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Former Google Executive Vic Gundotra: 'If You Truly Care About Great Photography, You Own an iPhone'

adamjackson said:
"End of the DSLR Era"? I wholeheartedly disagree. Point & Shoots are absolutely dead. Micro Four-third is certainly challenged as their ability to enable Optical Bokeh is certainly still a huge selling point but iPhone is coming for them.
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He said "for most people", and I agree. It used to be you needed a DSLR to get a halfway decent digital photo, but optical zoom and exchangeable lenses aside, that's not longer true.

Now, if you're serious about photography, you still need something beefier than a smartphone.
 
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I'm not a photographer or a Camera aficionado . But having experienced many different phones, I really do think the iPhone takes some of the best quality photographs I have ever seen for a phone that I carry every day. That's not to say the other competitors are not bad, but I don't think there is as good as the iPhone. At the end of the day, it's all use a preference, but the best camera that you have is the one that you have on you.
 
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PBG4 Dude said:
My 2003 Canon 300D with a "mere" 6.3 megapixel sensor and stock EF-s 18-55mm lens takes better pictures than my iPhone 7.
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No, YOU with that 2003 Canon 300D take better pictures than on your iPhone 7. Let me use your camera and your iPhone 7 and then the results will be reversed, because even after years of trying to get the hang of photography I'm hopeless with SLRs, DSLR's. ;) The photographer really still is the magic ingredient. There's a friend of mine on this forum, @MRU who can take stunning photos using an inexpensive Honor 8 camera. :eek: You would think he used an expensive camera.
 
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The sheer arrogance of a man saying "By the way, I ran all of Google's mobile efforts from 2007-2010. I was SVP of engineering. So I understand this topic reasonably well. I would NEVER buy an Android phone again if I cared about photography.".
 
JaySoul said:
Et tu, Gundotra?

Tbh I understand what he's saying about Portrait Mode (and arguably Telephoto lens) but outside of that, the competition has overtaken Apple.

Samsung S8 and Google Pixel are the best all-round cameras in Auto Mode. I'm sure Apple will catch up with the next release but the Note 8 is out in 3 weeks and Pixel 2 soon afterwards.

As a consumer, I love this intense battle. The difference from 3 years ago is mindblowing.
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3 years ago, the iPhone 6 came out.
Its camera is quite good.
If you can look at two images side by side... of the same exact scene, one taken on an iPhone 6 & one taken on a modern Android and find the difference “mindblowing”- either, you have eagle vision and an appreciation for fine nuanced differences in image quality that I do not believe many possess, or your definition of “mindblowing” differs SIGNIFICANTLY from mine.
 
lunarworks said:
He said "for most people", and I agree. It used to be you needed a DSLR to get a halfway decent digital photo, but optical zoom and exchangeable lenses aside, that's not longer true.
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There are a few entry-level DSLR Holdouts in my circle of friends (mostly parents). They bought a $499 SLR w/ a Kit Lens at Wal*Mart and use it and swear the photos are worth carrying that thing around all day at Disney World but among those kits, the iPhone absolutely takes better photos and they're wasting time and precious diaper-bag space.

I think using a blanket statement of "DSLR" is inaccurate. The iPhone is better than pretty much any camera (point & shoot, mirrorless, DSLR) under $700 (that includes a kit-lens). It hasn't yet beaten out high-end photography yet.

It's going to have to be done entirely with software (like iPhone 7 Plus' Portrait Mode) because iPhones are so thin, the optics that make Bokeh, Optical Zoom and other functions of an SLR possible are simply impossible with a device so thin. It's clear that Apple is investing a ton of money in faking this with software and that's going to pull everyone from the entry level SLR market over to iPhone.

The photographer with 10 grand in L-lenses and a full-frame SLR has at least another decade before they can use a smartphone.

---

It's important to remember that despite the "shot on iPhone" campaign, nearly 100% of photos today are viewed on smartphones where ISO-Noise, Blur, rolling shutter and exposure speed issues aren't going to be seen. I edit my photos in Lightroom on a 27" display. The iPhone's photos are noticeably "****" compared to the Lumix LX10 when viewed at full resolution on a display especially in times where you don't have 100% sunlight beating down on you to light up a subject.

When you look at the same photos on a smartphone, they look discernibly the same because a 5" screen hides a lot more problems than a 27" screen.
 
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Can't look at this guy without mentally replaying his truly cringeworthy Conan O'Brien interview.

The bokeh feature on my 7 Plus is neat and it does produce great photos, but for the "special" stuff I stick with my Rebel T3 and stock lenses.
 
It's certainly a new "era" for "photographs," what formerly was called "snapshots." The iPhone is better or equal to most point and shoots but most d/SLR camera-level photography is still challenging, not impossible, with an iPhone. Art is an amorphous term I will avoid using but if you are say a bird photographer hard to get really exciting shots with an iPhone. Same would go for a lot of other wildlife, low light, action, or other types of photography that requires an (expensive) specialized lens.

So to say dSLR is dead -- to consumers, yes, but that's not a new or original idea. Consumer level cameras, be it point and shoot or entry level dSLRs have been on the downswing for nearly a decade. To actual photographers, pro or hobbyists, no, the dSLR is still an important, irreplaceable tool. No doubt it's niche, but SLRs before dSLRs were niche too almost everywhere except Japan.
 
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lunarworks said:
He said "for most people", and I agree. It used to be you needed a DSLR to get a halfway decent digital photo, but optical zoom and exchangeable lenses aside, that's not longer true.

Now, if you're serious about photography, you still need something beefier than a smartphone.
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Ah, that's where the new Light L16 comes in. Small like a smartphone (but twice as thick), and quality equal to DSLRs.
 
I have both an iPhone 7 and a Google Pixel. Maybe I'm not doing something right in how I go about taking pictures with the iPhone, but 99% of the time, I get better pics using the Google Pixel.
 
The iPhone 7 Plus with portrait mode is brilliant, I have taken more photo's with it than with any camera I've owned in the past. It takes great Bokeh effect photos and I can only assume that it's going to get even better with the iPhone 8.
 
martipappas said:
I have both an iPhone 7 and a Google Pixel. Maybe I'm not doing something right in how I go about taking pictures with the iPhone, but 99% of the time, I get better pics using the Google Pixel.
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I have the 7 Plus and Pixel XL and the Pixel XL outperforms it every time. Even the top YouTube reviewers agree. Even ones that love and prefer an iPhone have said this.
 
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69Mustang said:
Here's the thing though, the beginning of DSLR for most people never arrived. DSLR has never been the de facto choice for the masses. That's a specialty category. Before the ascendancy of cell phone cameras, the masses were using cheap disposables and point and shooters. Cellphone cameras chewed that market to hell and back.
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Source?

Because the data I'm seeing shows that even the specialist DSLR market is shrinking - quite rapidly:

"The DSLR market is shrinking – this is quite obvious, but contrary from the common opinion, it’s not only because of the rise of the mirrorless. It’s probably the combination of reasons. Beginners rather choose to stick with their smartphone camera than buying a DSLR, which wasn’t the case only a few years back."

http://www.diyphotography.net/camera-sales-report-2016-lowest-sales-ever-dslrs-mirrorless/

Annecdotally I know plenty of people who used to own a "big" standalone camera and now just use their phone. That low level hobbyist type. They're happy with the shots from their phone (it's cheaper, lower maintenance, easier to manipulate and easier to share).

As I said. Some people NEED trucks, and always will. But others will realise they never actually needed one, or can execute their use cases with their smartphone.
 
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I care about truly great photography so I own a dedicated camera and lenses.
 
I give Apple plenty of flak all the time, you guys here know me for that well enough, but if there is one thing where Apple consistently outdoes itself it's smartphone photography.

What they are able to cram into these little devices both hardware- and post-processing-wise is nothing short of amazing.

The DSLR comparison has to be seen in the right light too.

This man isn't talking about getting the perfect (technically perfect) shot from an iPhone that replaces a DSLR in the most demanding ways, a DSLR for many consumers is merely the easiest tool to get good looking snapshots during family meetings.

When space and weight is a major concern I've brought my 6S Plus with me as well instead of my EOS, because whilst it isn't a replacement, many use cases for DSLR were typically cases of anything lower not fitting the needs, whilst a modern iPhone can bridge some needs that used to fall into a gap between compact and DSLR.

Add simplicity and weight or spontaneousness to the formula and suddenly a DSLR still might make a lot of sense, just in less situations for everyday use.

Glassed Silver:ios

Edit:
In the truck vs. car comparison metaphor I'd say cars have bigger engines now so you don't need a big truck to haul a medium sized shopping spree at the hardware store anymore.
 
I absolutely disagree with Vic Gundotra. Frankly, having previously worked at Google you'd think he'd have a better idea as to what's going on in the industry.

The iPhone is absolutely not the best smartphone camera out there. It's one of the best, but I'm surprised to hear such a strongly worded comment from someone who should know better. Google's image processing is second-to-none. In particular, once you've seen and used Google's HDR+ mode capabilities, you can't ever look back. Great low light capabilities, and virtually noise-free images in decent lighting. This is coming from my experience with the Nexus 6P which is nearly a year older than the iPhone 7 Plus. I hear the Google Pixel is even better.

I have used the iPhone 7 Plus camera as someone in my family has one, and I genuinely was surprised at how grainy (in low light) or soft (in good light) the images came out of the iPhone 7. Regarding the latter, Apple is far too aggressive with the noise reduction in their photos.

Also, in regard to the "end of the DSLR era" -- uhh, what? In 2017, DSLR buyers don't cross-shop with cell phones. As @69Mustang said, the "beginning" of the DSLR era never even arrived for most people. DSLR's are generally used by professionals, and the only reason why their sales ballooned in the 2000's was because average joes wanted decent pictures that they weren't able to get with their cell phones. Fast forward to now, and anyone can get "decent" pictures with their cell phones, which means it's back to only the pros/hobbysists are purchasing DSLR's. Fun fact: year over year, DSLR camera sales are actually on the upswing this year.

- In regards to mirrorless cameras, the terms "DSLR" and "Mirrorless" are interchangeable in the above paragraph since they both appeal to the same market. When most people say "DSLR" they just mean a camera with a large sensor, mirror notwithstanding.
 
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Keane16 said:
Source?

Because the data I'm seeing shows that even the specialist DSLR market is shrinking - quite rapidly:

"The DSLR market is shrinking – this is quite obvious, but contrary from the common opinion, it’s not only because of the rise of the mirrorless. It’s probably the combination of reasons. Beginners rather choose to stick with their smartphone camera than buying a DSLR, which wasn’t the case only a few years back."

http://www.diyphotography.net/camera-sales-report-2016-lowest-sales-ever-dslrs-mirrorless/

Annecdotally I know plenty of people who used to own a "big" standalone camera and now just use their phone. That low level hobbyist type. They're happy with the shots from their phone (it's cheaper, lower maintenance, easier to manipulate and easier to share).

As I said. Some people NEED trucks, and always will. But others will realise they never actually needed one, or can execute their use cases with their smartphone.
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You're either missing my point entirely or I didn't make it properly. Most likely I didn't make it properly. What I was attempting to convey is the "DSLR era" never occurred for the mass market. Therefore it had no beginning nor end. It's always been the choice of a select few. AFAIK, DLSR have never been the most sold camera category at any point in time (even backed up by your link).
 
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Zirel said:
Reading the comments on Facebook is hilarious.

People just CAN’T accept the truth.
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And that would be? An iPhone has a nice camera capable of replacing a point&shoot. A DSLR or Mirrorless system camera is still a longshot. Not saying it won't happen for most people. But truth be told: there are millions of use cases the iPhone cannot adequately cover: Hockey game of my son, available light photography (indoor or outdoors), detailled portraiture (less noise on bigger sensors) - just to name a few. It can do most things good enough for most people. But a dedicated camera system for thousands of Dollars will always be able to deliver more. It is just not for everyone.
 
JaySoul said:
Totally agree... It's better our way than picking a side as if we were engaged in tribal warfare!!

Some members of this forum have watched "West Side Story" a few too many times.
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If Mac users didn't pick a side, we'd have no iPhones, no Android (at least not in its current iPhone-like form), no iPad, no Surface, etc. Sometimes it's about more than just supporting a company because of speeds and feeds.
 
69Mustang said:
You're either missing my point entirely or I didn't make it properly. Most likely I didn't make it properly. What I was attempting to convey is the "DSLR era" never occurred for the mass market. Therefore it had no beginning nor end. It's always been the choice of a select few. AFAIK, DLSR have never been the most sold camera category at any point in time (even backed up by your link).
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I don't think anyone would argue (including Gundotra) that DSLR was ever dominant in the mass market. However, a lot of SLRs and DSLRs have been sold to people who never needed them - people with the money in their pockets to buy "the best," but who only wanted to take snapshots (no interest in photography as a hobby, craft, or art, people who never bought a second lens) - a lucrative niche for the camera makers and camera salesmen.

I think what's changing is the perception that you need a professional-looking camera to take good snapshots. Perhaps the perception is changing because one must have a "good" smartphone to have a "good" smartphone camera - the phone has become a status symbol in and of itself.
 
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