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DVD+R/+RW Support in Panther
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Here's the Panther ASP info from my 17" PowerBook 1.33Ghz:
MATSHITA DVD-R UJ-816:
Manufacturer: MATSHITA
Model: MATSHITA DVD-R UJ-816
Revision: DXJ3
Serial Number:
Drive Type: CD-RW/DVD-RW
Disc Burning: Apple Supported/Shipped
Removable Media: Yes
Detachable Drive: No
Protocol: ATAPI
Unit Number: 0
Socket Type: Internal
MATSHITA DVD-R UJ-816:
Manufacturer: MATSHITA
Model: MATSHITA DVD-R UJ-816
Revision: DXJ3
Serial Number:
Drive Type: CD-RW/DVD-RW
Disc Burning: Apple Supported/Shipped
Removable Media: Yes
Detachable Drive: No
Protocol: ATAPI
Unit Number: 0
Socket Type: Internal
Not much of a secret
After all, the powerbook developer note specs a DVD-RW drive installed:
http://developer.apple.com/document...G4/15inchPowerBookG4/3Input-Output/index.html
What's missing is support for the Mt. Ranier filesystem, which lets you use the DVD-/+RW like a floppy disc. Let's hope Microsoft isn't going to upstage Apple again like they did with user switching:
http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/hwdev/tech/stream/DVD/dvdrw_support.mspx#XSLTsection126121120120
After all, the powerbook developer note specs a DVD-RW drive installed:
http://developer.apple.com/document...G4/15inchPowerBookG4/3Input-Output/index.html
What's missing is support for the Mt. Ranier filesystem, which lets you use the DVD-/+RW like a floppy disc. Let's hope Microsoft isn't going to upstage Apple again like they did with user switching:
http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/hwdev/tech/stream/DVD/dvdrw_support.mspx#XSLTsection126121120120
well I guess this will give me another reason to fork out more dough to upgrade to panther for my new PB - not happy, but heck I can't not do it!! 
Most superdrives have been the pioneer models (101-106), but iirc I read on macintouch 6 months or so ago that some of the newer iMacs and then G5 were coming with a sony drive (u10a or something). The Sony and pioneer 106 offered the +r/+rw compatibility.
This site has good info on the differences in formats as well as database of -r/-rw/+r/+rw drives:
http://www.dvdrhelp.com/dvd.htm
And xlr8yourmac has a drive compatibility database from reader reports. iDVD only burns to internal drives, so this can be great info for those wishing to upgrade by adding their own superdrive (for instance, support for the pioneer 106 was apparently added in 10.2.8):
http://forums.xlr8yourmac.com/drivedb/search.drivedb.lasso
This site has good info on the differences in formats as well as database of -r/-rw/+r/+rw drives:
http://www.dvdrhelp.com/dvd.htm
And xlr8yourmac has a drive compatibility database from reader reports. iDVD only burns to internal drives, so this can be great info for those wishing to upgrade by adding their own superdrive (for instance, support for the pioneer 106 was apparently added in 10.2.8):
http://forums.xlr8yourmac.com/drivedb/search.drivedb.lasso
Re: Re: +r/+rw
Yes - DVD-r/rw offers better compatibility with DVD-players
But, as far as I know...DVD+r/rw offers the possibility to burn sessions...which is a great advantage! My superdrive - in my Dual G5 - is a Pioneer 106 which is a - & r-dvd...but I haven't tried dvd'r yet.
Yes - DVD-r/rw offers better compatibility with DVD-players
But, as far as I know...DVD+r/rw offers the possibility to burn sessions...which is a great advantage! My superdrive - in my Dual G5 - is a Pioneer 106 which is a - & r-dvd...but I haven't tried dvd'r yet.
Originally posted by Stike
Nope, in fact, the opposite is true. DVD-R plays on more generic DVD players opposed to DVD+R.
That was the reason why Apple had chosen -R
Generally speaking, +R has some quality improvements to the format, which are not backwards compatible, hence Apple went with DVD-R to provide a maximum acceptance even on the oldest DVD players.
I have a 1GHz 17"iMac, bought in April '03. According to the system profiler I have a sony DVD RW DW-U10A, which it reports as a CD-RW/DVD-R only. No -RW and no +R/RW. According to sony specifications it should be able to do all those. It's not just Jaguar, Toast titanium can't do the +R either. This bugs me, because I have heard of people who bought a retail version and could burn +R's with it using Toast under jaguar.
I hate to be cheated out of functionality of stuff I own. If Panther does support these formats, it's another reason to spend some 160,- , but I think apple should have included this functionality from the start...
M.
I can confirm this. I upgraded a Quicksilver with a U10A and all formats -/+R(W) work flawlessly (+R(W) only with Toast of course). But I only use -R(W) blanks normally, because they cost about the same and they are more compatible with generic DVD-Players. I don't feel like having a pile of both standards when there is no real benefit. I did some tests and it really seems to be true. And I also found the verbatims as the best choice for having reliable results (also on other burners). I tested some OEM/noname brands and I always had problems with them (coasters, read errors, writing speed, etc...).
groovebuster
In the Netherlands there is a levy on blank CD's and DVD's which is supposed to go towards all the copyright holders that who's copyright I violate when I make a back-up of my data (I don't have a large collection of kazaa'd MP3's or DivX's).
I believe it goes to the music industry mostly. The levy on DVD-R is about 1, while the levy on DVD+R is 0.50, IIRC.
The reason for the difference is that supposedly it is easier to pirate content with a -R disc. In the commission that decided on the levy, the major proponent for the difference in levies was Philips.
Philips is a proponent of the DVD+R standard, so there is no conflict of interest there
Anyway, I don't see any reason why Apple would disable +RW functionality in my hardware. If it's just to prevent me from being stupid enough to burn DVD+R's and complain to Apple about them not working in my DVD player, it's patronising to say the least.
M.
increasing superdrive functionality with Panther?
Did anyone with a 'apple-disabled' Superdrive install a Panther pre-release? And did it bring back full functionality? Or would we need a firmware fix (I can't call it an update)?
Any luck anyone?
M.
Did anyone with a 'apple-disabled' Superdrive install a Panther pre-release? And did it bring back full functionality? Or would we need a firmware fix (I can't call it an update)?
Any luck anyone?
M.
Blank DVD-R's bear the a DVD logo just like DVD movies you buy in the store.
DVD+R's do not have the DVD logo. DVD-R is definatly more compatible with older DVD players. Only DVD players that specifically say the support DVD+R's can play vidoe from DVD+Rs.
DVD+R's do not have the DVD logo. DVD-R is definatly more compatible with older DVD players. Only DVD players that specifically say the support DVD+R's can play vidoe from DVD+Rs.
If I recall correctly, the Combo Drive was the default drive for that machine. And the Super Drive was a 2x, so even if it was upgraded with a factory Super Drive, probably not on the +R ability.
Cnet now has an article about Apple supporting DVD+RW
http://news.com.com/2100-1041_3-5090559.html?tag=nefd_top
Personally I only use DVD+R on my PC, and I haven't had any problems using the disc with any of my DVD players, one which is several years old.
I don't really care which format wins, but it seems that DVD+R is going to win out in the end.
http://news.com.com/2100-1041_3-5090559.html?tag=nefd_top
Personally I only use DVD+R on my PC, and I haven't had any problems using the disc with any of my DVD players, one which is several years old.
I don't really care which format wins, but it seems that DVD+R is going to win out in the end.
No. i have an MDD generation powermac with Superdrive and i can tell you it is NOT a +R/RW drive.
How do you find out the brand and model number for a drive through ASP? When I bring mine up (on a new 1GHz 12" PB) alll it says is CD-RW/DVD-ROM.
And BTW, -R is only better on OLD DVD players. Anything sold in the last year/year and a half is going to be able to play +R with very little problems. There are however drive compatibility between the two formats of -R (a and g). While +R will work in ALL forms of DVD-ROM drives, -R drives wont, usually causing problems between an a and a g drive. Id read up on dvdr-digest.com before making a solid discison. I myself am going with the +R/+RW in the form of an HP 200e that Im getting for 125.00 new from OfficeMax. Anyone else out there who is interested get to your local OfficeMax, if they dont have one in stock have them transfer one from a store that does. This is the 200e external drive, with both USA 2 and Firewire cap. Just a friendly headsup for those in the market.
And BTW, -R is only better on OLD DVD players. Anything sold in the last year/year and a half is going to be able to play +R with very little problems. There are however drive compatibility between the two formats of -R (a and g). While +R will work in ALL forms of DVD-ROM drives, -R drives wont, usually causing problems between an a and a g drive. Id read up on dvdr-digest.com before making a solid discison. I myself am going with the +R/+RW in the form of an HP 200e that Im getting for 125.00 new from OfficeMax. Anyone else out there who is interested get to your local OfficeMax, if they dont have one in stock have them transfer one from a store that does. This is the 200e external drive, with both USA 2 and Firewire cap. Just a friendly headsup for those in the market.
I have a Pioneer AO6U that is supported in 10.2.8 and in a developers version of 10.3...My machine is a 1.0Ghz sp mdd...
This drive is +/- and rw
Recognized by iDVD and DVD Studio pro
I use toast for burning rw and +
Another note:
The 1.8 G5 at CompUSA has a Sony +/- drive in it
Hope this helps!
This drive is +/- and rw
Recognized by iDVD and DVD Studio pro
I use toast for burning rw and +
Another note:
The 1.8 G5 at CompUSA has a Sony +/- drive in it
Hope this helps!
You are all unaware of one major problems in macs that this solves.
Most macs have been unable to play DVD+R burned video.
I have a large collection of them and have been pained that they could not be played on macs. I held off on buying a laptop until they fix this problem. So.... this is good news.
Most macs have been unable to play DVD+R burned video.
I have a large collection of them and have been pained that they could not be played on macs. I held off on buying a laptop until they fix this problem. So.... this is good news.
Some info
A couple of comments here that may clear up an issue or two...
First, Apple is being forced to support the plus format, as the major, top line DVD manufactures are slowly merging the two formats.
In the beginning, there was a major compatibility issue, since the minus camp was planning on the R format being the primary recording medium, and the plus camp was planning on ReWritable being their primary medium. The plus camp even went so far as to not require finalizing the medium so that PC backups could happen quicker. Well that, and added the capability to erase individual files off of a disc.
Long and short, the plus camp saw that RW discs were nowhere near as compatible as the R medium, and decided to add it to the spec ( anyone with an old HP/Phillips RW only drive out there? ). Meanwhile, the minus camp did have RW, but it was not as heavily promoted, and later added a VR mode that also does not require finalizing the disc, but greatly reduces compatibility.
Once all of this happened, the largest manufacturers of drives realized that there was very little difference between the formats, and realized that splitting the recordable format would mean death to all. After all, Sony had a real problem when they used Pioneer minus drives in the Vaio PCs, but only sold plus drives over the counter.
Now... There is at least one company selling a burner that will burn the third DVD format ( RAM ), as well as the plus and minus DVD formats. You will find LG drives also sold under IOMEGA. The RAM format is a true data centric format, and as such, will not play in any DVD video player, with maybe the exception of a few Panasonic decks. Apple first supported this format, even though it has really never been a success.
In short, none of this will be an issue in about two years. People will buy a DVD burner, and the right medium to fit their recording needs. The formats are merging.
As for Apple ( remember them ). I have seen several times on MacNN that there is a firmware patch out there that will allow Laptop superdrive owners enable the faster CD burn speeds and enable the RW capabilities of the Panasonic drive they use. Apparently, Apple disables this ability due to wanting to conform to certain specs for the laptop ( power, heat, etc. ). I would not be surprised if they have done the same to the Sony drives they use too.
Here is the link to enable RW on the laptop superdrives, but be warned that your warrantee will not cover any damage that this patch may cause.
http://superdrive.cynikal.net/
I hope all of this helps.
Max
A couple of comments here that may clear up an issue or two...
First, Apple is being forced to support the plus format, as the major, top line DVD manufactures are slowly merging the two formats.
In the beginning, there was a major compatibility issue, since the minus camp was planning on the R format being the primary recording medium, and the plus camp was planning on ReWritable being their primary medium. The plus camp even went so far as to not require finalizing the medium so that PC backups could happen quicker. Well that, and added the capability to erase individual files off of a disc.
Long and short, the plus camp saw that RW discs were nowhere near as compatible as the R medium, and decided to add it to the spec ( anyone with an old HP/Phillips RW only drive out there? ). Meanwhile, the minus camp did have RW, but it was not as heavily promoted, and later added a VR mode that also does not require finalizing the disc, but greatly reduces compatibility.
Once all of this happened, the largest manufacturers of drives realized that there was very little difference between the formats, and realized that splitting the recordable format would mean death to all. After all, Sony had a real problem when they used Pioneer minus drives in the Vaio PCs, but only sold plus drives over the counter.
Now... There is at least one company selling a burner that will burn the third DVD format ( RAM ), as well as the plus and minus DVD formats. You will find LG drives also sold under IOMEGA. The RAM format is a true data centric format, and as such, will not play in any DVD video player, with maybe the exception of a few Panasonic decks. Apple first supported this format, even though it has really never been a success.
In short, none of this will be an issue in about two years. People will buy a DVD burner, and the right medium to fit their recording needs. The formats are merging.
As for Apple ( remember them ). I have seen several times on MacNN that there is a firmware patch out there that will allow Laptop superdrive owners enable the faster CD burn speeds and enable the RW capabilities of the Panasonic drive they use. Apparently, Apple disables this ability due to wanting to conform to certain specs for the laptop ( power, heat, etc. ). I would not be surprised if they have done the same to the Sony drives they use too.
Here is the link to enable RW on the laptop superdrives, but be warned that your warrantee will not cover any damage that this patch may cause.
http://superdrive.cynikal.net/
I hope all of this helps.
Max
I spoke with an A/V engineer at work this morning and he said that the industry is abandoning the minus format in favor of the plus. He said that as a result, we'll NEVER see minus go faster than 4X.
I'll believe it when I see it. Just relaying info I heard.
cheers,
john
I'll believe it when I see it. Just relaying info I heard.
cheers,
john
There should be a little arrow by it that expands to tell more information like manufacturer and model.
From what little I've read, there isn't really a problem with -R, a and g. All the low cost consumer -R drives out are g (general use). The a drives (authoring) are expensive and require more expensive media. Regardless, this site says once burned both are readable in either drive type.
http://www.anandtech.com/guides/viewfaq.html?i=118
That said, it seems +R/RW may have some advantages... having both CAV and CLV writing which gives it an edge in storing computer data files, rather than just DVD video streams.
At any rate, if Panther can now read +R/RW discs in addition to -R/RW, it will be great.