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Downgrading an iPhone From iOS 17 to iOS 16 is No Longer Possible

ebika said:
Reading the iOS 17 forum, it seems like 17 is still a mess. I normally update fairly soon after releases, but I'm waiting for at least 17.1 this time.
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Yeah, right, try going back and reading the comments about every other iOS release before 17. They are all instantly labeled “a mess” by the clueless. Most of the complaints are about stuff that changed, glitches that are easily resolved by a restart of the device, misunderstandings of how features work, etc.

FWIW I installed iOS 17 on the day it was released, went through 17.0.1-17.0.3 with absolutely no “messes” at all. I think my experience is typical but all you hear about on tech blogs is the outliers hollering.
 
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Reverend Benny said:
Good, people need to stop using old OS. There is always 16.7 if you want to run the older version that has the latest updates and can be considered secure. And I'm guessing theres a 16.7.1. around the corner since 17.0.3 was released yesterday.
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I have two 13 Pro Max iPhones that I bought a year ago. I updated one to the latest and the other is still on 16.0.2 and I'm waiting for jailbreak for that one, mainly to be able to spoof my location. Till then, I still have my XS on 14.4 so I can spoof.
 
I'll wait to 17.1 to upgrade again.

I upgraded to 17 on the release date and then installed 16.6.1 (then update to 16.7) because I feel the battery not good as before and a little less of performance on my iPhone 12 Mini. Lets hope that 17.1 is a lot polished
 
lkrupp said:
Yeah, right, try going back and reading the comments about every other iOS release before 17. They are all instantly labeled “a mess” by the clueless. Most of the complaints are about stuff that changed, glitches that are easily resolved by a restart of the device, misunderstandings of how features work, etc.

FWIW I installed iOS 17 on the day it was released, went through 17.0.1-17.0.3 with absolutely no “messes” at all. I think my experience is typical but all you hear about on tech blogs is the outliers hollering.
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I've used all the iPhone OS versions, so I've seen the flurry of comments on releases, and sure, sometimes it's a lot of nothing burgers from people that just don't like change. There are specific issues with iOS 17 that aren't resolved or fixed by restarting the devices. There is a 4 page thread about a defect introduced on iMessage re-indexing and searching. A breaking change in the 17.0 release candidate to the tones plist file format resulting is hiding all custom tones (reverted in 17.1b1 and appears to be in the process of being fixed for 17.1). Carplay message notifications appear to be intermittently working or not working. Apple acknowledged a thermal issue on iPhone 15s with iOS <17.0.3, likely a runaway code loop introduced as a defect in the iOS 17 APIs (they were not specific on where exactly, so who knows if this was causing CPU load and battery issues on other iPhone models too). The one that gave me pause was the issue introduced in iOS 17 where folks with a work and personal phone number and had segregated iMessage messages originator number for years saw it being mixed and leaked personal phone numbers in 17.

Your anecdotal experience aside, this isn't a clueless knee-jerk reaction to iOS 17. The cadence of patch releases and specific issues shows a rocky release this time. I don't think I'm alone trying to thread the needle between stability and desirable features/fixes with all the iOS updates. 17 just seems to need a bit more time to settle.
 
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ebika said:
I've used all the iPhone OS versions, so I've seen the flurry of comments on releases, and sure, sometimes it's a lot of nothing burgers from people that just don't like change. There are specific issues with iOS 17 that aren't resolved or fixed by restarting the devices. There is a 4 page thread about a defect introduced on iMessage re-indexing and searching. A breaking change in the 17.0 release candidate to the tones plist file format resulting is hiding all custom tones (reverted in 17.1b1 and appears to be in the process of being fixed for 17.1). Carplay message notifications appear to be intermittently working or not working. Apple acknowledged a thermal issue on iPhone 15s with iOS <17.0.3, likely a runaway code loop introduced as a defect in the iOS 17 APIs (they were not specific on where exactly, so who knows if this was causing CPU load and battery issues on other iPhone models too). The one that gave me pause was the issue introduced in iOS 17 where folks with a work and personal phone number and had segregated iMessage messages originator number for years saw it being mixed and leaked personal phone numbers in 17.

Your anecdotal experience aside, this isn't a clueless knee-jerk reaction to iOS 17. The cadence of patch releases and specific issues shows a rocky release this time. I don't think I'm alone trying to thread the needle between stability and desirable features/fixes with all the iOS updates. 17 just seems to need a bit more time to settle.
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This is true, there are real bugs in iOS 17 especially 17.0.X versions. I'm currently on 17.1 beta and was considering going back to 16 or 17.0.3 but then realized the beta is actually less buggy than the stable release.
 
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coolfactor said:
That's a loaded topic.
  1. User chooses to remain on an older version of the operating system.
  2. Developers have moved on and only support the latest.
  3. User has an issue with an app due to an incompatibility between the app and their chosen operating system.
Should Apple or the developer have the burden of providing support because a user is refusing to keep up with the latest?

Users *do* have the choice to keep using a particular operating system by turning off automatic updates and never upgrading, so that argument doesn't hold water. The signing prevents downgrading *after* an upgrade has already taken place — either automatically, or manually. In both cases, the user is responsible for the upgrade happening, not Apple.
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I think major OS updates should go back to being every 2-3 years. These are mature enough now that there just isn't enough to care about having updates so often either. I've almost never been a fan of new OS's every year, especially on Mac. I guess it was kind of nice on the iPhone and watch early on when things where improving so quickly, but now that every product is mature we just don't need it.
 
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coolfactor said:
That's a loaded topic.
  1. User chooses to remain on an older version of the operating system.
  2. Developers have moved on and only support the latest.
  3. User has an issue with an app due to an incompatibility between the app and their chosen operating system.
Should Apple or the developer have the burden of providing support because a user is refusing to keep up with the latest?

Users *do* have the choice to keep using a particular operating system by turning off automatic updates and never upgrading, so that argument doesn't hold water. The signing prevents downgrading *after* an upgrade has already taken place — either automatically, or manually. In both cases, the user is responsible for the upgrade happening, not Apple.
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Apple always promise improvements, NEVER do they promise or even mention degeneration.
I might even go as far as to suggest that there are bugs they are actually aware of in a particular release that doesn't prevent them from offering it to the public.
So to say that the user is, (wholly), responsible for the upgrade is something I can't agree with.
They should allow downgrades on that basis.

What I personally think is reasonable is for them to offer as a minimum, the last stable version of any particular release. That way they've addressed everything in it that they realistically can.
As of the devs, it's up to them what they do but as Apple manages the store they could do that too. It's up to the devs to offer support and/or state a date when support will cease.
 
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HVDynamo said:
I think major OS updates should go back to being every 2-3 years. These are mature enough now that there just isn't enough to care about having updates so often either. I've almost never been a fan of new OS's every year, especially on Mac. I guess it was kind of nice on the iPhone and watch early on when things where improving so quickly, but now that every product is mature we just don't need it.
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While I agree with you on that, the marketing machine cannot stop, and nowadays a new operating system is part of the marketing that comes along with new hardware.

A possible solution could be making more gradual changes, without touching a lot of the kernel code or the core code. Sorta what happened with iOS 13 -> 14 -> 15. iOS 13 brought a lot of changes and it was rough, but then iOS 14 was like a refinement over iOS 13, thus, the first versions weren’t so rough.

With iOS 16 came big changes, such as the new Lock Screen, and it was a rough release with lots of bugs… but iOS 17 seems a refinement over iOS 16 and I really expect that it will be rock solid much earlier than we think. Maybe for iOS 17.1 or 17.2; in the meantime, it’s worth waiting on iOS 16.6.1, as this release is really stable.
 
JosephAW said:
iOS 10 was my favorite because of 32bit support. iOS 8 was the last version you could sync apps and download apps using iTunes. :rolleyes:
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6 was the best release - before the UI got FUGLY. Sometimes I'll pick up an old iPhone and just be amazed at how beautiful the UI was pre-7.

And dropping 32 bit support was one of the stupidest things Apple ever did, right up there with stopping support of PowerPC apps.
 
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switz said:
At least we do get updates. Android is not known for long term support of their operating system(s) or the Android phones.
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Well, I think they have recently announced that the new Pixel 8 phone will have up to 7 years of Android updates. But those are an exception on the Android landscape.
 
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Reverend Benny said:
Good, people need to stop using old OS. There is always 16.7 if you want to run the older version that has the latest updates and can be considered secure. And I'm guessing theres a 16.7.1. around the corner since 17.0.3 was released yesterday.
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Normally I would agree, but there are no signed IPSW packages for 16.7 so it's not possible to revert to the last supported version of iOS 16. Apple really needs to make those last updates available via IPSWs
 
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btrach144 said:
IDK, iOS 17 is pretty stable. Only real issue was a warm 15 PM but 17.0.3 seems to have solved that today.
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There are still major bugs listed in the other threads such as huge storage loss, iMessage in iCloud not syncing, broken mail/messages search, and call posters not working or using too much space.
 
I may be in the minority here, but I enjoy iOS 17 and haven’t noticed any bugs. There’s a few really nice (albeit overdue) features I didn’t know I needed until they were introduced. I wouldn’t go back if I could.
 
boswald said:
I may be in the minority here, but I enjoy iOS 17 and haven’t noticed any bugs.
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1696529275512.jpeg


Congratulations, enjoy iOS 17 then. As you said, it has many little quality of life improvements, and I really enjoy those, such as, having off-line maps
 
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Reverend Benny said:
Good, people need to stop using old OS. There is always 16.7 if you want to run the older version that has the latest updates and can be considered secure. And I'm guessing theres a 16.7.1. around the corner since 17.0.3 was released yesterday.
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As an aside, often times, medical apps warn/suggest/won't operate on latest OSs. Abbott's Libre sensor for example, only will list compatibility up to iOS 16.1


Now, will Libre 2 app work on iOS 17? No issue, but in certain circumstances, remaining on a particular OS is very important/critical.
 
switz said:
At least we do get updates. Android is not known for long term support of their operating system(s) or the Android phones.
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I can't think of any OS wide Android issues that I've faced in the past 7 years. I use a mixture of Android phones/tablets along with iPhone. I have a Nexus tablet from 2014 I still watch Twitch and stream Spotify on
 
Can someone answer this for me? Does this mean that eligible devices on iOS 15 and below can no longer upgrade to iOS 16? Do they have to jump straight to iOS 17? Or is going from 15 -> 16 still an option?
 
Isn’t there a way to nuke your iPhone to “just like it came out of the box”? Then build up to your preferred IOS ?
 
Reverend Benny said:
Good, people need to stop using old OS. There is always 16.7 if you want to run the older version that has the latest updates and can be considered secure. And I'm guessing theres a 16.7.1. around the corner since 17.0.3 was released yesterday.
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Nonsense. Let me choose. Let me install whatever I want whenever I want. Let me worry about risks, don’t choose for me.
 
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