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This whole hearing is pointless; it should have never happened!
So Congress decided to pick on Apple? McCain is acting like a loser, with very vague arguments and also lack of knowledge of the iPhone (when he ask about the need to constantly update his apps). I'm glad he never got to be President; it's time for him to retire.

Congress, the blame you are trying to impose on Apple has always existed; just look at the Oil Companies, International Traders, etc.

Keep bullying on Apple, and they should consider leaving the U.S. and operate from another country that is not as ungrateful as this one. No wonder products "Made in the U.S.A." have diminished so much. I would still buy their products.
 
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yet they couldnt answer why they acted differently with profit in the americas compared to the rest of the world.
Levin would not let them complete a statement. He kept trying to imply Apple decided in 2008 to transfer assets to Ireland but in reality they had used this as the base of operations for their European and Asian expansion starting in 1980. I'm sure Levin wouldn't have had a problem with arrangement when the bulk of Apple's money was made here. The success of their international business has greatly expanded since the iPhone and presented the issue at hand. This money was mostly reinvested to spur the growth they have managed. Levin realized he was wrong but he was too deep in to turn back. He needed to make a statement. If I was managing your 401K and grew it to an enormous level by diversifying over seas, would I be working in your best interest to move your fund back to the states where it would be tax again at 35% then you would be taxed when I sent it to you? You would most likely prefer to leave it where it is and and continue to get the interest on it, by the way does get taxed in the US. They are giving a lot back to shareholders so they will be taxed on it anyway.
 
Tax Code

Apple pays plenty! The reason more & more big business moves out of US is the tax code and the cost of overhead for employee's get more benefits that is more then their pay in some cases! Good employee's that are worth it are hard to come by!

We have successful family business that's getting harder & harder every year do to nonsense like this.
What about Exxon etc., why were they not there, and don't answer they're not doing what Apple is doing! Where is Google in all of this, I don't know Google's or Exons tax bills but I'm sure they know how to pay less in taxes with the same laws being used by Apple!

All company's and people with money exploit taxes with are own tax code, designed to protect the wealthy with these legal loopholes! Apple is doing nothing wrong but being successful!:cool:

Apple is better publicity for the Senators then the the others! I'm disappointed in Senator McCain, I do respect the man but hes off base here!:cool:

Apple is doing more good for America then any other company, with jobs, and the way we do are jobs!!!:apple::apple::apple:
 
I didn't watch any of it, but hearings like this are typically a sham. The legislative committee that is supposed to write the laws is so beholden to the special interest groups and lobbyists, they really can do nothing but grandstand.

In the case of flat taxes, the reason you will *never* see one implemented is that then the Congress will have no special influence to peddle in exchange for campaign donations and cushy lobbying jobs with the corporations and other special interest groups when they leave.

I noticed that. It was all basically posturing, including Rand Paul's rants. Call someone in to testify, then talk at the person rather than take note of the responses. What were they going to ask anyway? If it was a question of logistics, Tim Cook might have needed to consult someone for the figures anyway. He can't keep every statistic with him at all times and would not wish to deliver an inaccurate response.


Correct, it's taxed as ordinary income...
I think the advantage with S-corp has something to do with getting around payroll taxes (the profit is subject to taxes as ordinary income but not subject to payroll taxes)... so the IRS will look out for people that intentionally give themselves a really low wage but high profit distribution.

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If it was owned by an individual, they would pay those taxes anyway. Things like social security are always paid somewhere. S-corps do not get out of this. If you're an owner or you are self employed, you pay 100% of it in the form of self employment tax. If you are paid by wages, the employer portion is still paid. I'm not sure what would really be avoided rather than pushed around. If you pay self employment tax, 50% of that (the employer portion) is taken as a later deduction when calculating federal taxes.
 
... McCain is acting like a loser, with very vague arguments and also lack of knowledge of the iPhone (when he ask abou the need to constantly update his apps). I'm glad he never got to be President; it's time for him to retire.
...

Tim was probably thinking: Man, I'm glad this one didn't make it on to the Apple BoD!

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Rand Paul is 100% right. Those senators should have been summoning Cook to receive an award or congratulation on behalf of the company, or perhaps provide advice on balancing the budget.

Taken advice from Rand Paul? Sorry, but all Rand Paul is advocating is the abolishment of central government for his own political aspirations.

What is wrong is the same companies that lobbied to create a system they can circumvent have overplayed their hands.

That's every single Fortune 1000 company.

The GOP grandstands about improving the tax code and all we got from Rand Paul is what he didn't say: Don't touch the tax code as it stands. He is in the game and loves abusing it.
 
"Hate the game, not the players. Now, how much do you want for this building and all the cantankerous ***** in it? I'll buy every last one of you, because I'm Tim Cook, bitches. You'll be working for the United States of Apple faster than you can say 'tax reform' unless you back the **** up right now. Peace out."

This (among many other reasons) is why I'm not the Apple CEO.
 
McCaskill's question is great.

So if Apple is really just about minimizing tax burdens as a matter of doing what you can within the law to maximize profit for your shareholders -- as they say, and as their defenders here say -- why not shift the company entirely off-shore?

Cook had two options: admit he was screwing his shareholders by not doing that, or admit that there's more to it than just maximizing profits. He choose (b) -- "we're an American company" -- but couldn't explain why it wasn't unAmerican to hide 70% of your profits from America..

I'll explain it on his behalf. Profits that are not earned in America aren't subject to taxation by America. Profits are subject to taxation in the country where they are earned, so even if Apple relocated overseas it would still be subject to taxes owed on account of their U.S. sales, just as Samsung is today. And, as you may know, most of Apple's revenue is not generated in the U.S.

Unfortunately, it takes a good bit of study and experience to fully understand the complexities of taxation of global enterprises, both from the perspective of the world's taxing authorities, and from the point of view of the muli-national corporations. There is nothing simplistic or intuitive about any of it, and only the most naive would attempt to address the issues from some simple chauvinistic or moralistic starting point.

For example, many countries are far more interested in generating economic activity to provide jobs (which in turn provide a tax base with a multiplier effect, as well as to support social stability) then they are in collecting corporate taxes. . Such a government might well forego taxing a company that wishes to build factories and stores and to offer construction and retail jobs to its citizens. In the end, such countries believe, they will garner more overall tax revenue while creating a healthier and more productive society.

That a company like Apple pays no taxes to such a country creates no obligation--legal or otherwise--to pay any more tax to the country where it happens to have its headquarters.

Were the U.S. to require taxes to be paid on non-repatriated foreign income earned by companies headquartered in the U.S., there would be far fewer companies with overseas operations headquartered here, and far less economic activity and jobs in the U.S. The world has become much more competitive, and America is no longer such an advantageous place to be that it's worth substantially diluting global shareholder value for the privilege of having a +1 in front of your main office phone number. Congress knows this very well, and while some may grandstand for the cameras, their staffs will point out how self-defeating short-sighted corporate tax policy could be.

Campaign contributions, bribes, or currying favor with the rich, are silly explanations for our tax laws. They are written as they are because it is in the best interests of America to balance the need to maximize overall tax revenue against encouraging the maximum amount of domestic economic activity.

Apple certainly doesn't need to apologize for obeying the tax laws of every one of the countries it sells or operates in, and Congress doesn't need to fix corporate tax law to address any glaring injustice.

Whether some politicians need to apologize for stirring up a largely uninformed public at the expense of a law-abiding corporation that has contributed six billion dollars to the Treasury while providing directly and indirectly jobs for hundreds of thousands of Americans who also pay taxes is quite another question.
 
hahah

Yep, they need to fix the tax law. I don't care what company it is, I'm sure all major companies are doing the same thing, who cares.
 
+1
You nailed it. This isn't about being "moral". It is about following the law.
In my understanding, tax codes are supposed to be black and white. There are no middle points. There is the right way to do it, and the wrong way to do it. There are several ways of doing it right, and several ways of doing it wrong, but all of them are equally right or wrong.
 
Yep, they need to fix the tax law. I don't care what company it is, I'm sure all major companies are doing the same thing, who cares.

It needs to be resolved internationally by at least getting the US, EU etc to close this loophole. Apple aren't doing anything wrong here and certainly nothing different to many multinational companies. The problem is that these companies have outgrown the nation state and therefore jurisdiction for much of their income falls outside of the US. We're having the same debate in the UK.

Lots of politicians using this issue to highlight the injustice of it all without actually bringing forward any legislation because they know how difficult this is to implement without provoking a significant round of job losses or even worse protectionism.
 
I agree. As long as its a law for eveyone not just for corporations. But wait, do you want individuals to pay less than 30% on revenue?

Why? Just use the Apple tax code... 30% of revenue, no exceptions. Not profit, revenue.
 
Two things jump out at me right away:

First, this whole set of accusations seem to be based on nonsense. Taking advantage of tax breaks, if its lawfully done, is fully legit. Don't like it? Change the tax codes. But don't expect anyone, especially a company, to not take advantage of legal tax breaks. It would be foolish for them not to.

As far as Apple pointing out that they create jobs, are making their Mac mini in the US, etc., that was a total non sequitur. There is no reason to point that out because they are being judged on what they are doing (regarding taxes) and whether it is legal or not. When an entity is put on trial for something, one cannot argue, "but look at all the nice things we have done" in order to erase a wrong. Lessen the pain of a sentence, maybe, but that's not even what we are talking about here. Same goes for pointing out how much the company DID pay in taxes. Makes no difference. If it could have been cut in half, but still legit, great. If any of it was illegitimate breaks, even if the sum of those was a small fraction if what was paid, that's a problem.
 
Taken advice from Rand Paul? Sorry, but all Rand Paul is advocating is the abolishment of central government for his own political aspirations.

What is wrong is the same companies that lobbied to create a system they can circumvent have overplayed their hands.

That's every single Fortune 1000 company.

The GOP grandstands about improving the tax code and all we got from Rand Paul is what he didn't say: Don't touch the tax code as it stands. He is in the game and loves abusing it.

I'm not a huge Rand Paul fan, but that is no preclusion for acknowledging him when his is right. You should be mature enough to understand that.

I also don't see why you think the tax system was created by large corporations. Do you have anything to support that? Do you also suppose that corporations are responsible for the growing deficit despite increased taxes?
 
I want the same deal as corporations: only pay taxes on my profits.

It's scary. Honestly. You don't even understand how corporate taxes work on a basic level.

Yes, that would be nice if things worked the way you suggested. It's too bad that what's left of those profits is taxed AGAIN (income tax) when you pay yourself. Unless you're small like a sole proprietorship, partnership, or LLC (in which profits losses are applied directly to your personal income tax), that's the reality of the matter.
 
I'm not referring to profit track record (they can be making a boat load for all I care) ... but with taxes, GM wiped off 45B in taxes during re-listing and paid zero taxes in 2011 (their highest recorded profit year, ever).

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I assure you over the course of their history as a company, GM has paid plenty of taxes in Michigan. The last year was an aberration as they were in default. No worries, GM will pay their fair share of taxes again. I'm sure that Levin, despite his many possible faults, is not lamenting that GM's HQ is in Michigan.

Levin embarrassed himself, badly.

Kind of agree here, as did everyone who showed up to that meeting to complain that our tax laws are stupid, and that Apple didn't do the "right thing" anyway. What a ridiculous joke.
 
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