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Project Alice

macrumors 68020
Jul 13, 2008
2,025
2,100
Post Falls, ID
Hi, I can connect and transfer files from the G4MDD to the macpro 5.1, but not vice versa, can this be overcome?
Mojave still supports AFP, I use that all the time to share files between my 5,1 and older PPC macs. However both Tiger and Leopard support SMB as well even on PPC, so there shouldn't actually be a problem. What is the actual error you're getting?
 

RogerWilco6502

macrumors 68000
Jan 12, 2019
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Mojave still supports AFP, I use that all the time to share files between my 5,1 and older PPC macs. However both Tiger and Leopard support SMB as well even on PPC, so there shouldn't actually be a problem. What is the actual error you're getting?
I've see this issue before and have had it happen to me. From what I can figure out, assuming the behavior is the same, is that Mojave uses APFS, which Tiger and Leopard don't support. The behavior I have had happen is that I can connect to the machine with the APFS volume, but I can't see it on the machine with the older OS. All three OSes (Tiger, Leopard, Mojave) will default to AFS, so, unless you specify differently, it will attempt to use that.
 
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jeyf

macrumors 68020
Jan 20, 2009
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take a 2nd look at the System Preferences / Sharing setup page. there is a setting for sharing via smb or afp. At least on my Mojave. I am thinking SMB is downward comparable with AFP anyways.

if you want to every day sync files between the 2 computers consider chronoSync
 
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RogerWilco6502

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take a 2nd look at the System Preferences / Sharing setup page. there is a setting for sharing via smb or afp. At least on my Mojave. I am thinking SMB is downward comparable with AFP anyways.

They’re both offered, but they’re different protocols.
 

z970

macrumors 68040
Jun 2, 2017
3,580
4,502
I've see this issue before and have had it happen to me. From what I can figure out, assuming the behavior is the same, is that Mojave uses APFS, which Tiger and Leopard don't support. The behavior I have had happen is that I can connect to the machine with the APFS volume, but I can't see it on the machine with the older OS. All three OSes (Tiger, Leopard, Mojave) will default to AFS, so, unless you specify differently, it will attempt to use that.

That is indeed it. Just Apple making life hard again.

OP, you will need to reinstall Mojave onto an HFS+ partition if you expect to access it from your MDD. Otherwise, there is little that can be done short of installing the APFS drivers into Leopard, which to the best of my knowledge is currently impossible.

"It just works" my face ...
 
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eyoungren

macrumors Penryn
Aug 31, 2011
28,909
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I am thinking SMB is downward comparable with AFP anyways.
Oh man, if that were only the case! Would have solved a whole bunch of issues between Windows 2003 Small Business Server and two Macs running Tiger in 2006 or so!

But no, as stated two different protocols.
 
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jeyf

macrumors 68020
Jan 20, 2009
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ok smb is not dwn compatible to afp
but seems Mojave sharing can set to use either protocol. can leopard do this too?
 

RogerWilco6502

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the OP could just update from leopard to Mojave?
No machine capable of running Leopard can run Mojave natively. That is a moot point however, given that the OP stated they are dealing with an MDD, which runs on the PowerPC G4 processor. These processors haven't gotten an OS update from Apple since 10.5.8, so Leopard is the latest it can run.
 

eyoungren

macrumors Penryn
Aug 31, 2011
28,909
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the OP could just update from leopard to Mojave?
Just so you're aware, you are replying to this thread in the PowerPC forums. You may be using the 'new posts' feature from the front page. As stated, you can't update a PowerPC Mac past Leopard.
 
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Slix

macrumors 65816
Mar 24, 2010
1,484
2,081
Screen sharing still works from Leopard to Mojave, so you alternatively can screen share to the Mojave Mac, and then file share from inside of that. APFS is definitely the issue here, unfortunately.
 
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jeyf

macrumors 68020
Jan 20, 2009
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all good but seems this is before my time.

if on the mojave computer the OP used the command K screen and typed afp://myFiles
ya i know flogging a dead horse
 
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eyoungren

macrumors Penryn
Aug 31, 2011
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I now have this problem. :D

Only, I did it deliberately. When I updated my 2008 MBP I went from El Cap to Mojave and using DosDude's Mojave patcher I was not asked (at that time) if I wanted to update to APFS. So, I went and converted today.

Of course, I totally forgot there was also a patch for THAT so when I rebooted it went into recovery mode because the drive isn't even seen. I dug out my USB stick that still has the Mojave patcher on it though and went through the post install features to install the APFS patch.

And now…my Quad cannot even connect to my MBP - even trying SMB. I knew, based on this thread, that would happen. But I mainly transfer stuff from my MBP to my Quad and I can still connect that way so no big deal in my situation.

I only did this because the drive in my MBP is an SSD. I'm leaving my Mac Mini on HFS+ as it still has a traditional HD.
 
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RogerWilco6502

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Jan 12, 2019
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I now have this problem. :D

Only, I did it deliberately. When I updated my 2008 MBP I went from El Cap to Mojave and using DosDude's Mojave patcher I was not asked (at that time) if I wanted to update to APFS. So, I went and converted today.

Of course, I totally forgot there was also a patch for THAT so when I rebooted it went into recovery mode because the drive isn't even seen. I dug out my USB stick that still has the Mojave patcher on it though and went through the post install features to install the APFS patch.

And now…my Quad cannot even connect to my MBP - even trying SMB. I knew, based on this thread, that would happen. But I mainly transfer stuff from my MBP to my Quad and I can still connect that way so no big deal in my situation.

I only did this because the drive in my MBP is an SSD. I'm leaving my Mac Mini on HFS+ as it still has a traditional HD.
Good thing you did this intentionally. I was hit with this right when APFS was released, and I would commonly drag files from my DA running Tiger to the MBP I was using. It really messed with my workflow and was one of the things that contributed to my decision to downgrade to a 2009 MacBook running 10.11 so I would always be able to transfer files between the two (the other major thing being the fact that the optical drive in my Power Mac had died right before and the MBP had no optical drive, so I bought the MacBook to serve as a computer with an optical drive as well).
 
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eyoungren

macrumors Penryn
Aug 31, 2011
28,909
27,059
Good thing you did this intentionally. I was hit with this right when APFS was released, and I would commonly drag files from my DA running Tiger to the MBP I was using. It really messed with my workflow and was one of the things that contributed to my decision to downgrade to a 2009 MacBook running 10.11 so I would always be able to transfer files between the two (the other major thing being the fact that the optical drive in my Power Mac had died right before and the MBP had no optical drive, so I bought the MacBook to serve as a computer with an optical drive as well).
Yeah, I had thought of converting the day I upgraded to Mojave but didn't want to get involved at the time as it was a day long process for two Macs (including getting apps and settings all worked out) already.

It was only seeing this thread that had me investigate this. Since APFS seems to be geared towards SSDs and this MBP has one I went ahead. But the Mini? No. Going to leave it alone. I connect to it via other Macs and currently it's my link to Dropbox for my Quad so doing that would kill that link. And again, traditional HD on the Mini so not worth it anyway.

I can work around the limitation on the MBP. I can totally see how this screwed you over though. Had you known about it from the start things would have been different.
 
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RogerWilco6502

macrumors 68000
Jan 12, 2019
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Yeah, I had thought of converting the day I upgraded to Mojave but didn't want to get involved at the time as it was a day long process for two Macs (including getting apps and settings all worked out) already.

It was only seeing this thread that had me investigate this. Since APFS seems to be geared towards SSDs and this MBP has one I went ahead. But the Mini? No. Going to leave it alone. I connect to it via other Macs and currently it's my link to Dropbox for my Quad so doing that would kill that link. And again, traditional HD on the Mini so not worth it anyway.

I can work around the limitation on the MBP. I can totally see how this screwed you over though. Had you known about it from the start things would have been different.
Yeah, I really wish it had said that it would be converting to APFS because I need the ability to access any computer from any computer for my setup to work. That's also why my G4 Mini hasn't been set up for a while. it didn't come with wireless and I was tired of dealing with a USB dongle. I have a new setup I'll employ with that involving an AirPort Express soon though.

In a way, I'm glad it happened the way it did. I never would have bought the MacBook I did had it not been for the upgrade and I really like my MacBook. :)
 
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iluvmacs99

macrumors 6502a
Apr 9, 2019
920
671
AFPS is the culprit and is a common issue faced by a number of folks that did convert to APFS under High Sierra, Mojave and Catalina where they lost server compatibility with older Macs. The interim solution is to dedicate an old Mac, like a Mini and run El-Capitan with HFS+ to act as a Mac file server like mine does. Then it becomes compatible on all Macs including my PowerMac G5, PowerBook G4 and older PowerBook G3 on OS 9 all are able to see the Mini server as well as my Mac Pro 5,1 and MB Air with Mojave exchange files.
 
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defjam

macrumors 6502a
Sep 15, 2019
795
735
AFPS is the culprit and is a common issue faced by a number of folks that did convert to APFS under High Sierra, Mojave and Catalina where they lost server compatibility with older Macs. The interim solution is to dedicate an old Mac, like a Mini and run El-Capitan with HFS+ to act as a Mac file server like mine does. Then it becomes compatible on all Macs including my PowerMac G5, PowerBook G4 and older PowerBook G3 on OS 9 all are able to see the Mini server as well as my Mac Pro 5,1 and MB Air with Mojave exchange files.
Specifically what is the issue using APFS? A client which is able to connect to a file server should be indifferent to the file system of the server. That doesn't appear to be the case here.
 
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iluvmacs99

macrumors 6502a
Apr 9, 2019
920
671
Specifically what is the issue using APFS? A client which is able to connect to a file server should be indifferent to the file system of the server. That doesn't appear to be the case here.

The old Apple Filing Protocol that is used for network sharing is not compatible with APFS. Apple did warn people about that, which is why some people like myself use an old Mac as a file server serving HFS+ Macs and APFS formatted Macs. My Mac Mini serves all macs well for the task as well as Samba 2 for Windows 10 and 8.1.
 
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defjam

macrumors 6502a
Sep 15, 2019
795
735
The old Apple Filing Protocol that is used for network sharing is not compatible with APFS. Apple did warn people about that, which is why some people like myself use an old Mac as a file server serving HFS+ Macs and APFS formatted Macs.
HFS / HFS+ / APFS are file systems and should be irrelevant to client systems which connect to a server across the network. A client shouldn't need to know nor care about the details of the server for which it is connecting. All that should matter is the protocol used to connect to the file share. The server software is responsible for the details of accessing files, not the client. Any file server software which requires the client to understand the details of the servers file system is broken.
 
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