French 'iTunes' Law Passed

[Timepass]

I for one am glad to see this law passed and think it about time.

Apple full well would abuse their power when they got to vertial monoply. They where already pushing that in both markets. The other music stores where very hurt by the fact that their stuff could not play on the number 1 player (the ipod). And the other MP3 players where hurt very baddly by not working with iTMS.

The burning to cd and reripping is not a valid solution. It is a work around hack but not a valid arguement to say it still fair. nor is going to buy the CD. Even more so since quite a bit of stuff is only sold on the iTMS. It about time it happened.

Is everyone so scared that it going to hurt apple by having to play on fair grounds all of sudden. Or god forbid each product has to stand on their own with out support of the other.

 

[rjgjonker]

You just don't like it because you must pay for your music from ITMS instead of stealing it. That's what you are about. With ITMS, FINALLY the artists have a shot at getting paid.

No one is stopping you from going to a store and BUYING a CD for a change.

Ah, it's nice that you know 'what I'm all about'. I didn't know that myself. In fact, you appear to know a lot of things about me I did not know. Are you working for the CIA?

One of the reasons that I won't buy anything from iTMS is that the artists still get next to nothing. In fact, they get even less than they get from CD sales. Most of the revenue of iTMS sales goes directly to greedy record companies instead of the people who actually made the music.

The most important reason, however, is that I refuse to buy anything that comes with a licence that says the company that sold me it can revoke my right to use the product anytime it pleases or that forbids me from playing it on certain devices. DRM is rediculous. Vinyl records, tapes and CD's have never had DRM and that has never hurt anyone. Record companies are just trying to take freedom away from consumers because they can. It is time for our governments to force the records industry cartel to stop abusing their monopoly.

But then again, your probably 'all about' corporate theft apologism. I'm sorry that other people might choose to adhere to their moral values. I can imagine they bother you.

 

[Saxking20]

Interpol?

Ah, it's nice that you know 'what I'm all about'. I didn't know that myself. In fact, you appear to know a lot of things about me I did not know. Are you working for the CIA?

You seemed to know a lot about me when you said I got my information from Fox News. How did you know that? Are you with Interpol?

I will no longer argue with a jerk who is bent on STEALING music. Smoke another joint and listen to your cheap mp3 player.

 

[rjgjonker]

You seemed to know a lot about me when you said I got my information from Fox News. How did you know that? Are you with Interpol?

I will no longer argue with a jerk who is bent on STEALING music. Smoke another joint and listen to your cheap mp3 player.

I have never stolen anything, I do not own an MP3 player* and I've never smoked a joint. As far as I am considered, this discussion is over. You refuse to discuss the actual topics and keep making up things that would be entirely unrelated even if they were true.

Please keep doing whatever you want me to believe you do.

*I do own devices that can play MP3, but not dedicated music players.

 

[ZoomZoomZoom]

One of the reasons that I won't buy anything from iTMS is that the artists still get next to nothing. In fact, they get even less than they get from CD sales. Most of the revenue of iTMS sales goes directly to greedy record companies instead of the people who actually made the music.

Amen to that one. But it's still not something that is easily fixed. From the whole iTMS deal, only the record companies are really making the profit. Apple has to cut its profit from the iPod, and the record companies (who don't do anything and get anywhere from 2/3rds to 4/5ths of the 99cent song revenue) are already trying to raise the price of songs on iTMS.

 

[numediaman]

It is amazing how many people would rather stick up for a corporation than for a democratic country's right to impose its' own laws.

If Apple finds the new law too restrictive it has the option to pull out of France. It won't. Like most good companies, Apple will find an accommodation and will continue to sell in France.

As for those who have a built-in hatred of France . . . good. When I vacation in France I won't have the misfortune of bumping into you. That is what a vacation is all about: an escape from insanity.

 

[rickag]

As for those who have a built-in hatred of France . . . good. When I vacation in France I won't have the misfortune of bumping into you. That is what a vacation is all about: an escape from insanity.

I don't have hatred for the French, but do harbor some justifiable resentment for their treatment of me and my family.

My family went on a vacation to France, when we were living in Germany, and those lovely French held us up at the border. We arrived at the border at 10:05pm, which was 5 minutes too late, so we had to stay on the tour bus until 8:00am the next morning.

When we went to the Casino de Paris, the attendent intentionaly took us to the wrong seats, treated us with distain and passed us off to a different attendant.

In general, the treatment we received from the French was unaccetable, shoddy, given only with contempt for us and was intended to make us feel like we shouldn't have bothered to visit their country.

And this from a society that had open bathroom stalls along side of the Champs Elysées leading up to the Arc de Triomphe. These stalls had only partial walls that only came within 10 - 12 " to the ground. Yes folks, while walking down the romatic Champs Elysées, with sidewalk cafes on the other side of the street, you could see the fair citizens of France with their pants/dresses around their ankles while they were taking a dump.

All in all the trip was only worth it to see historical sights, which would have been much more enjoyable, except for the French.

I will give the French credit for one thing. During our time in Germany, the French gave the US military something like 30 days to vacate France. After all those years following WWII, having US military troups in France became unacceptable. I agreed, time to stand up and provide their own defense.

It did however disrupt the lives of thousands of US citizens(wives and children) and military due to the short notice. Dependents were inconvenienced having to pack up quickly and find temporary quarters throughout Europe.(side note: the French thought they would just walk in the vacated bases/posts and have operational facilities. Ha, some of the base/post commanders had everything, and I mean everythiing removed, electric plugs & covers, light fixtures, light switches & covers, toilets, all furniture, sinks, bath tubs, shower fixtures, etc. Kudos for the French for not wanting to rely on the US military, but bad form for giving such short notice.

And yes, you will not have to "have the misfortune of bumping into" me or my family in France.

 

[Arnaud]

Yes, sure, and in the middle age, the French people used to burn witches, and there were no bathrooms in the inns

Seriously, how old is your story, and how relevant is it to estimate a country and its policy towards DRM nowadays ???

We all have bad memories of visits to this or that country - which includes countries of the EU as well as the US -.

 

[rickag]

...
Seriously, how old is your story,
...

If you knew French history you would be able to determine when these experiences occured(hint: When did France request all US military installations be vacated? )

And yes this has almost nothing to do with DRM, except in the context of French attitudes toward the rest of the planet.

 

[MikeTheC]

Whoa! Wait a minute! Stop the press!!!!!

You folks want to talk about how Apple is somehow doing mankind a disservice, and then you want to hold Sony up as an example of a positive alternative?!?!?

Are you out of your collective minds?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Apple's only "guilty" of tying, or linking, or what-the-frack-ever, iTunes to the iPod. You want to call that a monopoly, then fine. But if you think that's bad, then please pull your heads out of the sand and take a look at what Sony's been up to! Do you have any -- and I mean any -- idea how much of the entertainment industry that Sony has bought up?

Apple's trying to "force" people to buy an iPod and use iTunes? Puhleese! Sony tried (and got called on it) to force the entire planet to agree to near slavery-like terms for music CDs, and given how insanely huge a portion of the music and movie business they own -- to say NOTHING of how much of both they control -- they were (and still are) a much bigger threat to competition and consumer rights than Apple is, or likely could be, even in their wildest wet dream.

Wake up and smell the coffee, folks! We've got the Russian Mafia, the Italian Mafia, and the Yacuza (sp?) running amuck in world politics (on the one hand) and more immediately profitable pursuits, such as the worldwide entertainment industry (on the other hand) and you folks want to bitch and complain about Apple's actions?

You all need to get some perspective on this.

 

[Arnaud]

If you knew French history you would be able to determine when these experiences occured(hint: When did France request all US military installations be vacated? )

And yes this has almost nothing to do with DRM, except in the context of French attitudes toward the rest of the planet.

Ok, I wasn't clear enough.

My first guess was that, to be stopped at the German-French boundaries, you had to have this event happen before the Schengen agreement, i.e. in 1995 - after that, nobody got stopped at the boundaries anymore, but for random controls.

After more thoughts, I guessed your "adventure" happened close to 1966, when France withdrew from the Nato. This is the official time when the American bases were shut in France.

Is that what you are referring to ? Really ?

Are you really taking the point of an American tourist in 1966 as a reference point for judging France?

Let's play your game then. I remember that the black segregation "ended" officially in the US only in 1964, thanks to the new Voting right acts and the new Civil right acts. So, according to your sense of logic, what do you think I should do? Call all American people racists, because of what happened more than 40 years ago?
This is exactly the same kind of reasoning, isn't it?

Now, the most important question, do you really think you can judge the French position regarding DRM by comparing with the impression you had as an American tourist in 1966 ?
What do you think is the treatmen of Japanese people visiting a casino in Las Vegas nowadays? Should they judge the American foreign policy based on that, based on a 17-year old bell-boy and a 25-year old croupier?

Thanks for the "lesson" in French history. Go back to read your own, and then you might learn something about judging people. Hint: you can't.

Regarding the DRM, it has nothing to do with your story. And the most harmful country with its "attitude towards the rest of the planet" does not seem to be France nowadays.

 

[dsnort]

Wow, I wandered in thinking I was going to see a discussion of the new French Law, and read an argument over french history! A little off key imho. A couple of observations tho.
1.) I read where one opiner wrote that he wouldn't buy anything from iTMS because the artist's don't get enough of the money. What is Aple supposed to do about that? If they want the music available on iTMS they have to make a deal with the person that owns the rights to the song. If the artist no longer owns the rights to their own music, it's usually because they signed them away for some real or perceived benefit. They music industry is replete with stories of artist who have made bad deals, Grand Funk Railroad just to name one, ( and don't ya' think Paul Mcartney throws darts at a pic of Michael Jackson everytime a Nike ad comes on with "Revolution" as the music!). The situation is far from perfect, but I don't see where iTMS can change it. Oh, and since every provider of music is in the same boat, where are you going to get your music, since the artist is getting "screwed" by all of them.
2.)Isn't DRM an intellectual property, covered by a copyright issued by a sovereign nation? Aren't there international accords between most nations to honor each others copyrights? Isn't this law by the french the same as telling an artist that they must make their music available for other artist to be able to record and make money off of? This is bad law. The whole idea behind copyright and patent law is that if you come up with something unique and different, you should be able to profit from it without having a bunch of tag alongs sucking up the market off of your work. If you don't like the way iTMS and iPod work, you are perfectly free to not use them! Use the competitive product. Or burn a CD, stick it in your Sony Walkman, and BE HAPPY!

 

[Arnaud]

2.)Isn't DRM an intellectual property, covered by a copyright issued by a sovereign nation? Aren't there international accords between most nations to honor each others copyrights? Isn't this law by the french the same as telling an artist that they must make their music available for other artist to be able to record and make money off of? This is bad law. The whole idea behind copyright and patent law is that if you come up with something unique and different, you should be able to profit from it without having a bunch of tag alongs sucking up the market off of your work. If you don't like the way iTMS and iPod work, you are perfectly free to not use them! Use the competitive product. Or burn a CD, stick it in your Sony Walkman, and BE HAPPY!

I understand that the French law asks a music provider to make its DRM available to all mp3-player manufacturers. This way, the market is open, but wherever you buy your music, and on whichever player you use it, it is still DRM-protected, thus not open be "stolen".

Providers are not asked to drop the DRM.

 

[dsnort]

I understand that the French law asks a music provider to make its DRM available to all mp3-player manufacturers. This way, the market is open, but wherever you buy your music, and on whichever player you use it, it is still DRM-protected, thus not open be "stolen".

Providers are not asked to drop the DRM.

I'm not an expert, and i may be waaaaay off base, but I think you missed my point. Apples DRM is as much an intellectual property as an artist's songs. They have the same right to be protected as a songwriter. If their right is not protected, who's will be?

 

[Timepass]

My question to everyone defending apple.

What if instead of apple being affect so heavy by this law it was M$. M$ before forced to open up there DRM because they have control over that market with a music player and music store tie in like apple. APple is some small fry that cannt get in the market. Would you all being the saying the same thing. if the answer is no then all you arguments go out the window because it no based on ethics or anything it based on your worship of apple. Now if the answer is yes then you have formed your own opinan and not following one company blindly.

 

[dsnort]

My question to everyone defending apple.

What if instead of apple being affect so heavy by this law it was M$. M$ before forced to open up there DRM because they have control over that market with a music player and music store tie in like apple. APple is some small fry that cannt get in the market. Would you all being the saying the same thing. if the answer is no then all you arguments go out the window because it no based on ethics or anything it based on your worship of apple. Now if the answer is yes then you have formed your own opinan and not following one company blindly.

A valid question. Your hypothetical parallel is off on a couple of key points though.

1. Apple does not have a monopoly on this market. They have the major market share. There is a difference.

2. Sony a small fry? I don't think so.