MP 7,1 GPU rendering on the new Mac Pro. News, updates, chat.

Hps1

macrumors regular
Apr 14, 2017
106
28
Must be very limited research

No need for the teenage salt, but yeah, that's what I was afraid of. Presuming the Duo ends up being a Titan, a better solution would likely be to wait for 2080ti equivalents and sticking four of those in.
 
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Boil

macrumors 6502a
Oct 23, 2018
679
455
No need for the teenage salt, but yeah, that's what I was afraid of. Presuming the Duo ends up being a Titan, a better solution would likely be to wait for 2080ti equivalents and sticking four of those in.

You will note I edited my post because I realized it was a bit salty.

But my sodium chloride is not teenage new salt, but finely aged half-century plus salt, you should appreciate it! ;^p

RDNA2-based GPUs are rumored to show up in Sept / Oct of 2020, so I would expect Apple to offer MPX modules with Big Navi chips either towards the end of 2020 or early 2021?

Seeing how Octane X is running on an iPhone 11, I am really excited to see how it runs on all-new APUzilla Mac Pro chips!
 
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Hps1

macrumors regular
Apr 14, 2017
106
28
Thank you for removing the salt. I should've just ignored it, it was only a healthy amount after all.

Yeah. Interesting times ahead!! After the last five years of stale air I'm really excited for the future of 3D on Mac.

Presuming all the big names also jump on ARM, that is (sidefx I'm looking at you)
 
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Boil

macrumors 6502a
Oct 23, 2018
679
455
Thank you for removing the salt. I should've just ignored it, it was only a healthy amount after all.

Yeah. Interesting times ahead!! After the last five years of stale air I'm really excited for the future of 3D on Mac.

Presuming all the big names also jump on ARM, that is (sidefx I'm looking at you)

Hoping the big names that do jump on Apple Silicon do so in a serious manner, rather than the "uggh, gotta update the Mac build again" kind of thing we are used to seeing.

What would be interesting is if Apple had their own 3D software suite! Just roll Cinema4D, Houdini, Modo, Octane X, & the Substance suite all together. Add in Unreal / Unity type game engine abilities & Apple could be a one-stop shopping for a complete DCC workflow, Indie Studio in a box!
 

Hps1

macrumors regular
Apr 14, 2017
106
28
If that happens, I will <insert something odd you wouldn't normally do here>

I think more likely/hopeful is to see a specialised Afterburner-GPU render card. 4x 2080ti + some magic supercard for additional horsepower would draw a few people back I'm sure.
 
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Boil

macrumors 6502a
Oct 23, 2018
679
455
If that happens, I will <insert something odd you wouldn't normally do here>

I think more likely/hopeful is to see a specialised Afterburner-GPU render card. 4x 2080ti + some magic supercard for additional horsepower would draw a few people back I'm sure.

Yeah, I could see Apple compute cards for rendering, which would be somewhat ironic, as the second GPU in the trashcan Mac Pro was supposed to be there for just that type of task...!
 

skippermonkey

macrumors 6502
Jun 23, 2003
393
847
Bath, UK
My hope is that Apple's fascination with AR/VR means that someone, deep inside Apple's doughnut HQ, actually needs 3D stuff and this will help drive interest and investment in high-end Macs and iMacs, GPUs, eGPUs, GPU drivers and so on. Thank heavens for the likes of OTOY and Maxon/Redshift keeping the macOS 3D dream alive.
 
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Boil

macrumors 6502a
Oct 23, 2018
679
455
My hope is that Apple's fascination with AR/VR means that someone, deep inside Apple's doughnut HQ, actually needs 3D stuff and this will help drive interest and investment in high-end Macs and iMacs, GPUs, eGPUs, GPU drivers and so on. Thank heavens for the likes of OTOY and Maxon/Redshift keeping the macOS 3D dream alive.

I was just doing a Daydream Build of an Apple Silicon Mac Pro Cube, and my peripherals were an Apple Low-Profile Mechanical Keyboard & Apple Magic Mouse 3D.

And yes, OTOY & Maxon seem very much invested in 3D on the Mac, excited to see what they do with Apple Silicon!
 

MarkC426

macrumors 65816
May 14, 2008
1,300
398
UK
No list of GPUs yet – I think there's a detailed forum post planned for this week. As far as I know, yes, Mac Pro buyers get a year's license for Octane.

@alan – a Radeon Pro Vega II Duo!? Well he's pretty sorted then!
This will probably be a years subscription........
Don't do rental, only perpetual, will keep my eyes peeled.
 
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vel0city

macrumors regular
Original poster
Dec 23, 2017
198
257
Thank heavens for the likes of OTOY and Maxon/Redshift keeping the macOS 3D dream alive.

I'm surprised how long Redshift and OTOY have continued their Mac support, considering the hardware situation. There can't be many of us still running High Sierra specifically to run GPU renderers, can there?
 

vinegarshots

macrumors 6502
Sep 24, 2018
462
421
Hoping the big names that do jump on Apple Silicon do so in a serious manner, rather than the "uggh, gotta update the Mac build again" kind of thing we are used to seeing.

What would be interesting is if Apple had their own 3D software suite! Just roll Cinema4D, Houdini, Modo, Octane X, & the Substance suite all together. Add in Unreal / Unity type game engine abilities & Apple could be a one-stop shopping for a complete DCC workflow, Indie Studio in a box!

If they were smart, they'd just fund their own branch of Blender, with OpenGL removed, Metal and Apple Silicon optimized. The bones are already there, and it's open source and fully capable. And compatible with 3rd party renderers.
 

Boil

macrumors 6502a
Oct 23, 2018
679
455
If they were smart, they'd just fund their own branch of Blender, with OpenGL removed, Metal and Apple Silicon optimized. The bones are already there, and it's open source and fully capable. And compatible with 3rd party renderers.

Apple could do that & license Octane X for the renderer, dust off Shake / Phenomenon & integrate that back in with FCP/Logic; all optimized for Apple Silicon, take over the DCC (Digital Content Creation) field like they did DTP (Desk Top Publishing) back in the day?!?

If Apple really wanted to make a play at gaming on Mac, they could license the Unity game engine & incorporate that into their DCC suite as well, with Xcode & Swift, it could make the Mac a viable platform to develop games on & for?

I dunno, just excited to see what the Apple Silicon Mac Pro line-up brings us.
 

Macintosh IIcx

macrumors 6502
Jul 3, 2014
440
421
Denmark
I'm surprised how long Redshift and OTOY have continued their Mac support, considering the hardware situation. There can't be many of us still running High Sierra specifically to run GPU renderers, can there?

Well, OTOY showing off Octane running on Metal on an Apple SoC part (iPhone is this case) might give us a clue as to why. Not sure Apple ever told them about their Apple Silicon on Mac plans, but it is an interesting turn of events. 🤔
 

Boil

macrumors 6502a
Oct 23, 2018
679
455
I would hope that all the DCC software folks (Maxon, OTOY, Foundry, Adobe, etc.) get some sort of Mac Pro Dev Kit (and an airtight NDA) sometime towards Q2 of 2022?
 

Ritsuka

macrumors 65816
Sep 3, 2006
1,176
671
It's Apple. Until they announced something they act like it never exists. Their Apple Silicon devkit has got only an integrated gpu, so everything else does not exist right now.
 

Alan Wynn

macrumors 6502a
Sep 13, 2017
958
975
It's Apple. Until they announced something they act like it never exists. Their Apple Silicon devkit has got only an integrated gpu, so everything else does not exist right now.

As long as AMD is willing to give apple source to their drivers and build a version of their card with any necessary that will run with the Apple Silicon, it seems reasonable that Apple will support it on a future Apple Silicon Mac Pro. It would be useful for future eGPU support at the very least.
 

gabrielefx

macrumors member
Feb 15, 2020
48
33
At the moment Apple hasn't the technology to build powerful gpus at the same level of Nvidia or AMD chips the gap is immense. Neither in two years Apple will be able to design a risc processor faster than the next Epyc or Xeon cpus.
It means that Apple will stuck with consumer products like Mac Book Pro/Mini/Air/iPads capable to run Logic, Final Cut, Office or Adobe suite. I don't think Autodesk, Maxxon, Blender and Blackmagic in two years will develop apps running faster (and stable) on Apple chips. Developers must demonstrate that Apple chips are superior than Xeons+multiple gpus.
There are new Intel and Xeon upgrades for the next iMacs and Mac Pros.
When the gap between Apple processors and the AMD or Intel ones will be filled then we will see new revolutionary Macintosh products but with totally different design, architecture, bus, etc. It's not two years for the Pro line, probably 10 or more.
 

vel0city

macrumors regular
Original poster
Dec 23, 2017
198
257
Octane X performance on the iPhone is apparently on par with 2x 2080ti GPUs, Octane X allows iOS devices to be used as render nodes, there's also this to consider: https://rendertoken.com/

Just to say that the future of rendering might not look the same as rendering does today as new options and services become available.
 

MarkC426

macrumors 65816
May 14, 2008
1,300
398
UK
And yet Apple keep adding more AMD GPU options for the macpro......... 🤔
Look at the size of the high end models, how do you reduce that into a mini with the same performance?

It does seem like reinventing the wheel for GPU's.
Two main players AMD and Nvidia, been around for donkeys years with all the r&d behind them.
 
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Boil

macrumors 6502a
Oct 23, 2018
679
455
Look at the size of the high end models, how do you reduce that into a mini with the same performance?

No one is saying that a fully decked out 2019 Mac "Big Chungus" Pro is going to be reduced to the size of a Mac mini with the transition to Apple Silicon. That would be ridiculous.
 
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MarkC426

macrumors 65816
May 14, 2008
1,300
398
UK
Next will be storage......no support for 3rd party drives..... 🤪

Considering Apple are always saying IPhone/IPad sales are the money makers, they seem to have a lot of funds available for all this new tech.

I'm all for change if that's the way forward...... ;), maybe it will bring prices down.

edit: I suppose as long as an Apple GPU is a supported standard then shouldn't be an issue.
 
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Boil

macrumors 6502a
Oct 23, 2018
679
455
Next will be storage......no support for 3rd party drives..... 🤪

Plenty of support for third-party drives, as long as they are external USB4 devices, or overpriced MPX RAID modules...!?!
 

Alan Wynn

macrumors 6502a
Sep 13, 2017
958
975
At the moment Apple hasn't the technology to build powerful gpus at the same level of Nvidia or AMD chips the gap is immense.

You know this how? You can say that Apple has not shipped a GPU at the same level as those shipping from AMD and/or nVidia, but unless you are violating an NDA or have broken into Apple's labs, you simply cannot say that.

Neither in two years Apple will be able to design a risc processor faster than the next Epyc or Xeon cpus.

Again I ask: Based on what do you say this? @cmaier on here was one of the designers of the several of AMDs CPUs and he seems to think you are wrong, as do many others (myself included).

It means that Apple will stuck with consumer products like Mac Book Pro/Mini/Air/iPads capable to run Logic, Final Cut, Office or Adobe suite. I don't think Autodesk, Maxxon, Blender and Blackmagic in two years will develop apps running faster (and stable) on Apple chips. Developers must demonstrate that Apple chips are superior than Xeons+multiple gpus.

Developers do not have to do anything other than make sure things are optimized and native for the new Apple Silicon based systems. Apple needs to demonstrate that their own Silicon is competitive. From what I have seen, I think they are likely to be able to do that.

There are new Intel and Xeon upgrades for the next iMacs and Mac Pros.
When the gap between Apple processors and the AMD or Intel ones will be filled then we will see new revolutionary Macintosh products but with totally different design, architecture, bus, etc. It's not two years for the Pro line, probably 10 or more.

Are you willing to go on the record with your claims/predictions?

Here are a set of questions I have been asking of people in another thread, so that we can have a clear set of metrics to judge people’s claims and the success of the product. I am gathering the answers and will post them in a new thread.

The goal is to get everyone on the record so there will be no moving of the goal posts.

  1. What set of benchmarks will you consider as the basis for comparison between the released Apple Silicon Mac systems and competitive Intel/AMD machines?
  2. When doing our comparisons between Apple Silicon-based hardware and AMD/Intel based hardware, how will you pick the AMD/Intel chip to compare? What objective metric would you use to define equivalent systems for comparison? Machines at the same price point? Machines with the same max TDP? Something else? The point of this question is that since Apple will not be selling its SoCs to others, one cannot do it purely on price of the chip, one needs some other objective metric to decide what two items should be compared.
  3. What objective criteria would Apple Silicon have to meet to be a successful product vs. Intel/AMD’s chips? (10% faster? 25%? 10% better battery life? 25%? Something else?) Once Apple starts to deliver high-end GPUs, what are your answers on those same metrics for those?
  4. When did you purchase your most recent Mac from Apple or a third party reseller that was currently shipping at the time you purchased it?
  5. What would be required for you to purchase an Apple Silicon-based system?
 
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