Ghosting / Blur Video - 16" MBP

[Alex W.]

Ive been trying to find the best way to demonstrate the issues with the 16" screen, its worse then even the entry level iPad in terms of ghosting and trailing. Basically the white to black pixel change is what shows the issues in the best possible case -- ive taken two videos to help show what the MacBook display is doing -- opinions?

The video is 90% of what im looking at.

1)

2)

Heres a photo of the blurring and slow pixel black to white refresh time moving right to left.

Im trying really hard to love this device, but this screen is murdering me -- my only complaint with it.
Its pushing me to get a 2020 XPS, potentially. I would love to keep this because I love OSX and the workflow, I went ahead and got AppleCare hoping support can see this as an issue.

Very disappointed that the most vital thing you have to look at is so subpar for any minor amount of motion, leaving 1/4 and 1/8 trails when moving up down, but its showing very clearly when when you move a window in a circle to demonstrate the display issues clearly.


My Surface pro from gen 1 to gen 8 never had issues like this.
My old 15.6" HP from 2013 didn't, my MBP 2017, 2011 doesn't.
[automerge]1589674569[/automerge]

 

[MrGimper]

Not entirely sure what you're expecting from this...... you keep saying it's ruining your experience yet you had 14 days to test the device and didn't return it because you explained to me you were distracted investigating further issues with the machine (coil whine, heat etc.) And now you seem to keep banging your head against the same wall saying the screen is "murdering" you. What closure are you looking for? Someone, like me, to say "nah don't worry about it, I don't sit there dragging windows around in circles for hours on end so I don't get the issue?" If you aren't happy with it then you should have returned it. If you aren't happy now then sell it and get some other Apple, or non-Apple device. Either way move on.....

 

[powerslave12r]

From the reviews, and previous discussions, the display also suffers from PWM dimming. It's very disappointing. I think the 2015 (and perhaps the 2016?) Macbook Pros were the last ones without PWM dimming.

 

[TheRealAlex]

Yeah that video the trail ghosting is clearly Apple is using a low grade 59- 60Hz 8-bit IPS panel in this laptop.

I orders a new 2020 Dell XPS 15 Thanks to a 20% work discount code and an extra 20% Dell Memorial Day special by calling in.

the new 2020 DELL XPS uses A 10-bit IPS panel touch screen 4K HDR which can Overclock to 75hz so you won’t see any ghosting or blur.

 

[bill-p]

It's a 60Hz screen. All 60Hz screens look equally blurry to me.

If you aren't happy, go get one of those gaming laptops with a 120Hz or 144Hz panel. That should be ghost-free then.

I don't know why you have to keep complaining. Apple never listens to its users on here anyways.

 

[Alex W.]

It's a 60Hz screen. All 60Hz screens look equally blurry to me.

If you aren't happy, go get one of those gaming laptops with a 120Hz or 144Hz panel. That should be ghost-free then.

I don't know why you have to keep complaining. Apple never listens to its users on here anyways.

That isn't true at all, the Pixel response time is what causes ghosting, this is a 5ms panel, at 60 hz, but what makes it ghost badly is the horrid pixel refresh / response time of almost 60ms. I actually do work on a quality 60hz and its not even comparable to this, its fine.

 

[HarryPot]

I just got me MBP 16" yesterday.

Can't complain about the display.
Looks similar to my previous 2017 MBP 13".

 

[Alex W.]

Basically this is saying that 90% of laptop displays are superior then this when it comes to ghosting, trailing etc.

Apple MacBook Pro 16 2019 Laptop Review: A convincing Core i9-9880H and Radeon Pro 5500M powered multimedia laptop

Notebookcheck.com reviews the flagship model of the MacBook Pro 16, Apple's latest multimedia laptop. The machine comes with an AMD Radeon Pro 5500M GPU and an Intel Core i9-9880H CPU, along with 16 GB of DDR4-2666 RAM and a 1 TB SSD. Read on to find out why have awarded the MacBook Pro 16 top...

www.notebookcheck.net

Display Response Times
ℹ
Display response times show how fast the screen is able to change from one color to the next. Slow response times can lead to afterimages and can cause moving objects to appear blurry (ghosting). Gamers of fast-paced 3D titles should pay special attention to fast response times.

↔ Response Time 50% Grey to 80% Grey
↔ Response Time Black to White
34.9 ms ... rise ↗ and fall ↘ combined	↗ 17.8 ms rise
↘ 17.1 ms fall
The screen shows slow response rates in our tests and will be unsatisfactory for gamers. In comparison, all tested devices range from 0.8 (minimum) to 240 (maximum) ms. » 90 % of all devices are better. This means that the measured response time is worse than the average of all tested devices (24.8 ms).
52.4 ms ... rise ↗ and fall ↘ combined	↗ 23.9 ms rise
↘ 28.5 ms fall
The screen shows slow response rates in our tests and will be unsatisfactory for gamers. In comparison, all tested devices range from 0.9 (minimum) to 636 (maximum) ms. » 86 % of all devices are better. This means that the measured response time is worse than the average of all tested devices (39.4 ms).

[automerge]1589678123[/automerge]

 

[usernametakenforever]

Yeah that video the trail ghosting is clearly Apple is using a low grade 59- 60Hz 8-bit IPS panel in this laptop.

I orders a new 2020 Dell XPS 15 Thanks to a 20% work discount code and an extra 20% Dell Memorial Day special by calling in.

the new 2020 DELL XPS uses A 10-bit IPS panel touch screen 4K HDR which can Overclock to 75hz so you won’t see any ghosting or blur.

Great deal. When is you estimated delivery date?

I might buy one as well. You just ask for 20% memorial day special by calling in? I'm thinking of placing an order as well. I have a 10% CB offer on one of the AMEX card.

 

[jabbr]

Yeah, I wish Apple would put more effort into the Mac. There have been good improvements lately with the switch to an actual keyboard and improved thermals, but I always get the feeling like they barely care about their computers. Kinda odd, I imagine the developers at Apple would appreciate the best notebooks possible to do their work on.

 

[stridemat]

MOD NOTE

Less of the bickering please.

 

[enthawizeguy]

the displays are the same since 2016 and they all are 60hz, also most professional monitors are 60 hz, unless they are for gaming.
[automerge]1589705647[/automerge]
also if you move things around on ur screen in circles and back and forth fast ur gonna see stuff. it isnt gonna affect really world use

 

[emraha06]

I do not understand the people who defends this terrible display of mbp 16. Why do they ignore that this display is one of the worst displays about pixel response time and refresh rate. If i pay so much money to a device and if it is labeled as pro, so i do not want to NOTICE THE TERIBBLE TEXT SMEARING AND IMAGE GHOSTING ON A VERY SIMPLE SCROLL ACTION!!! This is my right to expect a quality display about dynamic view.

Everyone who defends this display talks about color accuracy but THIS IS NOT A PRINTER, this is a monitor which has to view dynamic changing images. Everyone knows that this is not a gaming laptop but please God sake if a pro premium device can not produce stable scrolling experience, if pixels get crazy on a basic web page scroll THERE MUST BE A PROBLEM ABOUT THIS AND PEOPLE HAVE RIGHT TO COMPLAIN.

ENDUSER EXPERIENCE and FEEDBACK is holly and if people did not complain about butterfly keyboard or physical escape key, today we would still using them.

But there is another truth... people buy these devices with their earnings. It is not easy to buy a new product every single year. I think there must be a law in silicon walley: if the a new Version product has worse options than the previous one, it should not be allowed to sell to people...

@MrGimper

 

[MrGunnyPT]

It definitely has ghosting, just see the post above mentioning the testing done on the panel.

I really hate but I can't send it back because I bought it back in November, however to mitigate this issue I have been exclusively gaming on it when connected to an external monitor.

It is what it is, next time I'll wait for reviews before buying.

 

[serge94]

I seriously don't understand people that defend this blindly either. Like what's in their heads? It's like Apple brainwashed them. The display's refresh rate is garbage, plain and simple and proven in many other threads here by users comparing the displays and doing tests.

It is outrageous to suggest to him to get a gaming laptop if he has this issue when the new XPS has a much much much better display. I actually went into a media store and compared screens, guess what? A very budget ASUS laptop had better refresh rate than the MacBooks. This is unacceptable and I will be definitely switching to Dell's for a while until Apple gets their sh*t together.

When you're doing video editing or graphic design or even web development, you can't be comfortable with a sub-par display on a PREMIUM priced product. /end rant

 

[sakagura]

the displays are the same since 2016 and they all are 60hz, also most professional monitors are 60 hz, unless they are for gaming.
[automerge]1589705647[/automerge]
also if you move things around on ur screen in circles and back and forth fast ur gonna see stuff. it isnt gonna affect really world use

'Really world use' lol

As someone who works in animation and video editing teams we need the fastest response times. The Macbook Pro since the last few years has been giving slower and slower response times. It's something like 40ms now. The bad test results are in the other related thread.

We send an animation to a client. The client checks the animation on their MacBook Pro screen. They send us an email 'Why does the animation have this blurry ghost effect? Did you add a filter?'

And we reply 'Are you using a MacBook Pro?'

And they say yes. Then we reply that their screen is **** and please use a proper screen to check.

Professional monitors and gaming monitors are down to 1ms. Even many laptop makers like Razer, Dell, MSI, etc are offering 1ms displays on laptops.

 

[emraha06]

It's a 60Hz screen. All 60Hz screens look equally blurry to me.

If you aren't happy, go get one of those gaming laptops with a 120Hz or 144Hz panel. That should be ghost-free then.

I don't know why you have to keep complaining. Apple never listens to its users on here anyways.

You are right Apple response time for solving problems is slow like pixel response time of its products

 

[DanMan619]

'Really world use' lol

As someone who works in animation and video editing teams we need the fastest response times. The Macbook Pro since the last few years has been giving slower and slower response times. It's something like 40ms now. The bad test results are in the other related thread.

We send an animation to a client. The client checks the animation on their MacBook Pro screen. They send us an email 'Why does the animation have this blurry ghost effect? Did you add a filter?'

And we reply 'Are you using a MacBook Pro?'

And they say yes. Then we reply that their screen is **** and please use a proper screen to check.

Professional monitors and gaming monitors are down to 1ms. Even many laptop makers like Razer, Dell, MSI, etc are offering 1ms displays on laptops.

I'm sorry but i'm calling BS on this. I work in video editing too and not a single client or producer i've ever sent a cut to has ever noticed ghosting/blur before. It's simply not something they look for unless they're pixel peeping and they're too busy worrying about the edit itself to notice motion blur (that or all my clients are familiar enough with the process now to know that their little Macbook Air screen is not indicative of the final product's look, that's what the final screening with a proper professional monitor is for). Not saying the ghosting/not great response time isn't a thing. But it's absolutely something only people who are looking for it, or people who actually need high refresh rate in their work notice. Non-techy clients do not notice this.

 

[sakagura]

I'm sorry but i'm calling BS on this. I work in video editing too and not a single client or producer i've ever sent a cut to has ever noticed ghosting/blur before.

So they didn't see the footage or animation you sent on the screen I complained about. You are literally saying nothing and proving that you lack the qualification to talk about this and have very poor comprehension skills.

I said 'animation'. You can't read. It's that simple. If text and moving blocks of color around on the screen is showing a ghostly trail then it's not suitable for this purpose.