Future Apple Watch to Adopt Solid State Buttons With Haptic Feedback

carloss_r

macrumors newbie
Dec 15, 2017
5
2
If haptic feedback is on all their other products, the move to do the same to the watch doesn't surprise me. It's worked fine on other devices, so I'm sure it will work as fine or even better on the watch.
 

Icaras

macrumors 603
Mar 18, 2008
5,835
2,260
California, United States
Never used, or used and didn't like? I've used a newer MacBook butterfly keyboard plenty. Used it for a month to try to write with it, and then used it to type up the eBay description to sell it because it sucked so badly.
I was responding to the use of solid state haptic trackpad and touchscreens on those devices, as that is the technology this article is referring to on a future Apple Watch. Not the keyboard.
 

ignatius345

macrumors 68020
Aug 20, 2015
2,330
3,092
I was responding to the use of solid state haptic trackpad and touchscreens on those devices, as that is the technology this article is referring to on a future Apple Watch. Not the keyboard.
Fair point, but they do seem very hostile to physical interfaces as of the past few years. I can understand the appeal, but I for one still think they're important in certain places. The trackpads and iOS home buttons do a remarkable job of mimicking physical movement, for sure, but I don't believe it always translates. What they tried to do with that butterfly keyboard is a great example of that. They tried to all but eliminate key travel, and it's just awful for human fingers to use.
 
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blasto2236

macrumors 6502a
Nov 4, 2012
768
372
I can't imagine this happening if only because there's no way to force a restart if there's a software issue that's preventing the solid state buttons from functioning.

When the home button on the iPhone 7/7 Plus and beyond went solid state, they re-mapped the force restart command to the volume and side buttons because you *need* physical hardware buttons that will always be reliable (so longs they are functioning) and are not controlled by software that could much more easily stop working for whatever reason.

You already have to mail in an Apple Watch for a lot of software related issues (failure during updates causing the dreaded "!" message, etc) and that would drastically increase if you couldn't fix simple issues by forcing a restart with physical hardware buttons.

I don't see it happening for that reason alone. There needs to be at least 1 physical button on any product like this so you can override malfunctioning software when necessary.
 

thefourthpope

macrumors 6502a
Sep 8, 2007
937
171
DelMarVa
leaving more room for a bigger battery
I think we all know it won’t be a bigger battery.
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I can't imagine this happening if only because there's no way to force a restart if there's a software issue that's preventing the solid state buttons from functioning ...
There needs to be at least 1 physical button on any product like this so you can override malfunctioning software when necessary.
Add one of the paper clip-size holes like for SIM cards?
 

JPack

macrumors 601
Mar 27, 2017
4,681
7,008
I can't imagine this happening if only because there's no way to force a restart if there's a software issue that's preventing the solid state buttons from functioning.

When the home button on the iPhone 7/7 Plus and beyond went solid state, they re-mapped the force restart command to the volume and side buttons because you *need* physical hardware buttons that will always be reliable (so longs they are functioning) and are not controlled by software that could much more easily stop working for whatever reason.

You already have to mail in an Apple Watch for a lot of software related issues (failure during updates causing the dreaded "!" message, etc) and that would drastically increase if you couldn't fix simple issues by forcing a restart with physical hardware buttons.

I don't see it happening for that reason alone. There needs to be at least 1 physical button on any product like this so you can override malfunctioning software when necessary.
Forcing a restart is really not a problem because the Watch has an inductive charger.

The Watch can be designed in a way to force a reset if it receives a particular voltage or frequency. This would be no different than AirPods. It's a software upgradable device with no physical buttons. The AirPod resets if it receives a unique signal across the charging pins.
 

Mac 128

macrumors 603
Apr 16, 2015
5,361
2,903
How do you get the tactile feel of a spinning grooved digital crown from your static surface?
I don’t even get it now. When I scroll, it’s like I’m just rubbing my finger on the edge of the bezel, or lift and place, but no real sense that the crown is spinning. That’s why it’s kind of a pointless, stylistic throwback to analogue watches.

Raise to wake is quite reliable IMO. Probably less than 1% failure rate.


Moving it around would just make the burn-in area larger and slightly fuzzy. Phones with always-on displays have a much larger display to move the graphics around on; not really any such luxury on a watch, or at least not with an analog watchface.


You seem to forget that the camera is bigger than its lens, and also that part of the bezel of an apple watch rests on the casing of the watch. You have to physically be able to fit the devices INSIDE the watch case.

Notching the display is going to be like going to failtown. Pretty much no matter where you put the notch it will interfere with some part of a watchface or widgets or app layouts.

Also like I said, very small cameras with very small lenses have bad image quality, particularly in low light, and sticking a camera on your wrist is always going to be a very bumpy ride. As soon as you move your arm (which doesn't have the same fine motor control as your hands/fingers) the image will shake like crazy. It would be a terrible experience for facetime for example, and unergonomic for the watch wearer as well. Try holding up your arm aiming your watch level with the ground at your face for any length of time. It's not going to be comfortable.


You unlock your watch just once when you put it on, and then it stays unlocked (unless the strap is too loose...) Not much point in face recognition then.

Forget cameras. It's a dead-end idea, shown by the general lack of cameras in pretty much all other wrist wearables as well.
Raise to wake is not always an option. Try slight twist to wake and it’s almost a 98% fail rate.

I agree moving the screen around would defeat the whole point we want it, and wouldn’t necessarily solve the problem as you speculate. New technology is needed.

I didn’t forget the camera has a bigger mechanism than the lens and even stated as much, in that the bigger concern was whether there was room for it INSIDE the watch case, it whether there was room on the watch face.

Notching the display is no more going to be “failtown” than it was on the iPhone X. The interface guidelines will just be designed to incorporate it just like on the iPhone. And it will be inconsequential if Apple actually enlarges the display as rumored — users will still have more space than they do now.

Again I don’t agree with your assumption of what’s possible with cameras. I’ve actually done video chats with people who had android watches and it worked fine. As for the quality, well it’s a convenience isn’t it? There will be trade offs as there have been in all Apple products. The connection can ruin a good quality camera image too. Again, I don’t agree with you having both experienced video chats with those who have watch cameras. Add to that FaceTime is simply a fatiguing activity whether one has to hold up and iPad or an iPhone. I rest those devices on a surface, just like I probably would with a watch for a lengthy conversation, so I don’t know why this objection keeps coming up. Again it’s a convenience, so just like the Apple Watch has been able to take phone calls since S0 and drain the battery incredibly fast, so people just don’t do it. The same would be true for FaceTime.

Facial recognition can be used for more than ID purposes, it can also be used for eye detection — is a user still looking at the watch to know whether to keep the display backlight on or turn it off quicker. It also solves part of the problem with raise to wake when that’s not a reliable situation. And I’d rather not have to poke my code in whenever I take the watch on and off which is several times throughout the day. It makes the experience less convenient.

Finally, while I appreciate your concern, I’m not going to “forget cameras” as I see too many benefits to having it. But you’re entitled to your opinion. We’ll see how it ultimately turns out. I remember chatting with people who made similar passionate arguments about not needing a cellular radio in the watch, despite Android wear having them, and now look.

If I had to guess, the Apple Watch will eventually replace the iPhone, and as such it will do most of the things we expect from it too, including a camera.
 
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[AUT] Thomas

macrumors 6502
Mar 13, 2016
375
317
Graz [Austria]
IMHO have a smartwatch with touchscreen and no buttons or no touchscreen and a few buttons/dials. The combination never made sense for me. I mean with a gyro, accelerometer and touchscreen there should be plenty of options to navigate that don't involve physical buttons...

Also, please bring an AW light that skips HRV sensor, vibration (I'll take a nano electric shock instead... much simpler to implement) and all other stuff that makes it thick. The AW is the one and only Apple device that needs slimming down. A lot.
 

wigby

macrumors 68000
Jun 7, 2007
1,777
1,195
So I can't push the button with standard gloves on?

Isn't that the button I need to push in emergencies?!?
Presumably, the button wouldn't be multitouch or capacitive so standard gloves would work fine.
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I might be weird but I don’t use the spinning wheel - I always touch The screen to make selections
Do you use Time Travel or change the volume on your watch? I don't even know how to adjust those things without the digital crown.
 

Tech198

macrumors G5
Mar 21, 2011
13,976
1,643
Australia, Perth
It's all about increasing Apple's battery's.

"Solid state buttons will improve water resistance in the Apple Watch and also take up less space, leaving more room for a bigger battery or other components."

I wonder what these 'other components' will be.

If haptic feedback is on all their other products, the move to do the same to the watch doesn't surprise me. It's worked fine on other devices, so I'm sure it will work as fine or even better on the watch.
I usually reckon, once its starts one, the rest won't be far behind.
 

Pupi

macrumors 6502
Apr 12, 2015
285
397
This Watch should be the Apple Watch equivalent to the iPhone 4, with Apple finally iterating the design based on the learnings from the first versions. I’m truly excited.
 

citysnaps

macrumors 603
Oct 10, 2011
5,126
7,759
San Francisco
can't stand the taptic track pads
I love them. Unlike their predecessors, you can press-click anywhere on the trackpad surface, and with the same amount of force.
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Try using the home button with a bandaid on. It doesn't work. (obviously TouchID doesn't).
Force-click detection on an Apple trackpad works fine with a bandaid on. The phone is different requiring detection of a finger via capacitance touch.
 
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Mac 128

macrumors 603
Apr 16, 2015
5,361
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Try turning the watch around then flipping the display in Settings. (‘Left-handed mode’ on the right hand, so to speak.)
This is one of the reasons I think they should get rid of the Digital Crown. The idea that it’s an asymmetrical design, which was initially only ever shown in right-handed mode in all of the marketing and advertising, cementing that it was designed for that specific look by Jony Ive, and then telling left-handed customers just to flip it was just silly. Apple should have offered a proper left-handed watch with the Digital Crown in the upper left.

There’s no reason to keep it now really, especially when they didn’t even bother to design it properly. Everything it does can be handled by a touch bar down the side of the bezel.
 

hxlover904

macrumors regular
Aug 20, 2011
140
37
I love them. Unlike their predecessors, you can press-click anywhere on the trackpad surface, and with the same amount of force.
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Force-click detection on an Apple trackpad works fine with a bandaid on. The phone is different requiring detection of a finger via capacitance touch.
I know. thats why I said home button and q
I love them. Unlike their predecessors, you can press-click anywhere on the trackpad surface, and with the same amount of force.
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Force-click detection on an Apple trackpad works fine with a bandaid on. The phone is different requiring detection of a finger via capacitance touch.
I know. thats why I said home button and replied to your post saying it is like the trackpads. They aren't. And gloves dont work with the button on the phones.
 

aleni

macrumors 68020
Jun 2, 2006
2,136
236
Do you have an iPhone 7 or 8? The click is very much there even though the home "button" is solid-state. Once you get used to the slightly different feel, it's very difficult to tell that it isn't an actual mechanical button.
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I'm not sure what the point of this post is. The new Apple Watch will certainly be backwards-compatible to all prior AW bands.
What’s so great about taptic engine is when you click either the flashlight or the camera button in the iPhone X’s homescreen, it feels like I’m clicking real physical buttons. It blows my mind.
 
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ElectronGuru

macrumors 65816
Sep 5, 2013
1,492
361
Oregon, USA
They are going to have to do a lot more than that to get me interested in the Watch.

I dont wear any watch, my phone is enough
Neither do I but this is a killer app situation.

Killer app: the function made possible by the hardware that alone makes buying the hardware worth it.

The KA of the orginal watches was time. This carried watches forward for generations but cell phones (with their own killer app of portable calls) took over that role.

The KA of the AW is health monitoring. Get enough scans of enough vital signs and it won’t matter what else the watch does, it will be worth buying (and wearing) the hardware.
 
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