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Faldonr1

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Apr 4, 2020
1
0
Hi

I am looking at a new wifi setup at home as I do not think it is completely stable and does not get speed out throughout the house. My setup today is an Apple time capsule in the living room, and three airport Express around the house, set to speakers so I can use AirPlay through them. My connection is 300mbit Down and 60 up. If I sit close to the time capule, it shows 300 my on wifi. But if I go down in a room, it comes down to 12-14 mbit. Then look at whether I will be able to get a more stable grid and higher speed around the whole house. Will keep airport Express, but only for the AirPlay part of a future network. BUT what I buy, to get a stable grid throughout the house. ? Looking at the unifi Dream machine where I want to set the unfi access point. (2 pcs). But is there any doubt that it can be set up to run mesh? (can cable for them).

If I upgrade to 1 gbit, how much can I expect to pull out over wifi on these two solutions?

But is it overkill? Will AmpliFi HD Home be Enough?



Hope you can help
 

Meeomo

macrumors newbie
Apr 8, 2020
2
2
Rather future proof and get wifi ax/6.
Why not consider the Amplifi Alien.
also please provide size of the home.
 
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MacBH928

Contributor
May 17, 2008
5,756
2,301
I am not sure why you are posting about routers in digital audio forums, but....

Are you willing to run wires? Because I think Ubiquiti Dream Machine doesn't create a wireless mesh. You can go to reddit and ask in /r/Ubiquiti for advice.

I dont advice you use Amplifi HD, its a little bit weaker on the features side and speed and is made for the simple joe, basically plug and play.

If you want a wireless mesh, there is the Netgear Orbi that gives high speeds. There is also Alien HD which will give you high speed and wireless mesh and Wifi 6 but they are expensive. If you are someone whi tinkers with networking, you might want to double check on the Alien HD it might not give powerful network options.

My opinion is go with a wired ubqiuiti solution. If you want wireless go with the Orbi, there is also a Wifi 6 version which is very expensive. You can always buy a mesh system for now and upgrade in the next couple years to a Wifi 6 one as Wifi 6 now is extremely cutting edge. Your devices AND router have ti be Wifi 6 to benefit from it.
 
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JoeG4

macrumors 68030
Jan 11, 2002
2,732
328
Are you willing to run wires? Because I think Ubiquiti Dream Machine doesn't create a wireless mesh. You can go to reddit and ask in /r/Ubiquiti for advice.

It's one of the things they advertised, but they broke it in between a few software updates lol.

So far their line with the Dream Machines seems to be "It just works.... most of time time!"

Tough part is I REALLY want a UDM!
 
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MacBH928

Contributor
May 17, 2008
5,756
2,301
It's one of the things they advertised, but they broke it in between a few software updates lol.

So far their line with the Dream Machines seems to be "It just works.... most of time time!"

Tough part is I REALLY want a UDM!

without a dedicated backhaul its a no go. I don't get the hype over the UDM, it doesn't have mesh, Wifi coverage is weak, No Wifi6 nor WPA3, its just a combined router+switch which was already in the market but instead of having two pieces they are one piece now. There is nothing "Dream" about it. I would've called it dream if it had dedicated backhaul and stable performance.
 
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PhoenixDown

macrumors regular
Oct 12, 2012
226
126
I was able to uplink my Unifi AP's back to my Dream Machine without issue.
I like the UDM personally.
 
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MacBH928

Contributor
May 17, 2008
5,756
2,301
I was able to uplink my Unifi AP's back to my Dream Machine without issue.
I like the UDM personally.

I was not sure if you can, but even if you can it does not have a dedicated band, that means that the 400Mbps Wifi connection is split in 2; 1 to wireless link to the base station and 1 is used to communicate with your client this means you have a theoretical maximum speed of 200Mbps or so. If thats enough for you then its enough, I was just trying to point out it does not have a dedicated band for wireless backhaul which the Neatgear Orbi does.

Although I am interested to hear from you how is Ubiquiti wireless mesh is working, how stable and reliable is it? Speed?
I am definitely going to upgrade to Ubiquiti in the future once there is a dedicated backhaul wireless mesh and Wifi6 is finally stable and ready without issues for consumer use.
 
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pldelisle

macrumors 68020
May 4, 2020
2,248
1,480
Montreal, Quebec, Canada
without a dedicated backhaul its a no go. I don't get the hype over the UDM, it doesn't have mesh, Wifi coverage is weak, No Wifi6 nor WPA3, its just a combined router+switch which was already in the market but instead of having two pieces they are one piece now. There is nothing "Dream" about it. I would've called it dream if it had dedicated backhaul and stable performance.

I know fairly well Ubiquiti products.

The main advantage of UDM-Pro is in its IDS/IPS and firewall capability and great speed (3500 Mbps with all features enabled). It's a small business router. Not the kind of router a "noob" in networking can easily deploy. This router is not intended to serve as an access point. It's a router. The main advantage is in its built-in Unifi controller and can also serve as a Protect gateway for cameras. Again, it is not intended for home use by a non-tech guy.

The UDM (non-Pro) has an access point in it (802.11ac) but uses the same controller as the UDM-Pro. Not trivial to install. It's still mostly for IT enthusiasts who requires 1 gbps IDS/IPS/Firewall routing + an access point built-in. You can manage hundreds of Unifi APs with this one too, just like the UDM-Pro. The main intention of the Unifi APs are not to deploy a mesh. Every single AP must be wired to a PoE switch, which is connected to a server/UDM/UDM-Pro/Cloud Key with the Unifi Controller running. But this is, for the budget, the best networking hardware I have ever deployed and used. These APs are the most stable I have ever seen in any network configuration. I have at home two UAP-AC-LR (1 on each floor) and all my devices are almost always running at 800+ mbps, which is totally fine for 99% of home usage. The more critical devices (Apple TV, Macs, servers, NAS, etc) are wired. Wiring is always recommended for heavy bandwidth-consuming devices like these.

You will rarely get 1 gbps over wifi unless you are in a 1m range from the AP. The best is when the devices have a direct sight to the AP. That's why mesh networking is becoming more and more popular, because you can easily position the AP near where the devices are and in "sight" of the next AP. But as soon as you need to go through walls, your speed will drop because of the physical properties of a 5GHz wave.

The Amplify line is targeted for home use. I would chose this for non IT enthusiast.
 
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MacBH928

Contributor
May 17, 2008
5,756
2,301
I know fairly well Ubiquiti products.

The main advantage of UDM-Pro is in its IDS/IPS and firewall capability and great speed (3500 Mbps with all features enabled). It's a small business router. Not the kind of router a "noob" in networking can easily deploy. This router is not intended to serve as an access point. It's a router. The main advantage is in its built-in Unifi controller and can also serve as a Protect gateway for cameras. Again, it is not intended for home use by a non-tech guy.

The UDM (non-Pro) has an access point in it (802.11ac) but uses the same controller as the UDM-Pro. Not trivial to install. It's still mostly for IT enthusiasts who requires 1 gbps IDS/IPS/Firewall routing + an access point built-in. You can manage hundreds of Unifi APs with this one too, just like the UDM-Pro. The main intention of the Unifi APs are not to deploy a mesh. Every single AP must be wired to a PoE switch, which is connected to a server/UDM/UDM-Pro/Cloud Key with the Unifi Controller running. But this is, for the budget, the best networking hardware I have ever deployed and used. These APs are the most stable I have ever seen in any network configuration. I have at home two UAP-AC-LR (1 on each floor) and all my devices are almost always running at 800+ mbps, which is totally fine for 99% of home usage. The more critical devices (Apple TV, Macs, servers, NAS, etc) are wired. Wiring is always recommended for heavy bandwidth-consuming devices like these.

You will rarely get 1 gbps over wifi unless you are in a 1m range from the AP. The best is when the devices have a direct sight to the AP. That's why mesh networking is becoming more and more popular, because you can easily position the AP near where the devices are and in "sight" of the next AP. But as soon as you need to go through walls, your speed will drop because of the physical properties of a 5GHz wave.

The Amplify line is targeted for home use. I would chose this for non IT enthusiast.

How are you getting 800+Mbps on an AP? I thought Wifi signal max limit is 500Mbps per AP.

So you don't recommend the UDM for home users?
 
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pldelisle

macrumors 68020
May 4, 2020
2,248
1,480
Montreal, Quebec, Canada
How are you getting 800+Mbps on an AP? I thought Wifi signal max limit is 500Mbps per AP.

The UAC-AP-LR are 866 Mbps rated. Having 800+ mbps is within the performance range of the AP. I'm not far from the AP, this is with my Mac and in a fairly non-crowded air space. I only have my Mac and 2 iPhones on the network, which are most of the time not connected to this AP. The UAP-AC-Pro are rated to 1300 mbps and can also push 800+ mbps to a single device depending of the noise condition.

So you don't recommend the UDM for home users?

Unless you are an IT-enthusiast, no. Amplify are more for home use than UDM.
 
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lermal

macrumors regular
Aug 7, 2007
127
13
Florida
Posted this in another thread (just came across this one so posting here as well):

Has anyone gotten either of these:

1. Amplifi Alien - https://amplifi.com/alien
2. Ubiquiti UniFi Dream Machine - https://store.ui.com/collections/routing-switching/products/unifi-dream-machine

I just sold my home along with my Ubiquiti wireless setup (switch, gateway, AC-AP-Pro (x2), cloud key) and looking for another (albeit simpler) setup. On paper, I like the Dream Machine, given it has more features, but no Wifi 6. Curious as to opinions? I currently am renting a 1800 sq. ft. house (single floor, no basement).
 
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pldelisle

macrumors 68020
May 4, 2020
2,248
1,480
Montreal, Quebec, Canada
I personally find wifi6 still a immature gimmick. Support is limited and I personally don’t see why I would require such speed over wifi.

Dream Machine is a very nice all in one. Now its firmware seems a lot more stable than before. If you are a bit tech-savvy I’d say go with it. If you are more plug’n’play go with amplifi.
 
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chabig

macrumors 604
Sep 6, 2002
7,892
5,229
I just ordered an Amplifi Alien to replace my Amplifi HD. I like their app and software support. Wifi 6 may still be immature but I'm sure we'll all grow into it.
 
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PhoenixDown

macrumors regular
Oct 12, 2012
226
126
Has anyone gotten either of these:

1. Amplifi Alien - https://amplifi.com/alien
2. Ubiquiti UniFi Dream Machine - https://store.ui.com/collections/routing-switching/products/unifi-dream-machine

I have the UDM and I liked it but ran into an odd bug where it would disconnect from the internet. Support advised me to upgrade to a beta firmware that wasn't even on their site. I would hvae upgraded to the next higher beta firmware but that seemed to be for the UDM-Pro only. Long story short I bought hte UDM-PRO as I needed more reliable internet for WFH. The UDM-Pro has been rock solid (thankfully!) but I've noticed that the base UDM just isnt getting TLC or the same level of focus on firmware updates.
 
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lermal

macrumors regular
Aug 7, 2007
127
13
Florida
I have the UDM and I liked it but ran into an odd bug where it would disconnect from the internet. Support advised me to upgrade to a beta firmware that wasn't even on their site. I would hvae upgraded to the next higher beta firmware but that seemed to be for the UDM-Pro only. Long story short I bought hte UDM-PRO as I needed more reliable internet for WFH. The UDM-Pro has been rock solid (thankfully!) but I've noticed that the base UDM just isnt getting TLC or the same level of focus on firmware updates.

You know if your bug was a widespread problem? How long ago did you get your UDM? I think the UDM-PRO is too much power for me at my current place, but still liking the UDM.
 
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satcomer

macrumors 604
Feb 19, 2008
7,433
1,328
The Finger Lakes Region
I tend to think Wi-Fi 6 is still only good for this that have the capability in Mac World unless you have a new M1 Mac and/or the new IPhones then Wi-Fi 6 is a pipe dream right now at this eat.y strange. IMHO not all the current routers support Wi-Fi 6 right now and some of early new 6 routers have been problematic at best, so wait until early spring up until the other manufactures get Wi-Fi going like AC was!
 
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lermal

macrumors regular
Aug 7, 2007
127
13
Florida
I am going to get the Unifi Dream Machine - having been a Ubiquiti user for the past few years, I cannot give up the flexibility of managing my own network. Once I get it & set it up, I will report back to this thread on how it goes.
 
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lermal

macrumors regular
Aug 7, 2007
127
13
Florida
I’m personally waiting for UXG-PRO. I want to manage a couple of sites (family) and UDM-PRO cannot make it. I’d too chose the UDM-PRO over UDM if possible.
UDM-PRO is overkill for my needs now. I'm currently renting an ~1,800 square foot apartment (one-level). Once I buy a place again, I'll surely look at the UDM-PRO + APs.
 
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mmomega

macrumors demi-god
Dec 30, 2009
3,789
1,965
DFW, TX
UDM Pro isn't worth it unless you plan on running Cameras off of it as well.
Main difference between UDM and UDM-pro is the Pro is rack mounted with a hard drive bay, and a single 10Gb link.

I have 3 UDM-Pro's and 3 UDM's I manage at the offices.
At home I have the Pro because that's just me with my personal tech things, typically over-the-top. Overkill and a lot of the times frustrating but I personally enjoy the tinkering and troubleshooting.
For many family and friends I recommend the AmpliFi and have installed those for family several years ago with no bad reports since. I don't live with it so I only know what and when they mention something.

I have used the newer Orbi line. They performed well.

Personally I would go AmpliFi or suggest something around the $250-$300 range when feasible. Just from experience most routers below that pricepoint produce more issues than they solve, almost by design.
 
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mmomega

macrumors demi-god
Dec 30, 2009
3,789
1,965
DFW, TX
I’m personally waiting for UXG-PRO. I want to manage a couple of sites (family) and UDM-PRO cannot make it. I’d too chose the UDM-PRO over UDM if possible.
You can manage multiple UDM's from a single website, just not host mulitple sites from a single controller.

I manage 5 UDM's, 1 personal and 4 business locations from the unifi portal. They are all in seperate cities.
They all show up. Just click which machine to manage.
With no VPN they can manage the UDM settings itself or choose the UniFi settings, Protect settings, Access, and Phone all independently.

Just sign in as an admin on the machine with your UniFi account and they can all be linked to your UniFi Portal.


I had my moments and thought intially when moving to this but like it more than all sites on a single machine.
Over the years I've had times where power or internet from the host would go out and not able to access anything else until it came back up.
Now if one goes down, no harm no foul to anything else and you can still login if you are local with no internet access to troubleshoot.
It's pretty good.
 

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lermal

macrumors regular
Aug 7, 2007
127
13
Florida
If anyone is looking - the UDM-PRO is on sale for $299 (US Store). Same price as the UDM. Question is do I go for the UDM-PRO and return my UDM when it arrives?? (sort of joking, still thinking the PRO is too much for my needs but price makes it tempting)
 
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