Goldman Sachs Wants to End Apple Partnership, American Express Might Take Over

[TheYayAreaLiving 🎗️]

For those that do not like American Express…

With a partnership with Amex, Apple can then expand to many more markets rather than just North America. They will rapidly expand easily into other regions. Goldman Sachs is just way too slow for a roll out.

 

[Robert.Walter]

Given that GS may have operations outside the US, it doesn't really have many that are truly active in consumer banking outside the USA.

And its foundering in the USA and looking for the exits.

AMEX is a world-wide presence. This would open up the possibility for Apple to roll out the Apple Card into overseas markets.

Goldman also has been rather crap in its Apple Card mistakes:
- not being able to accommodate a middle initial without it screwing things up.
- despite the app saying ACH transfers take 1-3 days, Goldman quoted me several times 3-5 days after the cash didn't show up in my bank checking account within the represented 1-3 day period (also apple said this).
- a move of money out to my checking account being blocked for several days, and the excuse being, (not kidding), our board expected users not to move money into and out of their accounts so fast.
- no indication that when a new bank is added for savings account it is not also added for the card account (this required two calls back.)
- not being able to accommodate overseas phone numbers (what about folks who get posted overseas?).
- not being able to designate beneficiaries using their overseas addresses and phone numbers. (so mom & pop shop!)

On the ACH withdraw to external bank thing, we saw this reduced to about 1 day after Goldman/Apple were shamed in the WSJ for poor performance. My guess is Goldman was hanging onto the cash for a couple of days to pad its marginal profit at the expense of, and misrepresentation of 1-3 vs 3-5 days to, the customer.

I'd be happy with AMEX as I've had a card with them for 30 years, but I hope it stays as a MasterCard. I don't need a 2nd AMEX card.

EDIT: p.s. If it must be an AMEX branded card, then I want more than the 2% back when I use Apple Pay (due to AMEX having fewer acceptance points, and (I want a share of the) higher transaction fees.

 

[msackey]

Customer service 101, it is extremely rare to talk to a live stateside agent nowadays.

I've had actually pretty good customer service with Apple Card reps, both through iMessage and through phone. Very professional and usually pretty quick service. When I needed to be connected to an Apple Card rep by phone, I got connected pretty quickly.

 

[zinacef]

I love my American Express card. Their customer service is top-notch. Their #1 priority is the customers and that’s why I’ve been with them for over 10+ years!

Came here to say the same thing! Their Concierge service is top notch on the Platinum.

 

[LawJolla]

I applied.

Came back with an 840 credit score.

And qualified for their mid tier rate. 🤷‍♂️

 

[psycoperl]

Goldman's CS is terrible as well, because they thought they could do it on the cheap.

Agreed. Having only chat support that is spotty just is not great.

Plus there are so many limitations on how you can pay your bill.

- The lack of a desktop client on Mac to manage account or make payments. Unable to easily get statements on a computer.

- Unable to set up multiple recurring payments

- Not able to use bill pay services from my bank to pay the account electronically. If the bank mails them a check it takes over a week for GS to post it.

- unable to name bank accounts to avoid confusion - I have two accounts at the same bank that I use to pay bills and there is no way to easily nickname it to keep track.

 

[dontwalkhand]

Whoever takes over from GS will surely worsen Apple Card terms for customers. It already started happening in Canada. Would not be surprised if they decide to discontinue it, although that would certainly a big blow for Apple PR wise.

I believe Apple Card was used mostly as a vehicle to bolster Apple Pay acceptance. Now that we are mostly there, it may be wise to dump the product. You can tell by all the pictures of the iPhone XS, that even Apple doesn’t seem to care too much about the Apple Card.

 

[KENESS]

It's in their best interests to make it geared towards an apple-centric forum, given their target audience. It may be sensational, but if it drives clicks then that's a job well done - whether we like it or not.

And I don't, hence my comment and wish they would do better.

I get what you're saying. Certainly not arguing with you. I'm just disappointed in the editorial quality of that headline and expressed as much.

Simply giving up, even little by little, on journalistic integrity for the sake of clicks or viewers or whatever is the entire reason the news and information landscape is what it is right now. A cesspool of information manipulation.

And it's just a little disappointing when a site you respect joins the fray. (I know this isn't the first time, but this one was pretty blatant.)

 

[msackey]

At what point is it a bait and switch? The GS name was heavily used to promote these new Apple services and reassure customers that they were leaving their financial affairs in the hands of a trustworthy company
AMEX definitely better be out. I made my decision for Apple Card based on it being a Mastercard that wouldn’t give me issues being accepted anywhere.

While we’re at it, my Apple Savings account APR better not go down either!!

I'm not sure I'd call it bait and switch if it's just changing the bank. But, I would consider it bait and switch if it's changing credit card network, like say from MasterCard to AMEX. As someone else already mentioned, those are not 1:1. Changing from MasterCard to Visa would be fairly much a 1:1 change to me.

I wonder if there are any good banks out there that would want Apple Card customers and that could provide the kind of customer service that I assume Apple would want Apple Card customers to have. Someone mentioned Bank of America; I think that's a bad choice! They also mentioned Citibank; I don't have experience with that. I can't think of a national bank that really has a good reputation. I guess they're all mostly crummy and devious. 😜🤪

 

[msackey]

Given that GS may have operations outside the US, it doesn't really have many that are truly active in consumer banking outside the USA.

And its foundering in the USA and looking for the exits.

AMEX is a world-wide presence. This would open up the possibility for Apple to roll out the Apple Card into overseas markets.

AMEX has a global presence but it is not accepted that widely compared to other credit card networks. Even within the US, many vendors do not take AMEX! I encounter that somewhat frequently. I don't have AMEX but my partner does. At times he whips out the AMEX hoping to accumulate travel credit only to be told by the vendor (and again, we're in the US!) that they do not accept AMEX.

I also know from my own international travel experiences that AMEX is also not as widely accepted. Visa and MasterCard both have a much more global reach.

 

[dontwalkhand]

I'm not sure I'd call it bait and switch if it's just changing the bank. But, I would consider it bait and switch if it's changing credit card network, like say from MasterCard to AMEX. As someone else already mentioned, those are not 1:1. Changing from MasterCard to Visa would be fairly much a 1:1 change to me.

I wonder if there are any good banks out there that would want Apple Card customers and that could provide the kind of customer service that I assume Apple would want Apple Card customers to have. Someone mentioned Bank of America; I think that's a bad choice! They also mentioned Citibank; I don't have experience with that. I can't think of a national bank that really has a good reputation. I guess they're all mostly crummy and devious. 😜🤪

Changing to Visa would really help me out with being able to use it at Costco.

 

[msackey]

If all goes well with American Express. Can we please get a Rose Gold Apple card?

I think if Apple Card did go with AMEX, I can't see that card using the AMEX logo (like in your representation). The current Apple Card has no Goldman Sachs logo on it; I don't think it even has Goldman Sachs text on it (I'll have to bring out my physical card which I've locked away and don't use as I only use the phone and watch).

I think Apple is pretty careful with how it brands its product. I don't see Apple wanting to share logo space with AMEX. Of course, I could be wrong, but I'm betting Apple wouldn't allow it.

UPDATE: A number of posters have pointed out that the current Apple Card has the Mastercard logo on the front and Goldman Sachs text on the back. Point well taken. I think though that the AMEX logo would not be as large as that on a regular AMEX card. It would, I imagine, be more subdued and tastefully done.

FURTHER UPDATE:
Husband brought out his card so I took a look again. Aha!! Indeed the front of the card only has the Apple logo. Ther are no other logos on it. This is not surprising and totally is Apple. The non-Apple logos appear on the backside as do the non-Apple verbiage. As I said earlier, I think Apple is super sensitive to how it shares graphical and design space with others and will likely not have an Amex image alongside the Apple logo on the card, specifically the front. The backside it’ll give in a bit.

 

[CapitalIdea]

Nobody uses Amex.

Someone didn’t qualify I suppose.

 

[xraydoc]

I'd be ok with this if Amex took over the Mastercard business from Goldman Sachs. If they switched everyone over to an Amex card, however, that I would be less enthusiastic about. I have an Amex and I'm happy with it (and their customer support is outstanding), but in the states it's not universally accepted everywhere. Mastercard, however, is accepted everywhere, making the Apple Card super convenient.

 

[DocMultimedia]

Time for Apple to get in the banking business themselves.

 

[msackey]

Citi wanted nothing to do with Apple Card once they did the math.

A Goldman Sachs rival pulled out of the Apple Card deal on fears it will be a money loser

Within the card industry, Goldman's deal with Apple is widely perceived as one that's risky for a bank card issuer to take on.

www.cnbc.com

Within the industry, the deal is widely perceived as one that’s risky for a bank to take on. Citigroup was in advanced negotiations with Apple for the card but pulled out amid doubts that it could earn an acceptable profit on the partnership, according to people with knowledge of the talks. Other banks, including J.P. Morgan Chase, Barclays and Synchrony, also bid on the business.

So overall, how is Apple Card as a business?

Do we have any reports that have studies it and make an assessment as to whether it's profitable, etc.?

 

[ckseid]

I wouldn’t be happy with this change because Mastercard is accepted everywhere, and I know I will run into Amex acceptance issues, especially with small mom and pop places like Chinese restaurants.

Small Mom and Pop Chinese restaurants take Cash only!!

 

[msackey]

I wouldn’t be happy with this change because Mastercard is accepted everywhere, and I know I will run into Amex acceptance issues, especially with small mom and pop places like Chinese restaurants.

DING DING DING DING DING!

I'm of the same mind. Both husband and I try to support local businesses as much as possible and we stay away from companies like Amazon, Walmart, etc. as much as possible. And indeed, many small mom-and-pop stores or small local artisan vendors either don't take AMEX or they say outright that while they take AMEX please use something other than AMEX.

 

[Little Endian]

I never trusted GS so I still haven’t applied for an Apple Card. Also the rewards are weak on the Apple Card. Huge fan of AMEX been using them for over 15 years. Also have an Amex savings account for over a decade as well.

No complaints with AMEX, exceptional customer service. In all my dealings with them I have always talked to someone here in the US. Nothing more off putting than dealing with someone in India, Mexico, or the Philippines being transferred over and over while repeatedly having to give your SS number.

If AMEX can make the numbers work for them I think it will be a win for everyone. I think AMEX and Apple would make a good fit as they are both perceived as premium brands.

 

[jlc1978]

I love my American Express card. Their customer service is top-notch. Their #1 priority is the customers and that’s why I’ve been with them for over 10+ years!

Same here, but for a bit longer. they even Fedex FO'd a new card to my hotel when my card got compromised and I was flying oversees the next day.

 

[adamlbiscuit]

And I don't, hence my comment and wish they would do better.

I get what you're saying. Certainly not arguing with you. I'm just disappointed in the editorial quality of that headline and expressed as much.

Simply giving up, even little by little, on journalistic integrity for the sake of clicks or viewers or whatever is the entire reason the news and information landscape is what it is right now. A cesspool of information manipulation.

And it's just a little disappointing when a site you respect joins the fray. (I know this isn't the first time, but this one was pretty blatant.)

It's ok! I'm happy with open and constructive discussion & don't take it as an argument. My suggestion: Don't take it to heart - it's just how the web works nowadays. You're aware of it and can use that to your advantage. I've noticed it myself on a wider scale - the more sensationalist, the better. I don't let it get front row in my mind anymore. Fortunately MacRumors still have integrity (IMO). The headlines are clickbaity at times sure, but their wider content (especially the podcast) still shows content worthy of respect!

 

[CARIB_APPLE]

You can get a Titanium Card from American Express. (Platinum Card)

It's another level of flex, durable, and ultra-premium.

View attachment 2226097

American Express Cards

American Express offers world-class Charge and Credit Cards, Gift Cards, Rewards, Travel, Personal Savings, Business Services, Insurance and more.

www.googleadservices.com

That’s a picture of the Centurion “Black Card” not the Platinum Card.

 

[msackey]

I'd be ok with this if Amex took over the Mastercard business from Goldman Sachs. If they switched everyone over to an Amex card, however, that I would be less enthusiastic about. I have an Amex and I'm happy with it (and their customer support is outstanding), but in the states it's not universally accepted everywhere. Mastercard, however, is accepted everywhere, making the Apple Card super convenient.

Is it even possible for AMEX to take over a credit card business and not have it use its credit card network?

Or put another way, is is possible for AMEX to actually offer a credit card that uses a Mastercard or Visa network? It would seem very contrary to their business, no?

 

[dontwalkhand]

Small Mom and Pop Chinese restaurants take Cash only!!

Not here. Mine even has Apple Pay. No Amex though.

 

[CARIB_APPLE]

For those that do not like American Express…

With a partnership with Amex, Apple can then expand to many more markets rather than just North America. They will rapidly expand easily into other regions. Goldman Sachs is just way too slow for a roll out.

I would argue the US is American Express’ biggest market. In the EU and other places they are quite small.