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GIRL WHO BOOZED AT 12 NEEDS NEW LIVER AT 20

gwuMACaddict said:
if it was up to me, she wouldnt get one. she knew what she was doing to herself... :(
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At 12? I don't know about you, but at 12 I don't think I understood the ramifications of heavy drinking. And by the time she was binge drinking at 14, reason is no longer an issue - she had an addiction. By 17 it appears she had done the damage and had begun treatment.

Perhaps if she started drinking later in life, and as such had a better understanding of the issues at hand, I would have less sympathy. But 12? I think she goes on the same list as everyone else, and shouldn't get preferential treatment, but should get on the list nonetheless.

They also say she came from a stable family background, but I think I would know if my daughter were a serious binge drinker at 14!
 
I was not aware that cirrhosis happened that quickly, especially if you were that young (with a resilient body). I see plenty of hard drinkers in their 40's and 50's whose liver damage is probably not bad enough to need a transplant. Strange.

She should be put on the waiting list for a transplant, I do not think anyone deserves to die by virtue of their poor choices, especially when young.

It is a shame.
 
I just don't get the high rate of alcoholism in teens. I mean, when I was a teenager, I drank a lot, and frequently... but nothing compared to the heavy drinking I hear about today. I mean, we would usually show up for school sober, that sort of thing. These young alcoholics go full-blown, highly-functioning at an early age. Kind of scary.

I'm more used to this kind of imbibing with marijuana... I've known a lot of people that used excessively while a teen, and they didn't encounter any of these long-term problems. Alcoholism is pretty much a one-way ticket down, whereas pot is more of a stage (and has been for 40 years). Maybe the war on drugs is turning people to drinking... I don't know.

paul
 
gwuMACaddict said:
she had 8 YEARS (YEARS!) for someone to tell her the ramifications of drinking. trust me, she knew it wasn't healthy.
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Not really, according to the article she stopped at 17, when apparently she found out she was sick. I really can't believe that someone between 12 and 14 (when she started "binge drinking") could possibly have considered that in 3 years she would have destroyed her liver, or that anyone else would have given her that timeframe. By that measure, I should be on life-support after my college days, and I consider myself to be a fairly educated person.

In any case, she became an alcoholic early on, and I'd be willing to bet she was beyond the point of dealing reasonably with any information she may have received by the time anyone would have told her.
 
i guess we'll have to disagree on this one, but i'd hate to see her get a liver for her stupidity over someone who was born with some sort of disease that they couldnt have prevented
 
gwuMACaddict said:
i guess we'll have to disagree on this one, but i'd hate to see her get a liver for her stupidity over someone who was born with some sort of disease that they couldnt have prevented
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That I do agree with to some degree - self-inflicted problems should be lower on the list (although it doesn't generally work out that way).

The nice thing about liver transplants is that you can have a living donor. So her parents, who apparently weren't that concerned about her drinking as a teenager, could help out here.
 
emw said:
That I do agree with to some degree - self-inflicted problems should be lower on the list
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yup

emw said:
The nice thing about liver transplants is that you can have a living donor. So her parents, who apparently weren't that concerned about her drinking as a teenager, could help out here.
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excellent point
 
One of the reasons to put off drugs and roids until your body stops growing, since it's much easier to damage/unbalance a dynamic system than a relatively static system.

But, you probably won't be popular at the party or make the starting line-up in football -- and we all know how important that is. :rolleyes:
 
gwuMACaddict said:
she had 8 YEARS (YEARS!) for someone to tell her the ramifications of drinking. trust me, she knew it wasn't healthy.
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Exactly... ;)

I remember being taught about the consequences of excess heavy drinking when I was 11, binge drinking has always been a MASSIVE issue especially in schools because of how rife it is in the UK.

George Best was always used as a prime example of what drink can do to you... not only did he truly pi$$ his career away, he too needed a liver transplant, which he eventually got only to start drinking again.

If she didn't know the ramifications of heavy drinking, then she was probably too pi$$ed in class to actually take in what she was being taught.

And WTF were her parents doing whilst she was doing this?? The NHS will probably foot the bill for this, I would however bill the parents for this act of total stupidity.
 
Hopefully her example will stem the rise of binge drinking among girls. Since it has grown from 20 to 29% from 1995 to 2003. Young people seem to think that they are invincible. I truly hope that she has stopped drinking.

I never drank, but I was well known in my high school. Was also well thought of by the majority.
 
At that age I couldn't have afforded to buy enough alchool to seriously damage my liver. :/
 
i've traded in my bong and my beer mug for a players card at the casino ... costs me about the same when i loose as a night of drinking --- i win more then i loose so my vice/addiction is really not damaging anything at all ... LOL

I'm not surprised that she got sick at that age ... she maybe young and her body more resilient, but still undeveloped, the alcohol cut through that liver like a hot knife through butter.

to bad, poor kid --- i agree with a statement made earlier -- if she was from such a stable house, how did her parents not know that he was doing this at such an early age? ---

i mean i had already been drinking by 12 but my family had done a pretty good job at educating me about the ramifications -- i'm 20 now and i sure as hell don't need a new liver
 
iGAV said:
And WTF were her parents doing whilst she was doing this?? The NHS will probably foot the bill for this, I would however bill the parents for this act of total stupidity.
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you really have to wonder about this one...because it probably was through them she got her alcohol to begin with...

sad, sad, sad...

D
 
Wowee this was bound to rise conflicting opinions. To clear it up straight away, I'm totally right and the rest of you are totally wrong. Unless you agree with me :)

blackfox said:
I was not aware that cirrhosis happened that quickly, especially if you were that young (with a resilient body). I see plenty of hard drinkers in their 40's and 50's whose liver damage is probably not bad enough to need a transplant. Strange.
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Young bodies aren't resiliant at all, however they regenerate very very quickly. The liver is a prime example of a tissue which shows amazing regeneration. Unfortunately if you continually subject it to poison (alcohol), it creates chemical imbalances which inhibit it's regeneration.
Fatty Deposits > Inflammation (alcoholic hepatitis) > Permanent scarring (Cirrhosis)
At the cirrhosis stage, the structure is permanently altered. It can't function and it can't regenerate. Essentially it's defunct. As she was so much younger, the same amount of alcohol is going to have a much bigger effect on her tissues (it won't be diluted as much as there's less blood volume, it won't be metabolised as fast because the liver is smaller). However she will get drunk at a similar rate to an adult, because of something called the blood-brain barrier. Therefore an adult may have 5 units and feel tipsy after 60 minutes, whilst doing minimal damage to her liver. This girl will feel almost the same after 60 minutes, but will have done massive damage. As the alcohol enters the brain after 60 minutes, over time the adult will feel fine, but the girl will crash.

I agree that she doesn't deserve to die because of her poor choices, add to that the "level" of a 12 year olds understanding, and I would cut her a break.

For those that said she had 8 years to consider the consequences...your maths is off. But even still...please consider;

- At 12 you have a completely different perception of how the world works. You can't say "well when I was 12 I...", because it's not that simple. On top of that, you're about to undergo the biggest change in the brain (puberty) since birth.
- Once you're abusively drinking you're perception is off. How many people here have been drunk on a night out, and still bought drinks? You're already drunk, you know the only way to go is downhill, but you still buy them. How about the bouncer who when you walked in was hard as fsck, but after 10 pints doesn't seem that bad. Bet you could take him if he tried it.
- Typically you detect symptoms of damaged (from alcohol) liver when it's 75% destroyed. Sadly, at over 75% destroyed it's often it's done for good, and you need a new one.

Additionally, I'm in the UK. At our school (which is considered the best in the town) there wasn't a massive emphasis on the effects of drinking, even in Social Education lessons. If you did biology A-Level, you got a bit more knowledge. I don't think you can generalise that every UK school focuses on it as much as yours did, iGav, I'm sure there are many US schools which focus on it to a similar extent.

AppleMatt
 
emw said:
So her parents, who apparently weren't that concerned about her drinking as a teenager, could help out here.
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Well, I would imagine someone was supplying the booze? The parents perhaps? Would taking a part of their liver be any better?

I have to side with those who fail to sympathize.
 
emw said:
At 12? I don't know about you, but at 12 I don't think I understood the ramifications of heavy drinking. And by the time she was binge drinking at 14, reason is no longer an issue - she had an addiction. By 17 it appears she had done the damage and had begun treatment.

Perhaps if she started drinking later in life, and as such had a better understanding of the issues at hand, I would have less sympathy. But 12? I think she goes on the same list as everyone else, and shouldn't get preferential treatment, but should get on the list nonetheless.
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I agree 100%, although I would normally agree with gwuMACaddict and edesignuk if this person had started drinking at 17-18.

Even if someone told ME that drinking heavily was bad for me, that's what my parents would have said about half the things I did at age 12 anyway, so it's just another thing on the "naughty list". Besides, I was effing invincible.....INVINCIBLE!.....when I was 12, didn't you know that? I guess I'm the only one who understood this. Plus, there's no way this "liver" or whatever you call it was going to stop me when nothing else harms me, so :p .

Anyway, you can't say, "When I was 12, I wouldn't have done something so stupid", because there is no way you can think like a 12 year old once you get to freshman year of high school. You're so different in just a few years that it's scary.
 
gwuMACaddict said:
if it was up to me, she wouldnt get one. she knew what she was doing to herself... :(
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then let us all be thankful that it IS NOT up to you.

not to mention the fact the 90% of europeans are pure lushes, i bet she saw nothing wrong with drinking, and had no problem getting liquor in the UK. it's amazing how casual drinking is to them, after doing anything, it's time for a (PISS WARM! eww) beer. my sister is getting her masters at oxford and i've been there on many occasions, so it's not like this is some random stereotype, i've seen it first hand. to support this, try buying a coke and try buying a beer. the coke is more expensive, because demand is less, where as beer is nearly as cheap (cheaper than bottled water actually) as water there.
 
BrianKonarsMac said:
not to mention the fact the 90% of europeans are pure lushes, i bet she saw nothing wrong with drinking, and had no problem getting liquor in the UK. it's amazing how casual drinking is to them, after doing anything, it's time for a (PISS WARM! eww) beer.
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You sir/madam, are full of **** :rolleyes:

edit: you added to your post. WTF do you expect at a Uni for christ sake, it's full of students!!! And what do students do? Oh yeah, DRINK!!!!
 
He parents should donate... after all, it's partially their fault. I agree with others that she should not have any type of priority over those born with such problems.

I think people should be responsible for their actions. At some point prior to her current state, she had to have known what was going on.

I'd make her sign a legal document saying she would NEVER drink again just to get on the list. And if she did drink again, she should be forced to donate her pathetic life.
 
kingjr3 said:
I have to side with those who fail to sympathize.
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Perhaps I'm a bleeding heart, but I have to have some sympathy for a 12 year old girl whose parents either (a) fail to recognize that she has begun drinking heavily and let her continue to do so for many years, or (b) support or enable the habit.

In either case, very few, if any, 12-year olds are mentally equipped to make decisions about their health - see Abstract's comments on their invincibility.

I would not be as sympathetic of an 18 year old doing the same thing, but my thought is that this problem is probably symptomatic of another issue, whether it be family problems or whatever. And you can't say that once she was older she should have known to stop - she stopped at 17, which is still fairly young, when her liver started failing. She had been physically and likely psychologically addicted to alcohol for some time before that.
 
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