eInk Evangelists May Have to Rewrite Their Sermon...

Discussion in 'iPad' started by bobob, Feb 12, 2010.

  1. bobob macrumors 68030

    bobob

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    #1
    There seems to be a number of fervent supporters of eInk who believe that it is unchallengeably, always the best screen technology for reading text...

    ...but today's NY Times seems to cast some doubt on this gospel truth.

    Do E-Readers Cause Eye Strain? is an article quoting doctors and researchers on the various benefits of the current selection of screen technologies and also compares them to good old fashioned ink & paper books.

    It's a short and interesting read, and provides some facts for your next debate with the true believers in the eInk congregation...
     
  2. chill. macrumors 6502

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    #2
    did you actually read the article?

    it says NOTHING. you were pretty much bamboozled by an op-ed piece that presented very little information.
     
  3. samcraig macrumors P6

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    #3
    I'm glad the NYT was unbiased - as opposed to you - who clearly isn't based on your thread topic and reference to eInk being "religion"

    You could easily slant your post to say that those thinking the iPad will be better than print or eInk are in for a shock.

    I do recommend the link you posted. I don't however think you had anything of value to add. But that's my opinion
     
  4. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    #4
    The OP better go and reread the article because it does not really say anything negative about eink other then maybe this
    The same can be said for reading a book or newspaper.

    Likewise the IPS panels are not all that great
    Viewing angles and glossy screens (and using it outside) are the negatives associated with most LCD panels.

    So again the OP better stop drinking the apple koolaid and realize that eink isn't evil
     
  5. cube macrumors G5

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    #5
    I don't need a study when I know from years of experience that reading on a screen simply cannot be compared to reading paper.
     
  6. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    #6
    Of course eInk evangelists will have to rewrite their sermons because you cannot read it in the dark :p
     
  7. Night Spring macrumors G5

    Night Spring

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    #7
    I believe that OP's point is that while "eink evangelists" believe that eink is unconditionally superior to lcd screens, the NY Times article says that eink is not necessarily better at reducing eye strain. Therefore, if we accept what is stated in the NYT article, then eink proponents would have to rethink / rephrase their position.
     
  8. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    #8
    I've not come across that line of thought, I've heard that is much better then other technology (other then paper and ink) but no technology is the best, they all have short comings in various areas.
     
  9. dave1812dave macrumors 6502a

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    #9

    I've tangled with Kindlers more times than I can count, over their fervent preference for a low contrast, non backlit screen. I've seen numerous e-readers with that type screen and for the life of me can't understand why the Kindlers prefer it. The contrast is so freakishly low that it's annoying to me to look at it. And the lack of a backlight and color is unacceptable. I downloaded a book of photography on my Touch and after browsing through it a bit, wondered what Kindler in their right mind would purchase ANY type of book with color illustrations or photos. Magazines are out of the question, since they rely so heavily on color.

    Kindlers constantly mention 2 things in discussions: battery life, and "easy on the eyes". I say nonsense to both--I have yet to see my Touch's battery die before I'm done with reading sessions extending well past the 90 minute mark. I have no issues reading a Touch screen. No eyestrain, it's crisp, and most importantly, I can read without turning on interior lights. I mostly read in bed with all lights out.

    Does e-ink tech provide longer battery life? Sure it does. And for that one feature, there is much that e-ink (currently) screens don't provide--color, backlighting, video. Heck of a trade-off, IMO!!!
     
  10. 4DThinker macrumors 68020

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    #10
    E-ink is used because it doesn't have to be constantly refreshed, and can maintain a page with no additional power. It's about battery life.

    No Kindle owner would refuse a color screen if it was the same cost and consumed the same low energy of the 16 gray scale e-ink now on Kindles.
     
  11. X_Entity macrumors member

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    Apr 19, 2004
    #11
    I like e-ink. I recently purchased a new sony reader to replace my old sony reader (3 years old) I fully intend to buy an iPad still not sure if I need/want the 3G one but I will get an iPad of some sort. I don't see the iPad replacing my reader in any way. I don't read magazines, or comics, or books on photography. I just read books. I read books for hours at a time on it and due to the screen and the ergonomics of it I find reading on it a most pleasant experience. Plus it fits in my inside coat pocket and goes everywhere with me. I can't see that being the case with the iPad.

    They both have their place. Reading outside in full daylight though, I'd take the reader any day. Glossy screens are just a nightmare in anything other than controlled lighting.
     
  12. marksman macrumors 603

    marksman

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    #12
    e-ink doesn't explode in my pocket and leave a big stain.
     
  13. macduke macrumors 604

    macduke

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    #13
    From the section you quoted, there is nothing actually wrong with the panel. They state "extremely wide viewing angles" so there is no problem with the actual panel. Nowhere in that quote does it say the panel is the problem. It's the bloody glass that causes the problem. Nothing an anti-glare screen protector won't fix. Works like a dream on my iPhone and cost $15 for a two pack. I believe some manufacturers have already announced them for somewhere in the $20-30 range.

    It's surprising to me how many people on these forums have no experience with IPS tech. Though when I think about it and remember that many of you aren't designers, I guess I really shouldn't be surprised at all. In-plane switching is superior to most any other LCD technology out there, perhaps aside from H-IPS, which is what my 26" DoubleSight has, along with a polarizer. IPS contains some of the best color reproduction ability and widest viewing angles available. If the iPad's screen is even half as good as an Apple Cinema Display, people will be amazed at it's quality. I just hope that Apple will eventually allow people to calibrate their own display on devices like this. But I doubt that will happen any time soon. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a good factory calibration on my unit. The iPhone leaves much to be desired in that area, but it's only a phone. This iPad is something more, and is meant to be used to show off photos. Being able to keep my entire portfolio on here is important to me and having at least somewhat accurate color reproduction would be a big plus.
     
  14. bobob thread starter macrumors 68030

    bobob

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    #14
    As you can see from the fervor of the responses to my use of the religious allegory to introduce the linked article, debating the merits of screen technology really isn't that far from a holy war...

    ;)
     
  15. applesupergeek macrumors 6502a

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    #15
    You said it the simplest way, and, as it usually happens, you said it best. :)
     
  16. Chupa Chupa macrumors G5

    Chupa Chupa

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    #16
    The reason eInk appears to be "easier on the eyes" is because its not backlit, just like paper. However, it has a grayish background that makes it difficult to read in dimly lit rooms. Eye strain can occur under those conditions, just as-if you were reading from paper. You can attach a book light to an eink display, but it will produce some glare, again causing eye strain.

    LCD's are, of course, backlit. Eye strain will develop over long reading sessions. Sharper, larger, serif type, can delay eyestrain for a bit. The question is, is there something in the way the iPad is programmed, designed, etc, that reduces the back-lighting to the effect that eye strain is further delayed for all by the heartiest readers.

    I know people talk about reading for hours, but realistically, who really has the time or attention span for that? A small % of the book reading population which isn't that big anyway. Most iPad reading will be Web, email, magazines, comic books, newspapers -- all things that are read in bursts.

    I fully expect there will always be eInk "purists," just like there are vinyl album "purists." The general population, however, will go with the most flexible technology and adapt to it's flaws since no technology is perfect.
     
  17. steve-p macrumors 68000

    steve-p

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    #17
    You appear to be wanting it to be a religious war since that's the phraseology you chose to use to title and start the thread. On top of that, in typical religious manner, you read an interpretation supporting your own view into a fairly neutral article debating the strengths and weaknesses of both types of screen. If this thread is a religious war, you started it by choosing unnecessarily provocative language, so duh :rolleyes:
     
  18. 4DThinker macrumors 68020

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    #18
    I don't need a study. E-ink and LCDs can be (and are) compared over and over again, with each having it own benefits. I say look at the screen before you buy it. Buy the one that's easiest to read. ;)
     
  19. bobob thread starter macrumors 68030

    bobob

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    #19
    Referring to my original post above, can you please detail:

    1. My "interpretation" of the article
    2. My "own view" that this interpretation was supporting.

    Thank-you in advance.

    :)
     
  20. chill. macrumors 6502

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    #20
    cut out this passive aggressive bull. just admit you were wrong
     
  21. t0mat0 macrumors 603

    t0mat0

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    #21
    WAsn't there a gizmodo article on this also? Or was this referencing NYT?
     
  22. Toadkillerdog macrumors member

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    #22
    My, you are testy! It is an interesting issue, but a no brainer for me. I repeat, for me. Others may have different needs.

    I think the article shows that neither technology has absolute merits over the other for ebook reading. Read the Kindle in bright light or outdoors and it may be superior. Turn down the lights and it is inferior. I read indoors and in the evening with the light low or in bed.

    I personally just won't spend several hundred dollars for a device that only allows me to read books. The iPad, however, is getting more interesting to me everyday.
     
  23. nightfly13 macrumors 6502a

    nightfly13

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    #23
    Present Apple devices with IPS screen?

    I have a current generation MBP and tomorrow I'll get an iPhone 3GS. Does this mean I haven't yet used an IPS screen? I LOVE the LED display on my MBP, and even like the screen on my 2G iPhone, but I'm curious if there's a noticeable benefit from IPS technology. Guess I'll find out tomorrow.

    Apple's MBP spec page doesn't mention IPS.

    Only the 3GS and new Cinema Display have IPS presently? 27" iMac?
     
  24. Bytor65 macrumors 6502a

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    Canada
    #24
    I have only seen cheap TN screens on laptops in recent years. Look at your laptop screen from below, does it darken dramatically or invert? Then it is TN.

    If it doesn't, then you have IPS or VA, it gets hard to tell the difference between those, but they are close in quality (I still prefer IPS).
     
  25. bobob thread starter macrumors 68030

    bobob

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    #25
    They walk among us! :eek:
     

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