Actually I read the headline as they have shut the polishing lines. As in they are valuing worker safety.
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Explosion Creates Potential iPad Production Loss of 500,000 Units as Foxconn Briefly Shuts All Polishing Lines
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Actually I read the headline as they have shut the polishing lines. As in they are valuing worker safety.
Yeah, it's not like a large corporation has ever let people die (or destroyed other industries) in order to save some money.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hinkley_groundwater_contamination
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhopal_disaster
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exxon_Valdez_oil_spill
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deepwater_Horizon_oil_spill
I'm sure what we really need is less regulation so that management can get right on these problems, unfettered by big, bad government.
Yeah, it's not like a large corporation has ever let people die (or destroyed other industries) in order to save some money.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hinkley_groundwater_contamination
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhopal_disaster
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exxon_Valdez_oil_spill
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deepwater_Horizon_oil_spill
I'm sure what we really need is less regulation so that management can get right on these problems, unfettered by big, bad government.
I am sure there are plenty of examples where cost cutting , trying to save money or ignoring potential dangers has occurred. It is still happening every day until the next accident.
Neglect, lax supervision, human error etc. etc. all contribute to accidents of any kind.
Much of what engineers dream up is working in theory, installed, tested and works fine initially. Management gets an estimate, asks for savings and will in most instances only implement the minimum demanded by law.
You can of course spin things either way and say that because of these business practices it is also accepted that if something happens it's part of doing business.
My point is that union workers would not have prevented this disaster and that nobody cynically plans deaths.
Then you've got some serious reading to do. PG&E for example, paid $295 million plus another $20 million in damages precisely because there was proof that they cynically planned to let people die rather than spend a few million on cleaning up their act.
While there are many similar publicly known cases, let's not forget that it is very common for corporations to settle them while admitting no wrongdoing and managing to keep things quiet.
Oh my gosh.. I'm so sorry that your bottom line was affected...
Wow, I can't believe how greedy and selfish people are these days... Whining and moaning about loss of production when people were injured and killed in this tragic explosion...
Oh Mr. Jobs, I'm so sorry that you'll loose 500,000 units this quarter... I know that's going to suck, 500,000 x $250 profit per unit... Oops you just lost 125 million... Which on a per share basis equates to about 1 cent... So sorry.
Wow, I can't believe how greedy and selfish people are these days... Whining and moaning about loss of production when people were injured and killed in this tragic explosion...
Oh Mr. Jobs, I'm so sorry that you'll loose 500,000 units this quarter... I know that's going to suck, 500,000 x $250 profit per unit... Oops you just lost 125 million... Which on a per share basis equates to about 1 cent... So sorry.
And one more thing:
This is not an engineering problem, nor is any accident at a production facility. All accidents at all factories are the direct responsibility of upper management. It's their job to produce and produce safely.
You've got two possible checks against management abuse/ineptitude: government and workers. If workers aren't unionized they're easier to replace and have little to protect them if they challenge management's poor decisions. So I guess if you're against unions you want Big Government, right? No, I'll bet you want neither. Just let management do what it wants and all will be well...
And when exactly should we move on?
Over 150000 die in this world every day. Do you personally mourn each and every one of their deaths? What about the last 150000 , or the 150000 before them?
No? Didn't think so.
How about when upper management is imprisoned for this crime? And yes, this is a crime. Proper ventilation and filtration systems are available, and the knowledge to use them is not only widely available but the responsibility of management. Failing to use them is not an accident.
And the fact China has ZERO unions is why companies are over there. There is so little overhead it is disgusting. Sorry, but we in America are treated like trash.
We can get those job though if we agree to:
*No unions
*No overtime
*$2.00 an hour
*No health insurance
*No paid vacations
*No holiday pay
*No OSHA
*No lunch break
*15 hour work day
*No maternity leave
See, that'll put jobs back into this country.
And one more thing:
This is not an engineering problem, nor is any accident at a production facility. All accidents at all factories are the direct responsibility of upper management. It's their job to produce and produce safely.
You've got two possible checks against management abuse/ineptitude: government and workers. If workers aren't unionized they're easier to replace and have little to protect them if they challenge management's poor decisions. So I guess if you're against unions you want Big Government, right? No, I'll bet you want neither. Just let management do what it wants and all will be well...
How is this not an engineering problem?
If the dust can accumulate to a point where it can explode, whatever was installed was wrong for whatever reason.
Again, I don't know the details, but warning systems for filter overload, line interruptors not installed or bypassed when filters are full (employees do that sometimes trying to "help")
Yes, eventually everything is a company's upper management fault, even the decision to install brand A over brand B or when an employee makes a bad decision , is irresponsible (Shouldn't have been hired etc.).
There are no safe guards against human errors or behavior that any management can establish.
There is IMO nothing that would have made a difference if union workers would have been employed. If you don't want to see that fact, I guess we just have to disagree.
I have been "subjected" to union workers over many years and there are a lot of issues, hence everybody tries like the plague to avoid unions and companies fight to keep them out of their factories.
While I have been to factories in Asia, I don't know enough about how their unions would be organized.
Obviously to let managements do whatever they want is not the answer and neither is big government.
In other threads it has been discussed how the US government is making it uninteresting to open up factories here.
Now there is an upper management that should be looked at.
The engineering is not at fault: there are well known procedures and widely available tools for dealing with the issue. These have been well engineered and will work, but only if applied. That's a management problem.
The US will always be uninteresting to corporations that want to pay slave wages and not pay to clean up after themselves. The solution to that is to raise taxes on imports. If they don't want to do business here they'll be replaced. That's the great thing about a free market.
Where is the cutoff on our grief for people we don't know, and never would have known?
Let's say, for today:
Should we eat?
Should we buy groceries?
Obviously we shouldn't buy an iPad.
What about new shoes for our kids?
Medicine for grandma?
Can I smile if the sun is out where I am?
Should we work?
Light candles?
What about helping my friend whose roof was torn off by winds on Sunday?
Eagerly awaiting your answer so I know how to behave.
Union workers ....expertise?
PLEASE. Union workers are some of the laziest workers out there. They have sooo many safety nets covering their asses they can afford to be lazy. They do as LITTLE as possible while maintaining the situation and their own outrageous paychecks.
Sure a company may take in account a few deaths, and see if it is something manageable, but when it becomes a issue of workers taking on that responsibility the results are even more disasterous. I understand the need for workers to protect their rights, but those days are long gone. Maybe not in China, but we seen what unions have done to this country *cough*detroit*cough*, they outsourced everything, and China will not allow that to happen with them. All the unions care about is how much money they can leech on real hard workers. ****ing cess pit.
Nobody's saying unions are perfect. They're just one of a very few counterbalances to management greed. Sure, there are and will be examples of union greed/excess, but they pale in comparison to Wall Street bankers, Enron, Exxon, BP, the Savings and Loan execs, etc... the list goes on and on.
Oh, and unions don't have the authority to outsource jobs. That's done by management.
There's one theme running through this: humans are selfish bastards.
jonny,
Three people per the latest report.
Lead should have been...
3 deaths at Foxconn plant.
I find it disturbing that it appears that Mac Rumors is more concerned with the disruption in production of iPad 2s than the loss of human life. That this fact is buried in the third paragraph (of a 5 paragraph-long story) fills me with a dread for our collective future.
Just sayin'
3 deaths at Foxconn plant.
I find it disturbing that it appears that Mac Rumors is more concerned with the disruption in production of iPad 2s than the loss of human life. That this fact is buried in the third paragraph (of a 5 paragraph-long story) fills me with a dread for our collective future.
Just sayin'
Not really when you consider that they said UP TO 500k but that is likely assuming that the plant is shut down for more than just two days. Because it is unlikely that they produce 250k units a day. More like 1/10th that amount.
And they only shut down the polishing lines. So it is possible that they are still building units and having the polishing temporarily farmed out to another company or even the other factory. So it could make even less of a dent in production
although all of this is moot anyway. Signs are that folks are still chasing ipads, still ordering online etc. And aren't ready to stop. So a few days halting or more like slow down (this particular plant is only like 20% of the ipad production anyway) isn't going to change demand.
Given that it is the blogs and blog commenters and NOT Apple (who sent out a press release about the loss of life and prayers to the families etc) harping on loss of production, delays etc, your disdain is out of line.
Well, they are! That's why Capitalism is the best economic system available. The big problem is that many so-called "conservative" people take it as a given that just because it's the best system it must be perfect... that it won't devolve into feudalism if left completely alone.
What we need now is a 21st century Henry Ford, who saw that raising pay (not cutting it) was the way to generate prosperity and created the Middle Class. Instead we pay homage (and massive tax breaks) to our Corporate Lords while our own incomes shrink. Then we're surprised when one of their factories has an "accident." We actually believe it when they say they didn't see it coming!
