EU Right to Repair Rules Force Companies to Fix Out-of-Warranty Devices

[ApplesAreSweet&Sour]

this will cost companies extra $$$ for each model they release.

and I'm sure companies will eat the costs and totally not charge more to customers for every new product they release.

why stop there? go for free 10 year warranty for all yeah!! make companies pay for everything! throw in free accidental damage coverage too!! let's gooooo

you just played yourselves. 👏

You do realize that consumers being able to keep their devices longer leads to lower demand for new iPhones thus forcing Apple and other smartphone makers to lower prices and/or increase value/$ to incentivize consumers to buy new when they don't need to?

And that no consumer demographic has endless money or will spend endless money?

Apple would gladly add another $1000 or more to all iPhone prices today if they could get away with it and didn't see sales numbers plummet as a result.

But obviously, the average iPhone and consumer at large buyer cannot pay $1999 every 2-4 years for a smartphone. Especially not when their old device is only about 10-20% slower than the latest and greatest that Apple needs you to buy before you think.

The current iPhone prices are very meticulously calculated to fit what Apple wants vs. what it thinks consumers will pay.

This argument is riducouls.

Additionally, demand for new iPhones has been artificially high since the first one launched because Apple makes it so costly and cumbersome to fix them or get a replacement at a fair price.

Furthermore, Apple further increased demand by shredding functional devices (yes, literally) for years instead of recycling them or selling them refurbished or second hand https://9to5mac.com/2024/04/18/100000-iphones-stolen-instead-of-scrapped/

What the EU is doing here will lower prices or increase value/$ of future devices while prices stay the same.

Share holders will have to accept lower profit margins while consumers get better, longer lasting products.

It's just a win for most of us.

 

[jarman92]

Currently, if an iPhone part is replaced with a like-for-like replacement by an unofficial third party, it may not be recognised by the iPhone's system software.

Pretty sure Apple has already addressed this: https://www.macrumors.com/2024/04/11/apple-to-allow-used-parts-for-repairs/

 

[whoknows2597]

“Additionally, manufacturers will be unable to refuse to repair a product solely for economic reasons or because it was previously repaired by someone else.”

Yikes! Imagine going to a shady place to get a repair, only for the replacement parts to break. Who knows what else might have been damaged in the process. I imagine that repairing “replacement” parts will be even more expensive

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I mean that's what customers should do now instead of enacting laws.

Well we need the laws too as it enables us to have warranties and access to support for a reasonable length of time instead of just 12 months which many other countries have. If I pay £1k to £1500 for an iPhone, I want it to be capable of being repaired locally and have a warranty for a few years, just like my TV and washing machine do which are much cheaper products.

 

[JapanApple]

iPhone 14 Pro Max is $350 more expensive in Germany.


you've paid for AppleCare and them some but got less.

Japan it's even more costly.

 

[sw1tcher]

many credit card companies have stopped offering extra warranty for electronics because it's been too costly.

my Costco visa included. BS what?

https://www.reddit.com/r/Costco/comments/zy4kfw

The Costco extended warranty is standard. You don't need a credit card to get it, so I don't know why you're even bringing that up. You can pay with cash at Costco and you will still have a 2 year warranty. It's all part of Costco's Concierge service.

connection at your service concierge | Costco

www.costco.com

What is Costco Concierge Services?

Costco Concierge Services is a free technical support center available to Costco members who have purchased select electronics or appliances from Costco. All electronics and appliance purchases are covered by a 90-day return policy (instituted in 2007), and, as added protection, Costco extends the manufacturer's warranty for a second year at no additional charge on the following devices: televisions, tuner-free displays, computers and major appliances.

 

[leman]

Simple is to stop company's abusing their position, playing the fool is and has never been a good defence. EU is standing up and acting on the consumers behalf, sadly it has legislate as companies such as Apple only care about profit.

The EU's requirement's are far from unreasonable. Why some are against them is another story, well unless they are paid to do so...

Q-6

I don't think it is a reasonable requirement to maintain production of replacement parts for 20 year old phones for example. The costs for doing so would be exorbitant. I do think however that providing repairs for 7 years (but not beyond that) is reasonable. A legislation that would require unlimited hardware support would be extremely harmful, as it would punish manufacturers for making changes. Luckily, it does not seem like this is what the EU legislation does. They still work with time limits.

Of course, it all depends on the product category and the expected lifespan/area of technology. Smartphone tech moves faster than computer tech which moves faster than say, dishwashers.

 

[chmania]

It's good to live in the EU!

 

[DaPhox]

It's good to live in the EU!

Totally depends where…

 

[Queen6]

I don't think it is a reasonable requirement to maintain production of replacement parts for 20 year old phones for example. The costs for doing so would be exorbitant. I do think however that providing repairs for 7 years (but not beyond that) is reasonable. A legislation that would require unlimited hardware support would be extremely harmful, as it would punish manufacturers for making changes. Luckily, it does not seem like this is what the EU legislation does. They still work with time limits.

Of course, it all depends on the product category and the expected lifespan/area of technology. Smartphone tech moves faster than computer tech which moves faster than say, dishwashers.

Nobody is asking that your just pointing to extremes to validate your position. Frankly you should know better, sadly you appear to favour Apple over a fair deal for the consumer.

If companies were not solely driven by the greed of the shareholders such legislation would not be required, they are and therefore such laws are passed. Apple is in a unique position as it controls all aspects of it's devices. Yet Apple is set firm on planned obsolescence, avoidance of repair outside of it's own domain and more than happy to add to the worlds landfills versus reuse to gain a few more $$$.

If Apple wants to be taken seriously on such matters it needs to do not just talk and juggle the numbers so it can brag about being carbon neutral. EU is looking at a bigger picture, Apple is only focused on it's bottom line which is blatantly obvious...

Q-6

 

[chmania]

Totally depends where…

Absolutely!

 

[Fuzzball84]

this will cost companies extra $$$ for each model they release.

and I'm sure companies will eat the costs and totally not charge more to customers for every new product they release.

why stop there? go for free 10 year warranty for all yeah!! make companies pay for everything! throw in free accidental damage coverage too!! let's gooooo

you just played yourselves. 👏

Well, if you want to live on a contaminated polluted plant… continue playing as you are.

Bravo, Bravo 👏👏👏

 

[jlc1978]

The issue is as a customer you don’t know what parts were actually touched and potentially damaged during the repair.

Which is why reputable companies run diagnostics an/or let the customer know of additional issues uncovered when starting the repair to get the approval to repair all problems so the machine works properly when it is returned to the customer. If they don't approve the repairs a company should be free to refuse any repair work; for example you come in with a cracked screen and dead battery and only want a battery. A company should not be forced to replace just the battery and risk possibly further breaking the screen during the repair and now forced to replace the previously damaged screen for free.

It’s reasonable to expect a repair to result in a product that is guaranteed to work for at least another year.

No, it's reasonable to expect the part replaced to last another year, not that all the parts will last another year. For example, if you replace a screen that doesn't mean a failing battery should be replaced within the screens one year additional warranty.

I'd love for Worten to have to fix my microwave for any failures after they replaced the latch, but I doubt that is teh EU's intent.

The customer doesn’t want “please repair the screen but feel free to break some other component”,

Repair caused damage is a seperate issue, and the one time Apple did that they made it right for me.

they want “please make it so that the device is in proper working condition again”.

They should also expect to pay to repair all damage, beyond cosmetic, or absolve the repairer from any responsibility for fixing any other damage. If the existing damage makes repairing another component impossible then it should be an all or nothing situation.

If companies are forced to extend full warranty coverage on a device for failures beyond the repaired parts everyone will pay in the form of higher costs initially and for repairs. If it's just for the repaired part then the impact will be minor, as I expect most repaired parts last at least a year if the repair is done by a legitimate company.

It would be interesting to see if the one year warranty rule will preempt otehr protections since teh EU would have specifically called out a legal requirement for warranty duration.

 

[AlexESP]

Apple and every other phone manufacturer have had the ability to design products that are easy to repair for decades. They don't, partly because there wasn't a customer desire and because they'd rather sell you a new one and another 3 years of services. These laws are not aimed at making devices more expensive but rather to put another point on the design spec sheet.

There is no reason why the iPhone 17 couldn't be a bit thicker (and maybe get a bigger battery?) to accommodate some extra magnets and screws to make things removable. A shift to polycarbonate backs instead of glass would also make things easier. At the end of the day its a design problem and one easily overcome.

Turns out there is a reason, and it’s that customers hate thicker and plastic-made phones. So there is no easy-to-overcome design problem here.

 

[Supermallet]

Amazing how many people are clutching their pearls and crying “Won’t someone think of the poor electronics manufacturers!” These are extremely common sense, consumer friendly regulations. I loathe the mentality that companies should be free to do anything at anyone else’s expense.

 

[cocky jeremy]

You do realize that consumers being able to keep their devices longer leads to lower demand for new iPhones thus forcing Apple and other smartphone makers to lower prices and/or increase value/$ to incentivize consumers to buy new when they don't need to?

And that no consumer demographic has endless money or will spend endless money?

Apple would gladly add another $1000 or more to all iPhone prices today if they could get away with it and didn't see sales numbers plummet as a result.

But obviously, the average iPhone and consumer at large buyer cannot pay $1999 every 2-4 years for a smartphone. Especially not when their old device is only about 10-20% slower than the latest and greatest that Apple needs you to buy before you think.

The current iPhone prices are very meticulously calculated to fit what Apple wants vs. what it thinks consumers will pay.

This argument is riducouls.

Additionally, demand for new iPhones has been artificially high since the first one launched because Apple makes it so costly and cumbersome to fix them or get a replacement at a fair price.

Furthermore, Apple further increased demand by shredding functional devices (yes, literally) for years instead of recycling them or selling them refurbished or second hand https://9to5mac.com/2024/04/18/100000-iphones-stolen-instead-of-scrapped/

What the EU is doing here will lower prices or increase value/$ of future devices while prices stay the same.

Share holders will have to accept lower profit margins while consumers get better, longer lasting products.

It's just a win for most of us.

So, you actually believe forcing companies to fix stuff out of warranty, thus costing them MORE money, will make them charge LESS for products? 🤣

 

[hans1972]

There is no reason why the iPhone 17 couldn't be a bit thicker (and maybe get a bigger battery?)

There are at least two reasons:

1) The iPhone will become thicker
2) The iPhone will become heavier

2) is extremely negative to me, but also 1) is pretty negative.

 

[hans1972]

Stop spreading mis-information.

Australia has had min 2 year standard warranties for a long time. Also any device needs to last for as long as is expected. For example, a TV should last up to 10 years. It's called consumer rights. You are already paying through the nose for tech and if a company is selling you a product, they should have quality and repairability built into the price.

Are you saying consumer electronics are as cheap in Australia as in the US?

 

[leman]

Nobody is asking that your just pointing to extremes to validate your position. Frankly you should know better, sadly you appear to favour Apple over a fair deal for the consumer.

What a strange thing to say. I thought we are discussing which repair timeframes are reasonable? What do you have to say about this specific topic? Your comments are so abstract that I don't even know what they pertain to.

If companies were not solely driven by the greed of the shareholders such legislation would not be required, they are and therefore such laws are passed. Apple is in a unique position as it controls all aspects of it's devices. Yet Apple is set firm on planned obsolescence, avoidance of repair outside of it's own domain and more than happy to add to the worlds landfills versus reuse to gain a few more $$$.

I always thought that Apple's repair policies are quote good in comparison to many other manufacturers. I mean, they do offer 7 years of hardware support (sometimes longer), which cannot be said for many others. Of course there are many areas where they can do better, and it is important to target these areas with well-designed legislations. In terms of providing repairs for older devices I don't see how this EU initiative affects Apple at all.

 

[.wojtek]

This is awesome, and will be a very good step away from the buy-and-throw-away-culture. Good job EU, again.

Exactly! Imagine that years ago companies build solid devices that simply LASTED but because of constant need to grow and sell more and more they simply started cutting corners and artificially age products... Old fringe was good for 10-15 years and new ones can break after 2 years (when the mandatory warranty expires)...

Hope they would push minimum warranty for small electronics for 3 years and bigger appliances (fridge, washers, etc) to 5-10 years mark...

 

[kpluck]

According to the legislation, if a consumer chooses to have their device repaired under warranty, the warranty must be extended by a year. Consumers may also borrow a device while theirs is being repaired, and if it cannot be fixed, they have the right to opt for a refurbished unit as an alternative.

I see a lot of people breaking their own phones to extend their warranty every year.

-kp

 

[hans1972]

Ooh no, those poor companies that are racking in billions, whatever will they do when they *checks notes* have to stock spare parts as they already have been doing for decades?

They haven't.

For mobile phones and similar consumer electronics, they will have to have parts available for 7 years after last sale of a product.

Do you really think the Chinese producers have stocked parts for the hundreds (or maybe even thousands) of models released in the EU for the last 7 years?

 

[cfountain72]

It is a reasonable change I think and prevents companies stopping the owners of their products getting devices repaired at non OEM sources.

If Apple pass on silly costs when their products are already eye wateringly expensive, I simply won't buy them. It has to be a measured response as Apple would ultimately be the loser if they price consumers out.

Why stop here? Next up, maybe the EU will simply demand that device prices not be above certain amount ('reasonable') as well. 🤦‍♂️

 

[hans1972]

Simple is to stop company's abusing their position, playing the fool is and has never been a good defence. EU is standing up and acting on the consumers behalf, sadly it has legislate as companies such as Apple only care about profit.

The EU's requirement's are far from unreasonable. Why some are against them is another story, well unless they are paid to do so...

The regulation would be unreasonable if there weren't a time limit or the time limit was very long.

If there were no time regulation, a consumer's relative could demand repair 200 years from now.

 

[Ctrlos]

Turns out there is a reason, and it’s that customers hate thicker and plastic-made phones. So there is no easy-to-overcome design problem here.

Aye, they buy a glass slab and then envelop it in silicon for its entire life so it won’t get damaged.