Family sharing is a failure

Marli

macrumors regular
Original poster
Apr 9, 2011
146
14
I was excited at when I first heard about this. It would allow me to managed and control the phones in the family. Up to this point we has different iCloud accounts, but all used the same iTunes account.This was allowed by Apple, and it "just worked"

But the family sharing system is a failure, I will can it and move back to the old system. At least half of the apps will not allow you to upgrade when set up for family sharing, even if they are free.

This feature has to allow you to share apps (all aps) just like when you share a app store ID, or it is a failure.

Its a pity, it had such potential. Apply, the "just works" statement has crashed and burned with this release..

Its there a fix, how are others finding this feature?
 

caesarp

macrumors 6502a
Sep 30, 2012
964
387
I was excited at when I first heard about this. It would allow me to managed and control the phones in the family. Up to this point we has different iCloud accounts, but all used the same iTunes account.This was allowed by Apple, and it "just worked"

But the family sharing system is a failure, I will can it and move back to the old system. At least half of the apps will not allow you to upgrade when set up for family sharing, even if they are free.

This feature has to allow you to share apps (all aps) just like when you share a app store ID, or it is a failure.

Its a pity, it had such potential. Apply, the "just works" statement has crashed and burned with this release..

Its there a fix, how are others finding this feature?
It is a crippled feature of what you already did. Why change? Just share itunes account and use separate icloud accounts. I fail to see the need for family sharing. I continue to share iTunes account with my wife and child. I will not activate family sharing.
 

Amacfa

macrumors 68000
May 22, 2009
1,592
2,879
D.C.
I was excited at when I first heard about this. It would allow me to managed and control the phones in the family. Up to this point we has different iCloud accounts, but all used the same iTunes account.This was allowed by Apple, and it "just worked"

But the family sharing system is a failure, I will can it and move back to the old system. At least half of the apps will not allow you to upgrade when set up for family sharing, even if they are free.

This feature has to allow you to share apps (all aps) just like when you share a app store ID, or it is a failure.

Its a pity, it had such potential. Apply, the "just works" statement has crashed and burned with this release..

Its there a fix, how are others finding this feature?
I'm using family sharing since beta... I've not had a single issue with it.
 

soulsteelgray

macrumors regular
Mar 20, 2012
141
8
I was excited at when I first heard about this. It would allow me to managed and control the phones in the family. Up to this point we has different iCloud accounts, but all used the same iTunes account.This was allowed by Apple, and it "just worked"

But the family sharing system is a failure, I will can it and move back to the old system. At least half of the apps will not allow you to upgrade when set up for family sharing, even if they are free.

This feature has to allow you to share apps (all aps) just like when you share a app store ID, or it is a failure.

Its a pity, it had such potential. Apply, the "just works" statement has crashed and burned with this release..

Its there a fix, how are others finding this feature?
Are the apps enabled for sharing by the developers?
 

Marli

macrumors regular
Original poster
Apr 9, 2011
146
14
Are the apps enabled for sharing by the developers?

I guess not. But if developers aren't going to share apps it's dead in the water before its starts. I will just go back to sharing an account.

I liked the feature where the kids had to ask permission to buy an app.

----------

Working for me also !

It works until you need an update to say YouTube. Then it will pop up a Message. It's a well documented issue if you search around on the web.
 

gordon1234

macrumors 6502a
Jun 23, 2010
571
162
I'm not sure what more you can ask for here. It would be rather shoddy of Apple to turn all existing individual app licenses into family licenses without the permission of the developers. I'm guessing most developers will be fine with this, but the feature (like everything else in iOS 8) is brand-new and developers need a chance to update their apps.

You might as well call notification center, or sharing, or any number of useful new features that require specific application support a failure…
 

zorinlynx

macrumors 603
May 31, 2007
5,531
6,476
Florida, USA
I'm not sure what more you can ask for here. It would be rather shoddy of Apple to turn all existing individual app licenses into family licenses without the permission of the developers. I'm guessing most developers will be fine with this, but the feature (like everything else in iOS 8) is brand-new and developers need a chance to update their apps.

You might as well call notification center, or sharing, or any number of useful new features that require specific application support a failure…
I'm not sure why it requires a license change at all.

Families could ALREADY share apps among each other. All you have to do is sign into the app store as the other person and install whatever you want. At one point I had apps owned by three different people on my phone. All the feature does is change it so that you don't have to be signing out and signing in all the time to do it.

Also, requiring the same credit card is ridiculous. Not all families have their finances completely combined.
 

Rigby

macrumors 601
Aug 5, 2008
4,741
3,688
San Jose, CA
I'm not sure why it requires a license change at all.

Families could ALREADY share apps among each other. All you have to do is sign into the app store as the other person and install whatever you want.
While Apple isn't currently enforcing it, sharing apps this way is a violation of the licensing agreement:

http://www.apple.com/legal/internet-services/itunes/appstore/dev/stdeula/
"This license does not allow You to use the Licensed Application on any iPod touch or iPhone that You do not own or control, and You may not distribute or make the Licensed Application available over a network where it could be used by multiple devices at the same time."
At one point I had apps owned by three different people on my phone. All the feature does is change it so that you don't have to be signing out and signing in all the time to do it.
More importantly, it creates a legal basis for sharing, provided that the app developer as the licensor wants to grant that right.
 

Marli

macrumors regular
Original poster
Apr 9, 2011
146
14
That's fine, I will just go back to breaking their agreement. No one will use family sharing if this is the way they implement it.
 

aham23

macrumors regular
Oct 31, 2011
230
0
in my family, i own all the devices and my credit card pays for all the apps which means i am breaking no policy utilizing the old method of sharing one iTunes Account, seperate iCloud accounts, across iDevices. i really see no reason to attempt Family Share.
 

Menel

macrumors 603
Aug 4, 2011
6,197
1,028
I was excited at when I first heard about this. It would allow me to managed and control the phones in the family. Up to this point we has different iCloud accounts, but all used the same iTunes account.This was allowed by Apple, and it "just worked"

But the family sharing system is a failure, I will can it and move back to the old system. At least half of the apps will not allow you to upgrade when set up for family sharing, even if they are free.

This feature has to allow you to share apps (all aps) just like when you share a app store ID, or it is a failure.

Its a pity, it had such potential. Apply, the "just works" statement has crashed and burned with this release..

Its there a fix, how are others finding this feature?
Works great here, wife and I love it.
Upgrades work fine. Have access to apps, music, tv, movies, etc. Fantastic.

Your problem is, you likely set it up wrong. Here is what I imagine happened to you. Previously...:

iPhone 1:
AppStore using iPhone1@mail.com
iCloud using iPhone1@mail.com

iPhone 2:
AppStore using iPhone1@mail.com
iCloud using iPhone2@mail.com

post-FamilyShare

iPhone 2:
AppStore using iPhone2@mail.com
iCloud using iPhone2@mail.com
But linked through Family share back to iPhone1@mail.com

Apps loaded onto iPhone 2 are tagged with the DRM for iPhone1. Now that the system has changed, it sees unexpected results.

You should be able to weed out the apps that require login for updates, remove, and redownload and it will get the DRM tagged correctly.
 

CB1234

macrumors 6502a
Sep 20, 2012
766
316
Dubai, UAE
It works in my family too without any problems.

We can all see each other apps and can download it on any devices we want to, whether the app is free or paid - it doesn't matter it downloads and it updates without any problems....
 

gtstricky

macrumors regular
Apr 19, 2012
120
5
My main issue is that you can not convert an exisiting apple ID to a child ID.

In the past if you wanted your kids to have an apple ID (for game center) apple instructed you to put in a fake DOB to get around the age issue.

If you go in to an Apple ID and try to put in the correct age (for my 11yo) it will not let you change it. 13 seems to be the youngest it will let you go. I called Apple and they explained that child IDs are not unique IDs and are subsets of the parent ID. There is no way to convert a traditional ID into a child ID.

I can create a whole new ID as a child account and then keep using the old ID in game center but that seems like a PIA.
 

jhfenton

macrumors 6502a
Dec 11, 2012
931
480
Cincinnati, Ohio
While Apple isn't currently enforcing it, sharing apps this way is a violation of the licensing agreement:

http://www.apple.com/legal/internet-services/itunes/appstore/dev/stdeula/
"This license does not allow You to use the Licensed Application on any iPod touch or iPhone that You do not own or control, and You may not distribute or make the Licensed Application available over a network where it could be used by multiple devices at the same time."
More importantly, it creates a legal basis for sharing, provided that the app developer as the licensor wants to grant that right.
My wife and I jointly own every iDevice in the house. More specifically, I've bought every one of them: four iPads and iPad minis, two Mac minis, two Apple TVs, and even my wife's iPhone 6. All in my name. All owned by me. All sharing my App Store Apple ID. All perfectly within the terms of the licensing agreement.

At the moment, Family Sharing isn't worth the hassle. My kids already have to ask my permission to buy apps, because they don't know the Apple ID password.
 

Rigby

macrumors 601
Aug 5, 2008
4,741
3,688
San Jose, CA
My wife and I jointly own every iDevice in the house. More specifically, I've bought every one of them: four iPads and iPad minis, two Mac minis, two Apple TVs, and even my wife's iPhone 6. All in my name. All owned by me. All sharing my App Store Apple ID. All perfectly within the terms of the licensing agreement.
Not to be argumentative, but if your family members configure their own personal iCloud accounts on the devices, you clearly don't "own and control" them, even if you have paid for them sometime in the past.

Sharing content in families has always been a gray area legally (fair use etc.). Family sharing is just an attempt to create a proper licensing framework around it. It can also potentially prevent various problems that can arise when sharing accounts (just search this forum). Apple still needs to iron out some kinks though.
 

rufhausen

macrumors regular
Jul 5, 2007
132
0
Littleton, CO
At the moment, Family Sharing isn't worth the hassle. My kids already have to ask my permission to buy apps, because they don't know the Apple ID password.
For me, the obvious advantage of Family Sharing is that instead of my kid having to hand me his phone (assuming we are even at the same location), and me typing in my Apple ID password every time he wants even a free app, I can just use Touch ID from my own phone when the request comes in.

However, I've had problems with some apps like Instagram and Swiftkey. I see they are "not available for family sharing", but what's the logic to this when they are free anyway and we can easily get around this by not using family sharing?

A second advantage to Family Sharing is I can give my wife the same approval privileges so either one of us can approve an app from our own phones.
 

FamiliaPhoto

macrumors 6502a
Jul 24, 2009
698
14
Chicago, IL
I like the security around my approving purchases. My kids have to ask for my password as well, but added security steps are always nice.

The only reason I don't use family sharing is that by keeping my cloud account on each phone we all automatically share a photo stream which all of us enjoy immensely. Its great seeing all the family pics rollup into one place. Using family sharing each family member would have to add them to the shared family album which wouldn't happen.
 

DotCom2

macrumors 601
Feb 22, 2009
4,101
2,352
Our family loves it and works quite well.
Not a single problem and we all share movies, music, apps, etc.
Not sure what your problem is.
 

nickdylan

macrumors regular
Mar 17, 2012
126
0
It's kind of a nightmare. We put like 5 hours into just getting the damn thing to work. It works fine now like 95% of the time but we still get errors every few days. Great idea, but the implementation feels like a beta feature.
 

caesarp

macrumors 6502a
Sep 30, 2012
964
387
While Apple isn't currently enforcing it, sharing apps this way is a violation of the licensing agreement:

http://www.apple.com/legal/internet-services/itunes/appstore/dev/stdeula/
"This license does not allow You to use the Licensed Application on any iPod touch or iPhone that You do not own or control, and You may not distribute or make the Licensed Application available over a network where it could be used by multiple devices at the same time."
More importantly, it creates a legal basis for sharing, provided that the app developer as the licensor wants to grant that right.
My wife and I own and control all iOS devices in our house, including my son's iPad mini. So for us to share iTunes account is not against the license. Again, why enable family sharing when all you need to do is have everyone share one iTunes account? All of us can download anything one of us buys. My son has to ask though cause he doesn't know the password.

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Not to be argumentative, but if your family members configure their own personal iCloud accounts on the devices, you clearly don't "own and control" them, even if you have paid for them sometime in the past.

Sharing content in families has always been a gray area legally (fair use etc.). Family sharing is just an attempt to create a proper licensing framework around it. It can also potentially prevent various problems that can arise when sharing accounts (just search this forum). Apple still needs to iron out some kinks though.
False. How you configure icloud has no bearing on whether you own or control the device. Ps. I'm a lawyer. Sharing iTunes account is fine. And less hassle than family sharing.
 

Rigby

macrumors 601
Aug 5, 2008
4,741
3,688
San Jose, CA
False. How you configure icloud has no bearing on whether you own or control the device. Ps. I'm a lawyer.
So, Mr. lawyer, what does it take to "own and control" a device? Do you "own and control", e.g., your wife's phone if you bought it as a gift for her?
 

caesarp

macrumors 6502a
Sep 30, 2012
964
387
So, Mr. lawyer, what does it take to "own and control" a device? Do you "own and control", e.g., your wife's phone if you bought it as a gift for her?
Yes, it's marital property. And anything my 10 year old has is owned and controlled by his parents.