Failed logic board - no extended warranty

[MalcyChan]

Hi,

I have a MacBook Pro version 2 (Purchased Feb 08). Last week I tried to switch it on and it was as good as dead. The power light came on and the optical drive spun up but no display and no bong.

After a lot of looking round on the internet I saw there are know issues with the NVidea GeForce graphics card on my particular MBP and that Apple have extended the warranty to 3 years for problems of this type. My MBP had been running very hot for some time so I suspected that some piece of hardware may have been failing for a while and thought the graphics card may have been the cause.

After a few calls to Apple UK I took my computer to an approved Apple repairer for them to evaluate (a 60 mile round trip). They came back an said it wasn't the graphics card but the logic board that had failed, and gave me a repair cost of almost 900 GBP.

I spoke to Apple UK support, but they refused a CS code (i.e. a code that would get my computer repaired for free). The repairer suggested I try talking to Apple again again as in their opinion the logic board probably failed due to a manufacturing defect. They liaised with Apple and shared their findings.

To cut a long story short, after many long, frustrating calls to Apple UK's Customer Relations department they decided NOT to make an exception, despite the report from their approved repairer. I also had a second 60 mile round trip to collect my MBP.

I'm now at a bit of a loss, I'm going to follow this up and find out what my rights are under UK Consumer Law as I don't think the computer was fit for purpose as I'd expect it to last longer than 27 months before being rendered useless.

To add insult to injury the Customer Relations adviser said he agreed with me but was overruled by his manager. I don't know if this is true but he also advised me to talk to my local Trading Standards office(!)

I thought Apple stood for quality and good customer service, but I'm struggling to see either right now.

 

[Hellhammer]

http://support.apple.com/kb/ts2377

Show them that article as it clearly says that all MBPs with 8600M GT are covered and your issue is very likely because of 8600M GT

 

[8CoreWhore]

Get a second opinion.

 

[MalcyChan]

http://support.apple.com/kb/ts2377

Show them that article as it clearly says that all MBPs with 8600M GT are covered and your issue is very likely because of 8600M GT

Hellhammer, I did quote that article to Apple customer support and tech support. They say it's not related - obviously just coincidence then.

How they can test the graphics card when the motherboard has failed is beyond me!

 

[Hellhammer]

Hellhammer, I did quote that article to Apple customer support and tech support. They say it's not related - obviously just coincidence then.

How they can test the graphics card when the motherboard has failed is beyond me!

Call them again and demand to speak to the manager/supervisor. It clearly says that:

What to look for:

Distorted or scrambled video on the computer screen
No video on the computer screen (or external display) even though the computer is on

They can't refuse to fix it as the symptoms are 8600M GT related

 

[xpected_one]

Not picking sides here or anything but could it not just be a faulty logic board ?? And if so how can you prove it was gpu related?

 

[Hellhammer]

Not picking sides here or anything but could it not just be a faulty logic board ?? And if so how can you prove it was gpu related?

Because the GPU is soldered onto the motherboard

The symptoms OP has are GPU related as it produces the picture to the screen

 

[xpected_one]

Because the GPU is soldered onto the motherboard



The symptoms OP has are GPU related as it produces the picture to the screen

Oh ok makes sense ! I know the gpu produces the image I just didn't know it was soldered on the board

 

[Bill Gates]

He said he tried to switch it on and there was no display and no bong. To me that doesn't single out the GPU with absolute certainty. His machine wouldn't POST is all that means. I'm afraid that if you've already gone through the motions of contacting Apple and they denied an exception there is little you can do.

 

[Vanarak19]

Well, If your machine isnt even turning on, it has nothing to do with the GPU, sorry

You should get some sort of hardware feedback when the power button is pressed, which is why they are not repairing it.

 

[MalcyChan]

Well, If your machine isnt even turning on, it has nothing to do with the GPU, sorry

You should get some sort of hardware feedback when the power button is pressed, which is why they are not repairing it.

I accept that it is the logic board that has failed. What I'm less happy with is that the Apple Authorised Service Provider conceded that the logic board probably failed due to a manufacturing defect and it was in no way due to anything that I'd done.

I paid a lot of money for my MBP thinking I was buying a quality product, unfortunately Apple obviously consider a little over 2 years as a perfectly acceptable lifespan for one of their high-end laptops.

I've accepted that I'm now out of pocket and have been left without so much as an apology from Apple. All I can do now is make others aware that behind all the glossy advertising is a company that are no better than any other when it really matters.

 

[dr. shdw]

I accept that it is the logic board that has failed. What I'm less happy with is that the Apple Authorised Service Provider conceded that the logic board probably failed due to a manufacturing defect and it was in no way due to anything that I'd done.

I paid a lot of money for my MBP thinking I was buying a quality product, unfortunately Apple obviously consider a little over 2 years as a perfectly acceptable lifespan for one of their high-end laptops.

I've accepted that I'm now out of pocket and have been left without so much as an apology from Apple. All I can do now is make others aware that behind all the glossy advertising is a company that are no better than any other when it really matters.

This is why you get Apple Care.

 

[Bill Gates]

I accept that it is the logic board that has failed. What I'm less happy with is that the Apple Authorised Service Provider conceded that the logic board probably failed due to a manufacturing defect and it was in no way due to anything that I'd done.

I paid a lot of money for my MBP thinking I was buying a quality product, unfortunately Apple obviously consider a little over 2 years as a perfectly acceptable lifespan for one of their high-end laptops.

I've accepted that I'm now out of pocket and have been left without so much as an apology from Apple. All I can do now is make others aware that behind all the glossy advertising is a company that are no better than any other when it really matters.

If something fails and it isn't due to negligence then it could always be considered to have failed due to a manufacturing defect, since why else would it have failed? Apple doesn't consider 2-years acceptable nor does any other reputable manufacturer, but like anything else on the market today, a small portion of products sold will fail in a relatively short period of time. Your displeasure understandable, but your words about Apple are misplaced.

 

[HLdan]

This is why you get Apple Care.

I second that. While I understand why the OP expects his Macbook to last longer than 27 months, it has a 1 year warranty against manufacturing defects and if he didn't want to get Applecare he has no one to blame, he can't expect the company to bend over backwards, his computer is well over 2 years old. Apple makes great computers but they are still a consumer product, they are not high end-hand crafted. Had he had gotten Applecare it would've been still covered.

 

[ReallyBigFeet]

I had the EXACT same symptoms on a December 2007 MBP 15". Twice, no less. No bong, just heard the optical grind once at boot, no screen, dead. The first time was before Apple had acknowledged the 8600GT issue was cooking the GPU and, in many cases, the logic board along with it. So the first time it happened, they replaced my logic board, got it back and it worked as new.

About 8 months ago, almost 1 year after the first logic board replacement, the same thing happened. Again, they did a logic board replacement although this time the paperwork reflected the GPU failure....it didn't the first time, although the symptoms were identical in both situations, again with no questions asked. Again, working pretty well although I've since replaced that device with a new 2010 MBP. My kids use the old one now.

I had Applecare in that situation....that may have made a difference.

 

[Vanarak19]

I accept that it is the logic board that has failed. What I'm less happy with is that the Apple Authorised Service Provider conceded that the logic board probably failed due to a manufacturing defect and it was in no way due to anything that I'd done.

I paid a lot of money for my MBP thinking I was buying a quality product, unfortunately Apple obviously consider a little over 2 years as a perfectly acceptable lifespan for one of their high-end laptops.

I've accepted that I'm now out of pocket and have been left without so much as an apology from Apple. All I can do now is make others aware that behind all the glossy advertising is a company that are no better than any other when it really matters.

We all expect our things to last longer then 2 years on big purchases like this. But, sometimes they dont. You can get upset all you want about the logic board failure, as would I, but no one owes you anything. This is why applecare is offered for the entirety of the first year, so that you can purchase extended coverage.

I understand your frustration I really do, but your machine came with a one year warranty, its out now, and its broken. Apple owes you nothing unfortunately.

 

[kny3twalker]

I thought in the EU everyone had a two or three year warranty on electronics by law. If this is the case, then why buy AppleCare? for double coverage?

 

[bigjobby]

I thought in the EU everyone had a two or three year warranty on electronics by law. If this is the case, then why buy AppleCare? for double coverage?

Not so in the UK. 12 months is pretty much standard. Can't comment for the rest of the EU though.

 

[Hellhammer]

Not so in the UK. 12 months is pretty much standard. Can't comment for the rest of the EU though.

At least here in Finland, giving warranty is optional (reads in law). No manufacturer nor vendor is forced to give warranty, no matter how expensive the item is. And yes, Finland is a member of EU.

 

[MalcyChan]

Not so in the UK. 12 months is pretty much standard. Can't comment for the rest of the EU though.

Five [UK] consumer laws you really ought to know:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8253915.stm

Quote: "And the key time span is six years. That's how long goods may be covered by the Sale of Goods Act". Unfortunately for me this applies with the retailer not the manufacturer.

 

[l.a.rossmann]

He said he tried to switch it on and there was no display and no bong. To me that doesn't single out the GPU with absolute certainty. His machine wouldn't POST is all that means.

I have had this happen and revived the machine many times with a proper BGA rework(no heatgun ********) to the GPU. There are different symptoms depending on what is not making a proper connection.

The problem is that Apple looks for every excuse to weasel out of offering this warranty, pointing to cosmetic damage on the machine and saying that it was caused by the customer, not the chip failure.

Yet I've seen A1150 & A1211 machines that looked like they were run over by a car. Also machines that HAD Been run over by a car, with NO CHIP FAILURE.

Don't let them weasel out of providing your warranty based on cosmetic nonsense.

 

[kny3twalker]

Not so in the UK. 12 months is pretty much standard. Can't comment for the rest of the EU though.

At least here in Finland, giving warranty is optional (reads in law). No manufacturer nor vendor is forced to give warranty, no matter how expensive the item is. And yes, Finland is a member of EU.

Five [UK] consumer laws you really ought to know:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8253915.stm

Quote: "And the key time span is six years. That's how long goods may be covered by the Sale of Goods Act". Unfortunately for me this applies with the retailer not the manufacturer.

Its two years.

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/bargai...=487339&in_page_id=53954&in_advicepage_id=131

please read article, but a few quotes

There has been an increase in people using a little-known European Union directive to get retailers to refund or replace faulty goods, even after the stated guarantee periods have ended.

The EU rule allowing the return of goods up to two years after purchase is at odds with the returns policies adopted by most major shops.

Under UK law, buyers in England and Wales can get a partial refund or full repair up to six years after the purchase was made (five years from discovery in Scotland). The refund should take into account how much use the customer has already had of a product. Ultimately, a county court would decide this.

However, the likelihood of getting such a refund is dramatically reduced after just six months. The reason is that for six months after the purchase, it is up to the retailer to show that a fault on an item is down to the actions or misuse of the buyer, rather than an inherent fault in the product.

After six months, the burden of proof switches to the buyer and it is they who must then show a fault is due to some inherent problem, something that can be almost impossible in all but the most straightforward cases.

He has proof from the Apple online document.

 

[Eddyisgreat]

The power light came on and the optical drive spun up but no display and no bong.

Did the power light come on then go off as soon as the machine starts WITH the display up?

No bong (hit ) = possibly muted volume. I don't think you can change the volume of the startup sound until the OS starts.

Do you allow your machine to start up without a password? If so, try to let it starts up (wait about 3-4 minutes to be sure it's finished), try to play with the volume. Hopefully you'll get some feedback. At this point, turn it all the way up, then bring your cursor all the way up to the top left corner, hold option, click (to bring up menu), press UP and enter (while holding option) to bring up the system profiler. After that don't press anything else (or you might lose focus of system profiler) and hit command-4 to have sys profiler speak the machine serial. If you can do that then there's no way they can deny it's anything other than a GPU failure because all else is working fine and you were able to blindly traverse the OS and pull off such an amazing feat.

Don't back down.

 

[ouimetnick]

This is why you get Apple Care.

Its still pathetic that a high end computer can't last longer than 2 years. EVERY SINGLE computer I've and my family has owned lasted more than 2 years, infact, they never broke. We have then for 5-7 years, and then get ride of them, but they still work, just can't run todays software. I can't confirm a macs lifespan, as the oldest one (my oldest brother has a MBP) is 26 months old, and still working. It has the 8600M GT though. Its the 2.4GHz 15" MBP. Then the next to oldest Macintosh is a base model late 2008 aluminum unibody MacBook. Then the newest is a April 2010 base aluminum unibody MacBook Pro. But 2 years for a 2k machine is pathetic.

A computer thats that expensive should be built to last, so you don't need Apple Care.

 

[dr. shdw]

Its still pathetic that a high end computer can't last longer than 2 years. EVERY SINGLE computer I've and my family has owned lasted more than 2 years, infact, they never broke. We have then for 5-7 years, and then get ride of them, but they still work, just can't run todays software. I can't confirm a macs lifespan, as the oldest one (my oldest brother has a MBP) is 26 months old, and still working. It has the 8600M GT though. Its the 2.4GHz 15" MBP. Then the next to oldest Macintosh is a base model late 2008 aluminum unibody MacBook. Then the newest is a April 2010 base aluminum unibody MacBook Pro. But 2 years for a 2k machine is pathetic.

A computer thats that expensive should be built to last, so you don't need Apple Care.

Unless you're will to pay for military grade components, consumer products these days...many things can go wrong.

Also OP, does the screen output on to an ext? Maybe the inverter board is borked.