From Snow Leopard to ?

[Peter Franks]

Good advice on iFixit, yes. Is it not OK to reinstall the OS on to the SSD when it's fitted on the laptop? I was going to install the OS when installed or am I being more stupid than usual here and that won't work unless I have a disk, then just hope that a Time Machine back up from Snow Leopard will reinstall onto the El Capitan, in an ideal world

Yes, will stick with the 8GB, and may as well change that anyway while it's open for the SSD.

Thanks again

 

[EugW]

You can get an SSD and a $20 USB enclosure.

Install the OS on the external SSD and boot off it. If it boots fine and runs what you want, then you can simply remove the drive from the USB enclosure and put it in your Mac.

The benefit is you KNOW it's working before you remove your working HD.

 

[Peter Franks]

OP wrote:
"Not sure I completely understand the 'dongle' bit? I get what you mean, to do all of it outside the laptop, but not sure I'd know how to."

DON'T "overthink" this.
There's nothing complicated about getting the SSD "prepped and ready" using an external USB connection -- BEFORE you install it.

The Mac will boot and run as easily from an external drive as it does with the internal one.

If you do it this way, and run into glitches, YOU WILL STILL HAVE A MACBOOK THAT BOOTS AND RUNS. You can keep working to get it right.
If you put it in BEFORE you have prepped and tested it, and the MacBook doesn't work, things are going to be much more complicated to sort out.

Again, there's nothing overly difficult.
Assemble your materials.
Get back to us "when you're ready" to begin.

I guarantee a 99% success rate IF you follow the instructions I'll post for you.
I'm that confident.

I see.... I will do as suggested, and thanks for this. I'd always assumed I would do it the other way, but external makes more sense yes, I just hadn't heard of this before.
[doublepost=1519757410][/doublepost]

You can get an SSD and a $20 USB enclosure.

Install the OS on the external SSD and boot off it. If it boots fine and runs what you want, then you can simply remove the drive from the USB enclosure and put it in your Mac.

The benefit is you KNOW it's working before you remove your working HD.

Thanks, I'd never heard of this before, amazingly. I can just download El Capitan from the store as a download before it starts installing then, and drag onto the external drive? Who knew... apart from everyone on here!

 

[Chazzle]

Good advice on iFixit, yes. Is it not OK to reinstall the OS on to the SSD when it's fitted on the laptop? I was going to install the OS when installed or am I being more stupid than usual here and that won't work unless I have a disk, then just hope that a Time Machine back up from Snow Leopard will reinstall onto the El Capitan, in an ideal world

Yes, will stick with the 8GB, and may as well change that anyway while it's open for the SSD.

Thanks again

You certainly can install the OS once it’s already installed in the laptop (I would recommend a bootable OS installer on a thumb drive instead of a disk though.)

However, as someone else stated, you may want to do all of this without installing the drive (dongle needed) in case you have issues and need to go back to you old drive. Once the SSD is formatted with the new OS and you’ve restored your data and it boots up fine using the dongle, then I would recommend installing it internally.

You could even use that dongle to turn your old drive into an external hard drive.

 

[Peter Franks]

Thank you. It's the reinstall of OS and back up that's the main worry. I've never done anything remotely like that. I've visions of me overwriting the internal by mistake. I'll order the necessary drive and dongle. Appreciated.

 

[AmazingRobie]

IMO Snow Leopard is basically unusable in 2018. Way, way too old. You can't even surf properly on it.

We mostly used it for Photoshop, illustrator, google images and final cut. All of which were fast, except final cut which has never been fast on any of the machines we've owned. What specifically did you have the problem with, e-commerce sites or just sites with new code that wouldn't run properly? Do remember something about Google Chrome constantly giving notifications that it would no longer receive updates. If the box is being used as a tool, Snow Leopard is the way to go. If you're going to just email and browse the web or if those things are important to you, I suppose the lack of a usable internet browser on some sites might be a drawback, but google images worked just fine.

 

[EugW]

We mostly used it for Photoshop, illustrator, google images and final cut. All of which were fast, except final cut which has never been fast on any of the machines we've owned. What specifically did you have the problem with, e-commerce sites or just sites with new code that wouldn't run properly? Do remember something about Google Chrome constantly giving notifications that it would no longer receive updates. If the box is being used as a tool, Snow Leopard is the way to go.

You can't even run current versions of iTunes, Safari, Chrome, or Firefox on it, and lots of other current software won't run on it either.

Personally, I wouldn't recommend anything less than 10.10.5, with 10.11 preferred. I retired a 10.7.5 MacBook long ago for example, and eventually just installed Chrome OS on it, just to be able to run a current version of the Chrome browser.

I replaced that machine with a 2008 aluminum MacBook, which is running 10.13 High Sierra (with SSD and 8 GB RAM). For maximum compatibility though, I would recommend 10.12 Sierra or as mentioned, 10.11 El Capitan. If you were choosing one today though, I suggest 10.12 Sierra, if the machine can run it, because 10.11 El Capitan is effectively being end-of-lifed this year (2018).

If you're going to just email and browse the web or if those things are important to you, I suppose the lack of a usable internet browser on some sites might be a drawback, but google images worked just fine.

Understatement of the year. For a primary general use machine, I don't see the point of running an OS that can't even run current browsers. It's a pretty big deal not being able to log into your bank website or whatever.

Sure, I know people who ran OS 9 ten years after it was obsolete, but that was for specific software for specific purposes, like custom software on an individual machine to run a industrial printing machine, etc. That's far different than trying to use it as multi-purpose main machine.

BTW, the current versions of Creative Cloud don't run on Snow Leopard either. CS6 does though.

 

[Peter Franks]

Chrome stopped the use of Google images over a year ago on my 10.6.8 as well as many other features.. I've never got on with Firefox, to not be able to pinch to enlarge is a big factor. I've forgotten Safari it's been so long to it's worked on SL. I do like Snow Leopard but Photoshop is painful now. That's probably the age of my 2011 rather than the OS. Who knows.

Would any of you recommend this while it's on offer?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Samsung-in...&pf_rd_p=14f91171-0541-58ad-938b-3aec945f4cb7


I was hoping to just fit it in, but just to confuse me... one of the reviewers says this about using with Mac:
Like I need something else to worry about, TRIM what?

The short answer is that a Samsung 850 Pro will work on any Operating system,
Windows, Linux or Mac.
However, you will need to enable TRIM or your ssd will slow down and have
a shorter life. Since it is an Apple computer you will need a third party
'Trim enabler' to do this on Lion OS or above. Below Lion it needs to be
done manually.
If your operating system is Yosemite then Apple has now made it especially
harder for you. It can be circumvented but it requires a security reduction
and updates can cause problems that are not straight forward to cure.
If you buy your ssd from Apple then there is no problem(bless em). You can
also look at a OWC ssd which has a built in work around.
Familiarise yourself with TRIM and AHCI so you are confident of what is required
before you go ahead. In the meantime check your EFI and SMC Firmware is up to date.


How is there such a difference with data transfer with 750MB per second on that one, and 6GB a second on this one

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01IAGSD68/ref=psdc_430505031_t1_B00P73B1E4

 

[chrisherbert]

Chrome stopped the use of Google images over a year ago on my 10.6.8 as well as many other features.. I've never got on with Firefox, to not be able to pinch to enlarge is a big factor. I've forgotten Safari it's been so long to it's worked on SL. I do like Snow Leopard but Photoshop is painful now. That's probably the age of my 2011 rather than the OS. Who knows.

Would any of you recommend this while it's on offer?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Samsung-in...&pf_rd_p=14f91171-0541-58ad-938b-3aec945f4cb7


I was hoping to just fit it in, but just to confuse me... one of the reviewers says this about using with Mac:
Like I need something else to worry about, TRIM what?

The short answer is that a Samsung 850 Pro will work on any Operating system,
Windows, Linux or Mac.
However, you will need to enable TRIM or your ssd will slow down and have
a shorter life. Since it is an Apple computer you will need a third party
'Trim enabler' to do this on Lion OS or above. Below Lion it needs to be
done manually.
If your operating system is Yosemite then Apple has now made it especially
harder for you. It can be circumvented but it requires a security reduction
and updates can cause problems that are not straight forward to cure.
If you buy your ssd from Apple then there is no problem(bless em). You can
also look at a OWC ssd which has a built in work around.
Familiarise yourself with TRIM and AHCI so you are confident of what is required
before you go ahead. In the meantime check your EFI and SMC Firmware is up to date.


How is there such a difference with data transfer with 750MB per second on that one, and 6GB a second on this one

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01IAGSD68/ref=psdc_430505031_t1_B00P73B1E4

Both of those drives should be good. You will not get 6GB/second on the Crucial drive - compare the two drives' read speeds. They are about the same.

Enabling Trim on newer versions of OSX is a simple, single command affair. Maybe it was harder on Yosemite, I don't remember.

 

[EugW]

Chrome stopped the use of Google images over a year ago on my 10.6.8 as well as many other features.. I've never got on with Firefox, to not be able to pinch to enlarge is a big factor. I've forgotten Safari it's been so long to it's worked on SL. I do like Snow Leopard but Photoshop is painful now. That's probably the age of my 2011 rather than the OS. Who knows.

Would any of you recommend this while it's on offer?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Samsung-in...&pf_rd_p=14f91171-0541-58ad-938b-3aec945f4cb7


I was hoping to just fit it in, but just to confuse me... one of the reviewers says this about using with Mac:
Like I need something else to worry about, TRIM what?

The short answer is that a Samsung 850 Pro will work on any Operating system,
Windows, Linux or Mac.
However, you will need to enable TRIM or your ssd will slow down and have
a shorter life. Since it is an Apple computer you will need a third party
'Trim enabler' to do this on Lion OS or above. Below Lion it needs to be
done manually.
If your operating system is Yosemite then Apple has now made it especially
harder for you. It can be circumvented but it requires a security reduction
and updates can cause problems that are not straight forward to cure.
If you buy your ssd from Apple then there is no problem(bless em). You can
also look at a OWC ssd which has a built in work around.
Familiarise yourself with TRIM and AHCI so you are confident of what is required
before you go ahead. In the meantime check your EFI and SMC Firmware is up to date.


How is there such a difference with data transfer with 750MB per second on that one, and 6GB a second on this one

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01IAGSD68/ref=psdc_430505031_t1_B00P73B1E4

The number is actually 6 Gbps not 6 GB/s, and it's the max theoretical speed of the interface, not the actual speed of the drive.

Really, the only thing you should be concerned about is the random read speed, and the Samsung 850 EVO is faster.

http://www.storagereview.com/crucial_mx300_ssd_review

However, anything above about 20 MB/s for 4K random writes will make your machine feel very, very fast.

 

[Peter Franks]

Thanks both of you. I'll get that Samsung one. And the '4' memory cards x 2 . Any particular make to match up to with those or are they basically much of a much with them?

That's weird. That Samsung Amazon link when I posted was from the UK version which is what I was in, and now it's linking to the US .com one. Strange.

Also, do I need an enclosure case and a cable with that SSD, unless it goes straight in presumably

 

[AmazingRobie]

You can't even run current versions of iTunes, Safari, Chrome, or Firefox on it, and lots of other current software won't run on it either.

Understatement of the year. For a primary general use machine, I don't see the point of running an OS that can't even run current browsers. It's a pretty big deal not being able to log into your bank website or whatever.

That's far different than trying to use it as multi-purpose main machine.

BTW, the current versions of Creative Cloud don't run on Snow Leopard either. CS6 does though.

iTunes=POS (it's unfortunate Apple forces you use it to get music and other data onto your phone, but that is what it is and if your resourceful, there are alternatives.)
Safari, Chrome, Firefox are all web browsers. Like was mentioned, if internet is a deal breaker for you, it may not be the best option.
Adobe CC=Again, POS. CS6 is better in all respects for our purposes, may not be for you or others. Photoshop CC whenever it would open in High Sierra the temperature in the box would jump from around 35 degrees to 78 degrees and stay that way until PS was closed. It's a POS.
Bottom line, if you're more happy having a machine that doesn't prematurely burn itself out because it runs hot every time you work on it, is fast and mobile banking e-commerce tasks can be done via another OS like Windows/Linux virtually, then maybe consider staying on Snow Leopard.
Honestly, we don't use the Internet for anything other than images and it works just fine for that. We have another box that runs HS and the laptop runs Snow Leopard. The laptop, being an older machine runs like crap with newer OSs installed on it, it's sluggish as f. So if you don't mind that sort of behaviour, then do that. Up to you. No one individual is going to like everything you like, nor do they have to. That's what makes life grand, ain't it.

 

[EugW]

iTunes=POS (it's unfortunate Apple forces you use it to get music and other data onto your phone, but that is what it is and if your resourceful, there are alternatives.)
Safari, Chrome, Firefox are all web browsers. Like was mentioned, if internet is a deal breaker for you, it may not be the best option.
Adobe CC=Again, POS. CS6 is better in all respects for our purposes, may not be for you or others. Photoshop CC whenever it would open in High Sierra the temperature in the box would jump from around 35 degrees to 78 degrees and stay that way until PS was closed. It's a POS.
Bottom line, if you're more happy having a machine that doesn't prematurely burn itself out because it runs hot every time you work on it, is fast and mobile banking e-commerce tasks can be done via another OS like Windows/Linux virtually, then maybe consider staying on Snow Leopard.
Honestly, we don't use the Internet for anything other than images and it works just fine for that. We have another box that runs HS and the laptop runs Snow Leopard. The laptop, being an older machine runs like crap with newer OSs installed on it, it's sluggish as f. So if you don't mind that sort of behaviour, then do that. Up to you. No one individual is going to like everything you like, nor do they have to. That's what makes life grand, ain't it.

So, basically your answer is that if you like to run modern software, don't use Snow Leopard. I would agree with that.

 

[AmazingRobie]

So, basically your answer is that if you like to run modern software, don't use Snow Leopard. I would agree with that.

Can't get more "modern" than a hammer.

 

[Peter Franks]

You two should have your own show! I'd watch/listen to it.
Anyway, can you just point in right direction for enclosure case and a cable with that SSD, or don't bother with Samsung and get all from Crucial?

 

[Peter Franks]

Can anyone tell me where I find all the speeds and timings listed below, so I know I'm getting the correct RAM?
For example, what voltage is mine, and what is the 9-9-9-24?
The only thing I can match up with my MBP is the 1333 DDR3 on the typical listing below

• CMSO8GX3M2A1333C9
• SO-DIMM
• 1333 MHz frequency
• Voltage: 1.5 V
• 9-9-9-24

 

[EugW]

Can anyone tell me where I find all the speeds and timings listed below, so I know I'm getting the correct RAM?
For example, what voltage is mine, and what is the 9-9-9-24?
The only thing I can match up with my MBP is the 1333 DDR3 on the typical listing below

• 
  
  
  • CMSO8GX3M2A1333C9
  • SO-DIMM
  • 1333 MHz frequency
  • Voltage: 1.5 V
  • 9-9-9-24

Go to crucial.com and look up your machine.

 

[Peter Franks]

OK, so 2.3Ghz only refers to 'Early 2011', so that must be what mine is, of which there are parts I need specific to my MBP, but after searching untold amount of site's specs for this model, and scanning the pages, I don't see anything that relates to '9-9-9-24' on specs or parts for the RAM, and no explanation of what that is, just told to make sure it matches up with that on a YouTube vid.
It's on the front of the RAM packaging, but still stumped as to what those numbers are. And if they mean anything at all?

Out of interest, what is the difference between the Samsung 850 Evo and 860 Evo that says Sata lll 64LV which the 850 doesn't

 

[Crunch]

If I had the choice and wanted something newer than Snow Leopard, and really who can blame you, I would go no higher than 10.11 El Capitan. Whatever you do, avoid High Sierra like the unmitigated plague that it is.

 

[Peter Franks]

If I had the choice and wanted something newer than Snow Leopard, and really who can blame you, I would go no higher than 10.11 El Capitan. Whatever you do, avoid High Sierra like the unmitigated plague that it is.

Thanks for the warning. In truth, I've never heard anyone rave about any OS since Snow Leopard. I've only heard negatives about every one since. Go figure. If it wasn't for the fact that iTunes and Safari/Chrome have punished me for using SL, I probably wouldn't have looked into it.

 

[Guy Clark]

Would any of you recommend El Capitan over High Sierra if I'm still on an old 2011 MBP using Snow Leopard?

Or just stick with SL. It's a bit of a pain having to change all the Office/Photoshop programmes to work with later OS, but figure it's time I did something about it. Has anyone done just this and regretted it. Any help would be good. Thanks

It all depends on what you are doing on your Mac. If you are not looking to run the latest releases of software then sticking with Snow Leopard should be fine.
Consider upgrading if you use online banking or if you need to run the latest software. Snow Leopard is no longer supported by Steam or Dropbox and the latest versions of Spotify and VLC can no longer be installed. The most up to date supported web browser is Firefox 45.9 ESR and works well.
If you are looking to upgrade go with macOS 10.12.6 Sierra as macOS 10.13.3 High Sierra can be pain depending on the Mac it is being installed upon.
El Capitan support will finish following the release of macOS 10.14 so in effect you would be going from one unsupported release to another if you were to go with OS X El Capitan.
A straight upgrade to macOS Sierra is not possible so a clean installation is the only option which is what I would recommend anyway. Before beginning I would suggest maxing out the RAM and fitting either an SSD or SSHD Solid State Hybrid Drive as you would experience a massive improvement in performance.

To make a fresh installation macOS Sierra you will need to create a USB installer
https://lifehacker.com/how-to-make-a-bootable-macos-sierra-usb-flash-drive-1786853248

Oh and before you begin carry out a Time Machine Back up. This is Essential.

 

[Yvan256]

Mid-2010 Mac mini (2.4GHZ Core 2 Duo) with 16GB RAM and a low-end 128GB SSD since I'm limited by the first-generation SATA anyway.

I've been using 10.9.5 for months and I'm happy with it.

 

[Peter Franks]

It all depends on what you are doing on your Mac. If you are not looking to run the latest releases of software then sticking with Snow Leopard should be fine.
Consider upgrading if you use online banking or if you need to run the latest software. Snow Leopard is no longer supported by Steam or Dropbox and the latest versions of Spotify and VLC can no longer be installed. The most up to date supported web browser is Firefox 45.9 ESR and works well.
If you are looking to upgrade go with macOS 10.12.6 Sierra as macOS 10.13.3 High Sierra can be pain depending on the Mac it is being installed upon.
El Capitan support will finish following the release of macOS 10.14 so in effect you would be going from one unsupported release to another if you were to go with OS X El Capitan.
A straight upgrade to macOS Sierra is not possible so a clean installation is the only option which is what I would recommend anyway. Before beginning I would suggest maxing out the RAM and fitting either an SSD or SSHD Solid State Hybrid Drive as you would experience a massive improvement in performance.

To make a fresh installation macOS Sierra you will need to create a USB installer
https://lifehacker.com/how-to-make-a-bootable-macos-sierra-usb-flash-drive-1786853248

Oh and before you begin carry out a Time Machine Back up. This is Essential.

Thanks, I do use online banking, and desperate for latest iTunes as old one locked out all devices.
Time Machine on Snow Leopard will still put stuff back files as is, even on a different operating system presumably or do I need to book back up on SL after new SSD and then upgrade to later OS?

You mention SSHD instead of SSD, what's the deal with that, and is the 850 or 860 Samsung EVO good enough?
Not sure what the difference is between the 850 Evo or 860 Sata lll Evo is? or the RAM as I'd asked on #43 up here.

 

[FNH15]

Thanks, I do use online banking, and desperate for latest iTunes as old one locked out all devices.
Time Machine on Snow Leopard will still put stuff back files as is, even on a different operating system presumably or do I need to book back up on SL after new SSD and then upgrade to later OS?

You mention SSHD instead of SSD, what's the deal with that, and is the 850 or 860 Samsung EVO good enough?
Not sure what the difference is between the 850 Evo or 860 Sata lll Evo is? or the RAM as I'd asked on #43 up here.

The RAM you linked to should work just fine. The 860 has a higher amount of total lifespan writes as opposed to the 850, but the same read/write speed.

My suggestion: put your new SSD in an external enclosure (or simply buy a SATA to USB cable off of Amazon), install Sierra on it, transfer that drive to your machine, boot off of the new SSD, and, when it asks you to on the initial setup, select your Time Machine backup and let macOS port over your Apps, home folder, and settings. Also, try out Safari on Sierra- its come a long way since Safari 5.x on Snow Leopard...

 

[Spectrum]

After sitting happily with Snow Leopard 10.6.8 on MBPro 15" 2011 and Mac mini i7 2011, I finally started upgrading to El Capitan in Nov/Dec due to Dropbox dropping support in 2018. I can report that my main work machine (i7 mac mini 2011), is running EL Cap very nicely - even with two screens attached (27 inch and 24 inch). The 15 MBPro is also running EL Cap smoothly. I also upgraded an 'ancient' 2008 15 MBPro to El Cap. This also works great.

I didn't notice anything slower on any of the machines compared to SL. The only poor piece of software is Apple Preview which seems almost completely broken in El Cap compared to Snow Leopard. Very slow to render PDFs, and half the time the text never goes sharp.

For some things the UI of El Cap is certainly better than SL (e.g. Finder). Indeed, I was surprised how much I like the upgrade to El Cap. I was burned by Lion - which I thought was absolutely terrible, and fought to find patches so that I could run SL on the 2011 machines. I chose never to upgrade after that (until now).

I should add: both machines have SSDs as main boot drive (Crucial) and either 8GB (MBPro) or 16 GB (mini). I hope you also have a good experience!

[Note: For old PPC software, I have VMWare running SLserver. This works surprisingly well.]