Grad School Issue

Discussion in 'Community Discussion' started by dukebound85, Aug 18, 2009.

  1. dukebound85 macrumors P6

    dukebound85

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    #1
    So for those that don't know. I graduated form college in Colorado in 2008 and moved to NY in 2009

    I want to pursue grad school and I do notthink I qualify for in-state tuition anywhere?

    is that correct?

    I had lived in CO for 11 years up until 6 months ago
     
  2. steve2112 macrumors 68040

    steve2112

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    #2
    In my experience, most schools require you to live in state for at least 12 months to be considered a resident or qualify for in-state tuition costs. Some may be as high as 24 months. If you are a resident in NY, you will probably need to stay another 6 months. I don't know what would happen if you went back to CO. I suspect you would have to start over. Check around, though. A lot of schools have different programs that will waive out-of-state tuition. Stuff like assistantships, research internships, etc, will often pay tuition and pay a small stipend.
     
  3. mkrishnan Moderator emeritus

    mkrishnan

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    #3
    For PhD programs also it's pro forma that graduate students get in-state tuition one way or another at many universities... I believe Michigan and Florida do this. Also frequently you are able to get actual residency at the end of your first year -- Florida changed to the pro forma system while I was there, so when I was a first year, I was asked to go through the (not very difficult) process of establishing residency. Their rules let you become a resident for tuition purposes after one year. (Michigan on the other hand -- forget it! I have a friend whose sisters live in Michigan, where they grew up with their parents, and somehow because their parents now reside out-of-country, they don't even qualify for in-state tuition. But for grad programs (at least PhD ... I don't know how this works for other kinds of graduate programs -- for PhD's it was a logical step because most tuitions were paid for by grants and fellowships and the funding sources didn't approve of being asked to pay out-of-state tuition).
     
  4. 63dot macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #4
    In these hard times, I can't see all the schools requiring a state requirement of residence for some time such as 12 months.

    When I looked at grad schools, during good times in the 90s, some of the ones that intrigued me were private and thus expensive, no matter what. California had some huge budget issues so a certain program I looked at in state was almost 20K, but 23K for out of state?!?.

    I was jealous that other states had "great" in state tuition. But that's more the poor state of California's economy and the last few Governors not putting that much importance on the University of California system.

    If I had finished my undergrad on time, and not fooled around for an extra 8 years as a musician, I could have gone to UC grad school when it was half that much for grad school (books, registration, and all other fees included) and a then effective rent control in the area.

    If it's something like Dental school or Medical school, you may make back your money, even with a high tuition in or out of state, within a reasonable time. If you become an MA or MS in some remote field, definitely chase an in-state, and hopefully substantially cheaper tuition.

    Anyway, in the spirit of these times, look for bargains. Maybe there's something decent in your state.

    Are you looking to enrich your education within engineering? There has to be something in Colorado. Heck, it's not as if you are confined to Alaska or Guam. :)
     
  5. MKSinSA macrumors regular

    MKSinSA

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    #5
    Have you considered

    doing your grad degree online? Univ. of Md has a good online program and if you need to have that face time, Phoenix does a blended online/campus curriculum. I suspect those are more economical than paying out-of-state tuition.
     
  6. hayduke macrumors 65816

    hayduke

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    #6
    You probably still qualify for in-state tuition in Colorado. If you are earning incoming in NY you can still probably swing it. What kind of program are you looking at? Many of the best science programs offer tuition coverage plus stipends if you pursue a Ph.D.
     
  7. dukebound85 thread starter macrumors P6

    dukebound85

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    #7
    True, though I am a huge fan of actual classrooms personally

    I was thinking either a Masters in ME, Law, or MBA at a school in CO. Do those same stipends apply?

    What type of proof would I need for in-state? I mean I couldn't use my parent's address could I for residency right? I have lived in NY for 6 months, granted I do have a NY license and all that jazz now
     
  8. STSNorthstar macrumors regular

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    #8
    Why not go to Duke, dukebound? hahahaha

    [says a UNC student]
     
  9. Rodimus Prime macrumors G4

    Rodimus Prime

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    #9
    That is where you are wrong. In hard times schools are going to be really picky about state requirements. During bad times they are dealing with a spike in enrollment and reduction of funds so they are going to be pickier about who can get it when it comes to instate funds.

    Generally speaking though is in hard times people are going to look to a cheaper option than going to an out of state school any how.
     
  10. MKSinSA macrumors regular

    MKSinSA

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    #10
    You might be surprised

    I have a friend (I realize this was in CA) who attended Phoenix and, not only had to attend weekly classes on campus (your closest one is in NJ, I'm afraid) but also had to conduct interim Learning Community study groups to produce work product. It's not as alienating as you might think - depending on your location.

    Otherwise, if you end up having out-of-state residency requirements, start looking around for those paid Grad/Teaching Assistant positions. You're probably too late for the Univ/College funded ones but they've all been working throughout the summer on obtaining specialized Fed grants from the stimulus that will need manning.

    Good luck and Cheers! :cool:
     
  11. hayduke macrumors 65816

    hayduke

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    #11
    The only way to know for sure is to identify a program of interest and ask them directly. You may not have given up your residency rights in CO.

    Prefessional programs (Master's programs, JD, MBA, MD, etc.) rarely offer tuition waivers and stipends. In those kinds of programs you are investing in yourself (sometimes many $100k) with the expectation that you'll have market value when you are done.

    If you apply for a Ph.D. program in engineering (for example), you will likely find a way to get many, if not all, of your costs covered, but again this is program specific. The thing you really need to do is identify what it is you want to do. You sound uncertain about what kind of degree and perhaps even uncertain about the discipline. This is not an easy decision and once made you have many years of hard work ahead for the decision to have a tangible pay-off.

    FYI - I'm a professor now and counsel student's about this stuff on a regular basis!
     
  12. 63dot macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #12
    Law and MBA, of which I have course work done in both, are nearly polar opposites. The only thing that unifies them is that you don't have to be very scientific or mathematical like a graduate school engineering student. Of course, without having to guess, getting a master's in mechanical engineering is probably very rigorous in the math department. Between engineering, law, and an mba, I can't think of three more opposite degrees.

    Good call, hayduke.
     
  13. Signal-11 macrumors 65816

    Signal-11

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    #13
    Different, yes, but opposite? There's quite a number of jobs and niches that require combinations of specialist level knowledge and education from seemingly disparate fields.

    A patent lawyer is fundamentally a lawyer with an engineering or science(s) degree. Many technical MBA programs require a technical background of their applicants. For example, the MIT Sloan Systems Design/Operations MBA is (or at least, was) more or less a program for engineers moving up into management.

    The world's your oyster if you're an engineer looking for more education, regardless of the professional field. Dukebound's question makes perfect sense and it's not at all uncommon to be looking at these three specific options. I'd say that it'd make more sense to do this after putting at least two years of engineering experience under you belt, but I'm not Dukebound.

    Some MBAs are extremely technical and require just as much, if not more mathematical and technical acumen than master's level engineering. And that's not just guys coming out of Sloan.

    As for PhDs, my attitude is that if you're in the US and you're a full time grad student who is paying tuition instead of the school paying you, you're doing it wrong. Especially in engineering. And hey, if you're not going after a masters in an engineering field where the master's is the entry level requirement, I've seen guys walk away from their doctoral programs after two years with their masters booby prize in hand perfectly content not to have to deal with the next 2-4 years. You're not $75k in the hole, school paid you to go to school to get your masters and you don't owe anybody anything. :)
     
  14. 63dot macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #14
    A law degree can be a good add on to an ME degree, same with an MBA or MS in ME. Some engineers have so much math and science in their background that even a Master's in English or some liberal art can really round out a person and greatly help their communications skills or give one a world view. I am all for grad school. But knowing what direction to go in is first a good idea before spending graduate school tuition and just searching for what hits you. That's what the first two years of college are generally for.

    I had a friend who was able to get into any MBA program after his nearly perfect grades for his BSEE. But he clearly knew that he wanted to excel as an engineer and not be a salesman or manager. He used his master's in EE to learn more about the field and went on to invent small sized flash memory at a Japanese electronics giant. He had visions like these while he was in high school.
     
  15. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

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    #15
    These are quite varied and can lead to very different futures.

    I think you should ask yourself what you actually want first. Are you going to grad school just because you're not happy with your job? If you are happy with your job, is grad school something you're considering for advancement? If it is about advancement, have you considered the direction you would prefer your advancement to be in?

    You're also asking these questions somewhat late in the game. I'm not sure about the GMAT or GRE, but I know that there is only one more LSAT administration before the general application process is opened up in the fall, and the deadline for signing up is only a few days away. Keep this in mind if you hope to begin school by next fall, as your time is already short.

    If this more about dissatisfaction with your current job, then you really should try to tackle that issue first. Jumping into another degree program isn't necessarily going to solve your troubles if your ambivalence about career options remains.
     
  16. question fear macrumors 68020

    question fear

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    #16
    I just want to second this. Duke, if I recall correctly you've only been out of school a year or two, right? I went through this phase when I was fresh out of college where I suddenly wanted to go to grad school because "OMG NO MORE SCHOOL **** **** ****" and school seemed like a great way to avoid this sudden, crushing fear of adulthood.

    For various reasons I wound up pursuing a career similar to what I had intended to get a masters in, but I wound up not getting a masters. It turned out to be good for me, I found my way without going back to school, but everyone is different. Just make sure you're stepping back and taking your time when you make decisions.
     
  17. Signal-11 macrumors 65816

    Signal-11

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    #17
    You guys need to go tell Story Musgrave that he needed more direction in life and he really should have figured things out before he chose what to do.

    To me, this is the kind of advice is just a truism that has no real value and doesn't really mean anything while still being a tautological nonsense. You feed this kind of BS to the troubled kid who needs to be pushed to finish high school, not a 20 something engineer who graduated with honors and is bored already.

    "Find a direction in life"? Screw that. Take opportunity when it comes to you and make it when it doesn't. So what if it turns out that he doesn't want to practice law after he finishes law school? What's wrong with spending three years learning the principles behind which society has built itself? MBA, good generalist degree for any endeavor.

    I know dozens of guys with MDs, JDs or PhDs who aren't practicing law, medicine or in the field they went to school for and they couldn't be happier. Macrumors? MD who'd rather be blogging.

    Among my degrees, I have one in political science as well. Pretty useless, since I usually straddle the engineering and medical fields. Or is it? Knowledge, literacy, and the ability to be conversant with anyone is the kind of thing that opens doors and in my opinion, if you're kind of person who's not afraid of taking the path less traveled then by ALL means, you should grab education before you figure out what to do with the degree. You can figure that out when you're older and slower.
     
  18. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

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    #18
    Perhaps you should keep in mind that stories like that are few and far between. There's nothing wrong with having goals or at the very least knowing what makes you happy. School is not a cure for uncertainty; it merely prolongs the point at which you must ask yourself what it is you truly enjoy doing.

    3 years can be a long time if you find you don't truly want to be a lawyer. More to the point, most graduate schools do not want a student who is simply there because they're tired of their current job. A passion or purpose is usually something most schools want to see, and law schools in particular don't like to hear that your only reason for applying was that you didn't know what else to do.

    Perhaps you have access to unlimited financial resources and time, but most of us like to carefully weigh the opportunity cost of one choice in life over another, especially when it is a choice of this magnitude.
    Note, however, that this isn't what Duke is asking. No one is suggesting the OP doesn't pursue other career interests, however his questions are very open-ended and vague, signaling that he himself doesn't know what he wants. Perhaps engineering isn't for him or maybe he has another passion, fine. That doesn't mean the default option is to enroll in grad school. That is, however, how the information has been presented to us, and hence our response.
     
  19. 63dot macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #19
    Very well said, CalBoy!
     
  20. dukebound85 thread starter macrumors P6

    dukebound85

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    #20
    Well I will say I would like to pursue so many things it's not even funny. It's not me trying to figure out what I want to do, it's just I want to do alot

    I will fully come to a decision when I cross that bridge. I just shared my potential ideas right now. Engineering was never meant to be my longterm goal, at least originally

    My original goal was to be a pilot in the AF. Before that, it was to play for the Atlanta Hawks but sadly reality set in lol. However circumstances happend such that I decided to get a mechanical engineering degree as a backup. However, in that process, I thought it would be nice to get into the law side of the issue or management side

    I will come through it believe me

    However, I was originally inquiring about in state tuition qualification anywhere lol. I think my plan is to get my colorado DL next time i visit and re register all my vehicles there as my stay is temepory in NY anyways, even with my current job
     
  21. dmr727 macrumors G3

    dmr727

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    #21
    I'm glad you didn't become a pilot. This job can *really* suck. :) :)
     
  22. dukebound85 thread starter macrumors P6

    dukebound85

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    #22
    Hey I still wouldn't mind!

    Though I will say I have a buddy who dropped out of engineering to do flight school and he has like 100K in loans and no pilot job yet

    I couldn't do that personally as i can't justify the cost
     
  23. dmr727 macrumors G3

    dmr727

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    #23
    The only way I could recommend this industry is if you couldn't imagine doing anything else. You'll spend a LOT of money to make next to nothing, and only after decades of furloughs, backstabbing, and other BS will you begin to build anything resembling a regular career. I love what I do because I love to fly, but beyond that this job is a cruel, cruel mistress.

    Yeah, I'm not a ray of sunshine. And I'm one of the successful ones. :)
     
  24. 63dot macrumors 603

    63dot

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    #24
    You sound like every successful pilot I have ever met. It's like the successful chefs/restaurant owners I have met. They may have all arrived in a different way to their financial success owning and operating a restaurant, but the one common thread is how much they have all complained about how hard it was to get there and how, if you stay long enough, it will literally kill you. The two most successful restaurant owners in town where I live worked til they died. One restaurant became the longest running one, and the other owned the most big restaurants.
     
  25. CalBoy macrumors 604

    CalBoy

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    #25
    I think then that the first thing to do is to clearly quantify what it is you would like to do.

    You may also have to make some tough decisions while doing this, because certain things are difficult to accomplish simultaneously (no matter how good you are).
    Are you currently unable to be an Air Force pilot? You aren't color blind or depend on vision-correction right? If you are perfectly capable, why not look into it if that was your original dream?

    You will also get a chance to explore the law as an AF pilot later on in your career if you choose (and with a great deal of the cost likely shouldered by Uncle Sam).

    Plus, with a BA already completed, you already outrank general crewmen. :p

    About the law though, I think you should be aware that it isn't for everyone. Talk to lawyers in your family and ask them to be blunt. Most of what you do isn't going to be glamorous or exciting, and if you don't enjoy writing, it can be rough.

    Get a practice LSAT book and try out the Logical Reasoning and Reading Comprehension sections of the test. They give you at least some idea of the logical skills you'll be using, and if you don't care for it, proceed cautiously.

    The only question I have is, "what is 'it'?" ;)
     

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