking to those who have already upgraded, fair enough...I like all my Apple products, and quite frankly, enjoy having the "newest/best"...IF it meets my criteria...I did my due diligence on upgrading, and decided I did not want to...I do not want to "buy" iOS7, and that should be my right, without having to be told that I'm some sort of heretic or too dense to know what I like and don't like, which seems to be the response to anyone who says they prefer not to upgrade
 
What good would having a 5s do without iOS 7? All of the new features that the 5s has aren't in iOS 6, so you would just have an iPhone 5.

A broken iPhone 5, since the lack of processor support would most likely brick it from the start..
 
Jynto, you don't seem very knowlegeable about much. The person you are quoting is making very valid points.

The previous visual aesthetic of iOS is dated.

If Apple supported downgrading, it WOULD weaken the iOS platform, because developers wouldn't be obliged to develop for the most recent update. There'd be apps being written that work on older versions but not new versions, and vice versa. Apple solves this by keeping everyone on the latest possible iOS version available for their device.

It's true that a large portion of the Apple software engineers efforts have been devoted to revising the visual appearance and visual functionality of iOS. But this is an important aspect of iOS that needed changing (as I said, the previous aesthetic is outdated, thus less desirable by consumers)
Aestehtics are purely subjective and do not conform to being good or bad or even dated, short if perhaps what the majority might think, which is pretty meaningless when it comes to aesthetics (e.g., if many more people suddenly start likening he color red does that somehow mean anything at all about any other colors or anyone else who might like those other colors). Come on now.
 
Sorry but this is just FUD as far as I'm concerned. It's a major rewrite of the OS, yes there are a couple of bugs but there have been with EVERY new release of IOS - I haven't seen anything related to IOS 7 that's any more concerning than the early issues with 6, or 5, or 4 etc.. Considering the scale of the changes this time round, that's remarkable.

You and I will both see things differently according to our stances...you will see all the references talking about how wonderful it looks, how performance is great, how people have upgraded with no issues, and things run smooth as glass...I will see the performance and lag issues, even on newer devices, such as my iPad4, the animation issues, the design changes which affect usabilty (such as font readability, reduced function in calendar, etc), motion sickness (which I think is over the top), etc...bottom line is, as I said in another reply, I'm tired of the logical reasons for me not choosing to update being debunked as "you old afraid of change fogey who is too dense to know that you like this"
 
Aestehtics are purely subjective and do not conform to being good or bad or even dated, short if perhaps what the majority might think, which is pretty meaningless when it comes to aesthetics (e.g., if many more people suddenly start likening he color red does that somehow mean anything at all about any other colors or anyone else who might like those other colors). Come on now.

If it became fashionable for operating systems to be coloured red, and a majority of consumers wanted this, then operating systems would be designed with a touch of red paint. I think in a case like this, there would always be the option of a neutral 'colour' ie. Greyscale, and the red would rather be a theme than a set-in-stone appearance.

Did you say what the majority thinks is meaningless? That is so untrue. What the majority thinks is always relevant.
 
Last edited:
If it became fashionable for operating systems to be coloured red, and a majority of consumers wanted this, then operating systems would be designed with a touch of red paint. I think in a case like this, there would always be the option of a neutral 'colour' ie. Greyscale, and the red would rather be a theme than a set-in-stone appearance.

Did you say what the majority thinks is meaningless? That is so untrue. What the majority thinks is always relevant.
Could be relevant, but has no relation to actually being good and/or right.
 
"I like iOS 7. Therefore you should ALL like it."


I don't want to use the "T" word because I'll probably get banned again, why did you feel the need to post a comment like that.

Didn't you read my whole post.

"Mmmmm not at all, this is a perfect solution for people that really want iOS 6 back and maybe the only solution after all.

On the other hand, really???

Why would someone go to all this trouble just to get iOS 6 back, I've been using iOS 7 for three months since beta 1 and I haven't missed iOS 6 for one second
."

Where in my post I said every one should like iOS 7, before posting please try to read, do you really think it's worth doing all of this just to get back iOS 6?

People like you make me so angry, commenting on something unrelated and only selecting a specific part of a post, just go to your android forums and be happy.
 
You'll still be stuck in a dwindling pool of compatibility as app developers naturally roll their latest new features and bug fixes into the latest versions.. I just don't know why you'd want to cripple your phone like that.

And before someone jumps up to say how "crippling" IOS 7 is, just get a hold of yourselves - you may be incapable of getting your head around the changes but under the skin IOS 7 is every bit as functional and stable as past versions as far as I can see. More than that, it massively improves performance in some areas. For instance, the wifi on my 5 was very spotty on 6.1.4, dropping connection often, to the point where I was convinced I either had faulty hardware or the 5 had a serious design flaw (and I was far from alone in that - wifi issues with the 5 were a recurring complaint in IOS 6). With IOS 7 my wifi has been absolutely rock solid, so as far as I'm concerned it's objectively the far superior OS before you even look at the eye candy.

It all comes down to what's most important to you. For some people functionality is most important, for others it's about stability, and for others it's about appearance. I fall into that last category. I think if I upgraded to iOS 7 I would miss the old UI a lot and it would ruin the experience of using my iPhone. One day I'll be forced to update I'm sure, but I'm just gonna hold off for the time being.
 
I don't want to use the "T" word because I'll probably get banned again, why did you feel the need to post a comment like that.

Didn't you read my whole post.

"Mmmmm not at all, this is a perfect solution for people that really want iOS 6 back and maybe the only solution after all.

On the other hand, really???

Why would someone go to all this trouble just to get iOS 6 back, I've been using iOS 7 for three months since beta 1 and I haven't missed iOS 6 for one second
."

Where in my post I said every one should like iOS 7, before posting please try to read, do you really think it's worth doing all of this just to get back iOS 6?

You didn't say it, but you strongly implied it when you brought your own opinion of iOS 7 into the matter. Why would you mention it unless it was relevant to the discussion? In a topic where we are discussing a solution to the problem of being stuck with iOS 7, there is not much point in sticking your head into the wind and saying that the problem doesn't affect you, unless you're suggesting that it shouldn't really be a problem for everyone else.

I'd explain it with an analogy, but I really shouldn't have to. If you make comments like that, don't be surprised to receive a little flak for it. For that matter, I don't think my reposte was any worse than this:
I don't want milk, but I want a milkshake.. :rolleyes:

And how the hell did you get this? (emphasis mine)
People like you make me so angry, commenting on something unrelated and only selecting a specific part of a post, just go to your android forums and be happy.

Again, you're not saying it outright, but you're implying that behaving badly on a forum marks me out as an Android fan. Again, you're falsely implying that all trolls are Android fans. I suggest you stop. I suggest we both stop before one of us sticks a foot in it again.

To answer your original question, the OP made it clear that trading in his iPhone was quite easy to do. Not much effort was made. Not much money was spent. Let it be.
 
You didn't say it, but you strongly implied it when you brought your own opinion of iOS 7 into the matter. Why would you mention it unless it was relevant to the discussion? In a topic where we are discussing a solution to the problem of being stuck with iOS 7, there is not much point in sticking your head into the wind and saying that the problem doesn't affect you, unless you're suggesting that it shouldn't really be a problem for everyone else.

I'd explain it with an analogy, but I really shouldn't have to. If you make comments like that, don't be surprised to receive a little flak for it. For that matter, I don't think my reposte was any worse than this:


And how the hell did you get this? (emphasis mine)


Again, you're not saying it outright, but you're implying that behaving badly on a forum marks me out as an Android fan. Again, you're falsely implying that all trolls are Android fans. I suggest you stop. I suggest we both stop before one of us sticks a foot in it again.

To answer your original question, the OP made it clear that trading in his iPhone was quite easy to do. Not much effort was made. Not much money was spent. Let it be.

To be honest, I didn't read what you replied, not wasting anymore time with kids like you.
 
Sorry but that says everything about your way of thinking! I've set wallpaper from the photos app many times and it literally couldn't be simpler; in IOS 6 you found the photo you liked, hit the share button, and pressed "use as wallpaper", whereas in IOS 7 you do... the exact same thing! Nothing's changed except horror of horrors, the share pane has been redesigned (to be a lot more functional and consistent across the device) - big deal. It changed between IOS 5 and IOS 6 too, how did any of us cope with that?!



It fragments the ecosystem, which is bad for everyone, and wastes Apple's resources on maintaining older software for a entrenched minority, which should be going into improving the current release for everyone. And that's why they stop signing older versions and (rightly) concentrate on getting everyone into 2013.

a) You now have to press some little hard to see box with an arrow in it, then select the photos (already it seems like it isn't the right path as you can only set 1 as wallpaper), then click next at the opposite corner, then scroll the bottom row of icons over to use as wallpaper, then move/scale and set as one or the other. It's not actually that easy compared to the old way. My parents don't like learning unintuitive steps to do such simple things before.

b) It takes no additional energy from Apple to let people downgrade to iOS 6.1.3/4. They simply leave it up. Some devices can only go that high anyways. It would even take them less energy because they wouldn't have to bother fixing every last bug and flaw to make sure iPhone 4 run iOS 7 perfectly well, and dealing with customer issues, etc.

Fragmentation argument is invalid... many will stick to 6, some can't go past 6, and others would have all their problems and complaints resolved by using 6. It should be up to the consumer. At least for a few weeks.

What if they did that with Windows? Imagine how happy everyone would be if XP forced you to Vista with no way back, and half your apps didn't run, your computer ran terribly, etc... Yet, you can still install XP just fine, and it doesn't stop MS from working on Windows 8, etc...

I'm happy if your device works exactly how you want it to on 7, but try to imagine how you'd feel if it didn't go so well for you.
 
Last edited:
I hate iOS 7... How dare you like it and praise it...!

I like it and I praise it

last time I checked, I can say anything I want and not have to worry about if it offends YOU

God Bless America! God Bless Apple...
 
Last edited by a moderator:
a) You now have to press some little hard to see box with an arrow in it, then select the photos (already it seems like it isn't the right path as you can only set 1 as wallpaper), then click next at the opposite corner, then scroll the bottom row of icons over to use as wallpaper, then move/scale and set as one or the other. It's not actually that easy compared to the old way. My parents don't like learning unintuitive steps to do such simple things before.

The next button only shows up in landscape mode (how often do you set a landscape picture as wallpaper on your portrait orientated phone?), otherwise all the options are on the same screen - and the photo you were looking at before you pressed that oh-so-hard-to-see button (the only other button aside from delete) is already clearly selected at that point, so there's nothing else to do at that point than scroll over to the wallpaper button and press it.

But wait, the wallpaper button is slightly off screen, oh noes, you have to scroll slightly to choose an option on your iPhone! How alien! How will anyone cope? Won't somebody think of the children??!

b) It takes no additional energy from Apple to let people downgrade to iOS 6.1.3/4.

Wrong. If they leave it up, a whole bunch of people like you, who decided after three minutes that they couldn't possibly adapt to a slightly revamped sharing pane, would sit on 6 forever - and you'd be a constant drag on the whole ecosystem. There's a big difference between a dwindling supply of older 3GS's and the like still bumping along on 6 for a while, and a rump of bozos with 4's, 4S's and 5's still expecting 6 to be current and splitting the app developers accordingly.

One of Apple's massive strengths over Android is the unified install base; they will not give that up no matter how much you whine, and they're right not to.

It would even take them less energy because they wouldn't have to bother fixing every last bug and flaw to make sure iPhone 4 run iOS 7 perfectly well, and dealing with customer issues, etc.

Yeah exactly, wouldn't that be great, they could just look after you and your IOS 6 loving friends, divert some resources away from IOS 7 and not bother fixing issues for those who have upgraded and want to use the latest OS.. thats definitely exactly what Apple should do.
 
What if they did that with Windows? Imagine how happy everyone would be if XP forced you to Vista with no way back, and half your apps didn't run, your computer ran terribly, etc... Yet, you can still install XP just fine, and it doesn't stop MS from working on Windows 8, etc...

Terrible analogy btw. XP to Vista (or any other windows) is an expensive paid update, and newer windows versions typically run poorly (if at all) on older machines.

IOS 7 (like previous updates) is completely free and designed for the iphone 4 as much as the 5S. The majority of IOS apps will be updated for free for it too (if they haven't been already). There's no comparison to the world of windows.
 
I hate iOS 7... How dare you like it and praise it...!

That's the spirit!

----------

IOS 7 (like previous updates) is completely free and designed for the iphone 4 as much as the 5S.

[citation needed]

The majority of IOS apps will be updated for free for it too (if they haven't been already). There's no comparison to the world of windows.

You're right. Windows lets you change the theme to look like old Windows.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.