Expensive Software

[RobHague]

Why is software so damn expensive to the casual user? Ok so people probably wont agree with me but I just wanted to share my opinion.

Take Office, its £100 here to get the Student and Teacher Edition of Office 2004. That's not too bad but it does not include Access or Outlook. 😕 Next version up (so you can get Access or Outlook) is the standard edition, which is £349.

I don't need Office 2004 enough to want to pay £100, let alone £349... but its more or less the standard software used in business. It's the best out there for what it does - So if im going to use anything id rather my experience be with a product that ill find in use elsewhere. Again if i need the use of a Spreadsheet/Database id rather my experience be with a 'standard' product. It's not just the fact that its the most used either, its also the best tool for the job - lets face it.

My main issue though is not Office, which is something I would have liked, but Photoshop!

£500 for me to get hold of a legal copy of Adobe Photoshop CS2. I mean wtf!! 😕 I am not using it in a 'professional' or 'profitable' capasity, I like creating graphics, images etc - Its what I used at college (and whats still used in college for the graphics courses) but im still expected to pay £500! Considering how often Adobe update their products too it would be a poor investment in terms of how quicky it will be 'superceeded' by the next version. I know it will work forever even after Adobe bring out CS7... but working with outdated tools isnt ideal, and the 'upgrade' prices are £139! Not as bad as £500 but jeeze.

Ok, so when i bought my Mac, if i had factored in the prices of this software - the PowerMac i bought would have not been able to meet my needs. Trade off on the hardware for software? 😕 didnt seem to make sense.

When i used my PC - I just ended up getting Photoshop and Office one way or another. I know people that work at universitys etc so i can get a copy, or there is P2P. It wasent the best solution, but it was that or my computer's usefulness droped 90%. I bought evrything else, games and such that were within my reach. Since getting my Mac, I wanted to get all the productivity software (well i only use Office and Photoshop but you get the point) legit but im looking at around another £1000!

I guess my point is that there should be versions of Adobe/Office for non-profit use (and not just for students) I would be more than happy with a copy of Adobe Photoshop for £50-£90 with the stipulation that i could not use the software for 'company' or 'profitable' use.

Ok well anyway thats my moan for today 😉

 

[Sun Baked]

Hint...

Cheap alternative: paper, pencils, calculator, and crayons.

 

[Applespider]

I guess my point is that there should be versions of Adobe/Office for non-profit use (and not just for students) I would be more than happy with a copy of Adobe Photoshop for £50-£90 with the stipulation that i could not use the software for 'company' or 'profitable' use.

Adobe will tell you that that's why they created Photoshop Elements (yes, I know it doesn't have all the features) since it's considered advanced enough for the average consumer.

It would be a nice idea though since I'm another in the 'want but can't justify buying camp' so it was lucky that work switched to buying CS2 for the PC (at full price since it was too much hassle - according to them - to change the Mac licence over) and I was able to grab their old CS1 Mac software for £20 in a sale.

 

[devilot]

Hint...

Cheap alternative: paper, pencils, calculator, and crayons.

Last I checked, those didn't help you really edit digital photographs or even tangible, physical photographs. 😉

:edit: To the OP, your sentiments mirror mine, except I am still a student so I could still get the CS2 but it's still about $400. I'm not sure how it works in the UK, but here in the States you could just sign up for one class at a local community college and then have the viable paperwork to show to academic-pricing websites to purchase the academic versions of software.

 

[ChrisBrightwell]

Adobe will tell you that that's why they created Photoshop Elements (yes, I know it doesn't have all the features) since it's considered advanced enough for the average consumer.

Is Photoshop Elements available on OS X? I haven't seen it.

 

[Blue Velvet]

If you're a registered charity in the UK, you can purchase Adobe products at the edu price -- you need that registered charity number and status though.

Personally, I think these prices are fair. To most professionals, the price of Photoshop is nothing compared to the cost of some of their other equipment. It's a pittance for many studios... which is who the product is aimed at.

 

[Sdashiki]

Ill just use Adobe as my example cuz they are so easy for this purpose:

everyone and their brother has/had Photoshop on their machine (dont lie)

and yet, most of those were NOT purchased. They got the program onto their machines by "other means". And I believe Adobe and lots of companies like them, are content with this pirating, to an extent.

When it boils down to it, Photoshop/Illustrator/InDesign etc are used by professional commercial shops. They make money using the software, and if you make enough and become big enough you get noticed. Eventually Adobe will come knocking and ask for a serial #. This keeps college students from making money with academic stuff, but only LARGE amounts of money cuz how would Adobe know unless they read about it in MacWorld or something.

Anyway I think companies put up with pirating like Photoshop because they know that Commercial users WILL pay for it, and WILL pay the high amount for the software. Photoshop has decades of coding put into it, it is well worth its pricetag. Some software may not be worth such a high price tag, but if you dont like it, go download it somewhere else.

In the end to make money with software, you must pay for it.

 

[Blue Velvet]

Anyway I think companies put up with pirating like Photoshop because they know that Commercial users WILL pay for it, and WILL pay the high amount for the software.

I don't think they're putting up with anything any more. Hence the proliferation of these 'activation' schemes. Creative Suite, Quark, etc...

 

[20rogersc]

Is Photoshop Elements available on OS X? I haven't seen it.

Yes it is, but most PC shops only sell the Windoze version.

::20ROGERSC::

 

[CanadaRAM]

everyone and their brother has/had Photoshop on their machine (dont lie)

and yet, most of those were NOT purchased. They got the program onto their machines by "other means". And I believe Adobe and lots of companies like them, are content with this pirating, to an extent....
Anyway I think companies put up with pirating like Photoshop because they know that Commercial users WILL pay for it, and WILL pay the high amount for the software. Photoshop has decades of coding put into it, it is well worth its pricetag. Some software may not be worth such a high price tag, but if you dont like it, go download it somewhere else.

In the end to make money with software, you must pay for it.

Wrong, both on the software publisher's point of view and on the legal/ethical front. It matters not a bit whether you are making money with it, or planning to make money with it, or "I'll pay for it when I make enough money to justify it". I'm not planning to make money as a taxi driver, so it'd be OK if I 'jacked your car then?

I have had lots of discussions with Adobe, Macromedia and Microsoft. They absolutely reject the idea of "casual piracy promote sales".

If you don't have the money for the professional tool --- do without. Don't steal. Everything else is just a lame rationalization for greed.

Yes. Greed. Yours.

You want something for nothing because for some imagined reason you are 'entitled' to it and the rest of us schmucks are not.

 

[ChrisBrightwell]

Yes it is, but most PC shops only sell the Windoze version.

Wow. I had no idea.

I hate GIMP. I need to get a copy of Photoshop Elements.

 

[iGav]

I don't think they're putting up with anything any more. Hence the proliferation of these 'activation' schemes.

I'm more of the opinion that they want to be seen to be actually cracking down on illegal use, both Adobe's and Macromedia's attempts at activation are piss poor, if they REALLY wanted to lock it down, they could do it... but they don't... or won't.

They're very much aware that (some) students use their software illegally, but it's a fine balancing act... todays students are tomorrows professionals. 😉

but working with outdated tools isnt ideal

You'd be surprised how many companies don't go to the expense of maintaining their software to the latest and greatest versions with every release.

It's not essential that you know the absolute latest version... Photoshop essentially hasn't changed that much since Version 3, and it's still reasonably common to find designers still using Photoshop 5 and 6.

Whilst it's not ideal... it's also certainly not an insurmountable problem.

 

[RobHague]

It matters not a bit whether you are making money with it, or planning to make money with it, or "I'll pay for it when I make enough money to justify it". I'm not planning to make money as a taxi driver, so it'd be OK if I 'jacked your car then?

I have had lots of discussions with Adobe, Macromedia and Microsoft. They absolutely reject the idea of "casual piracy promote sales".

If you don't have the money for the professional tool --- do without. Don't steal. Everything else is just a lame rationalization for greed.

I like how people like to see 'piracy' and theft with no distinction. Obviously if i walked into my local software store and stole a copy of Office 2004 off the shelf that is no different to me going to a P2P and downloading a copy.

theft ( P ) Pronunciation Key (thft)
n.
The act or an instance of stealing; larceny.
Obsolete. Something stolen.

Steal
To take (the property of another) without right or permission.

How can someone tar with the same brush - stealing a car, or shoplifting, or breaking into someones house and removing its contents - with downloading something over P2P. That argument is used all the time "OMFG PIRACY IS THEFT HOW WOULD U LIKE IT IF I STOLE UR CAR".

What we are talking about is not pysical property or removing an object or a pysical thing from someones possession. Its intellectual property.

A product of the intellect that has commercial value, including copyrighted property such as literary or artistic works, and ideational property, such as patents, appellations of origin, business methods, and industrial processes.

You are in breech of the Copyright/EULA. You do not have permission to use the software. Of course if people think that someone downloading Office on a P2P network should get the same punishment as someone who holds up a retail store and steals a number of goods -- then go you. 😕

As for 'doing without' well that attitude can work for other things too. Do people really need houses to live? In these poorer countrys im sure they can manage so they should do without... does a person really need a phone? they can do without. Internet? A luxury - Do without. Usually people get help to make sure they dont have to 'do without'. The software industry is not in the same league as povety but MS/Adobe and other companys must realise that a lot of piracy is by 'single' users who dont have £500 to throw around on a cardboard box and CD.

I don't want to download any software, i made this thread because as i said i wanted to buy all my stuff. Id like to see some sort of discounted version for people who are not a company employing thousands of users and needing the software as a vital part of their business.