Handbrake Output File Larger Than Input

Discussion in 'Apple TV and Home Theater' started by benh911f, May 6, 2014.

  1. benh911f macrumors 6502

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    Mar 11, 2009
    #1
    I put a roughly 4.1 GB MKV file into Handbrake, selected the ATV 3 preset like I always do, while also checking the "Web Optimized" box, and the resulting file came out to about 4.3 GB. I ran the file twice, to make sure I didn't screw something up the first time, but had the same result.
    Any help would be appreciated.
     
  2. dynaflash macrumors 68020

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    Mar 27, 2003
    #2
    Very surprising presuming you used the atv preset as you say. An activity log pasted on pastebin.com and linked here should tell the tale. Otherwise no idea.
     
  3. benh911f thread starter macrumors 6502

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  4. adamneer macrumors 6502

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    #4
    this is nothing out of the ordinary. sometimes you can actually come out with files that are twice the original size. depending on the settings, handbrake may be choosing to see unnecessary bits of video as data (such as a 100% black pixel next to a 99% black pixel) and the results can be a file size much larger than the input. don't forget also that the format of compression will have a factor in determining how this data is compiled and how much data is necessary to create a suitably readable file. think of a zipped file archive - the zip will always be a smaller file size by design. but obviously unzipping it will (or should) always give you the same file that you started with, give or take a few bytes.
     
  5. dynaflash macrumors 68020

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    #5
    You aren't using the AppleTV Preset as per line 95 of your log:

    And also here starting at line 134:

    That last part should look like this for the AppleTV Preset:

    What movie is your source ?
     
  6. benh911f thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #6
    I am using the ATV 3 preset, but when I click the "Web Optimized" button, as I was instructed to do to help ATV streaming, it changes the name to custom. But it is originally the ATV 3 preset.

    It is a BD source, Season 1, Episode 1 of Mad Men. I'm not sure why it changed to look like it did in the second line you posted. Would you recommend clicking the ATV 3 preset, and not clicking Web Optimized? I just want to make sure the streaming works ok.
    Thanks again for all the help.
     
  7. benh911f thread starter macrumors 6502

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    #7
    I'm still having issues with this. Downloaded the latest version of Handbrake and it is still giving me larger files than input.
    Any insight would be greatly appreciated.
     
  8. dynaflash, Aug 3, 2014
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2014

    dynaflash macrumors 68020

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    #8
    My guess is you torrented this mkv of Mad Men. So the original source is from a blu ray but was compressed to an mkv by whoever uploaded it.

    Code:
    [19:45:01] hb_scan: path=/Users/Brendan/Downloads/MM101.mkv, title_index=1
    Besides being from a less than reputable source (cough). It probably has a lot of grain to it. Grain will balloon file size tremendously. An actual blu ray original rip would not do this for Mad Men.

    However besides being a crap source you could A: go to RF 22 on the quality slider or B. use the Denoise Filter in picture settings to remove some of the grain. Either or both will reduce the final file size.
     
  9. adamneer macrumors 6502

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    Chicago, IL
    #9
    Yeah, I tried explaining this (on a broader scale) but it doesn't sound like he's interested in knowing the reason why file size CAN increase from encoding.
     
  10. benh911f thread starter macrumors 6502

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    Mar 11, 2009
    #10


    Thanks for the responses.
    Actually, I am ripping my own personal BD. I simply had the file stored in the Downloads directory (If that is what made you think it was a torrent.)

    Here's a picture of the BD in my drive, and a picture of it in MakeMKV (So mods don't think I'm looking for help with torrented files).
    [​IMG][​IMG]

    Adam, I must have missed your original post back when I first posted this thread. Sorry about that. I will admit that obviously some of the more technical lingo I'm not that familiar with.
    However, it seems like you're saying it's normal for a larger file output, whereas Dynaflash is saying it wouldn't happen with a BD rip.
    Obviously I turning the file into an MKV file before putting through Handbrake, but I've done it with plenty of movies before and not run into the problem until recently. (Mad Men is not the only file I have been having problems with, it's been other movies as well.)
    Knowing that it is my own BD rip, does that change your advice, or would you still recommend trying RF 22 or the Denoise filter?
     
  11. adamneer macrumors 6502

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    #11
    Yes, denoise or raising the rf a little would be the first suggestion. The rf level tells the encoder what amount of contrasting pixels should be considered the same and thereby forgotten about (the basic duty of compression). I know there are a lot of dark, static scenes in Mad Men, and this is where it will make the difference in data retention. There should be plenty of dark areas in the footage that handbrake can discard, but instead, it sounds like it's choosing to retain minor changes in pixel values as necessary to the scene. Beyond that, as I've said before, you can't look at different compression types as carrying the same amount of data by how long the video is. Every codec requires a different amount of data for the computer to properly decode. Some codecs put out giant file sizes, but require very little processing power to play back. Others can be much smaller in size, but will require the computer to do a lot more work to reproduce the information. Out of curiosity, why did you bother converting your bluray import to mkv instead of just leaving it as the .ts video file that it likely was natively? I believe both mkv and .ts are mp4 wrappers, but macs play much nicer with .ts files and can even display them with quick look. Not to mention, there's no sense in encoding the bluray to an intermediate format, since this can only introduce a reduction in quality.
     
  12. dynaflash macrumors 68020

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    Mar 27, 2003
    #12
    Well, if its a true blu ray rip via mkv its the actual source blu ray. So I would raise the rf (lower the quality slider) to rf 22 or even rf 23 and try again. Realize the built in presets are general for quality. Blue Ray sources can get by with a lower quality rf than dvd. Sources vary very much. So rf 20 is a good comprimise in most situations. However I use rf 23 for my blu ray sources and find them very much visually identical to the source.

    There are some sources that are classic for grain like 300 and saving private ryan which tend to balloon file size exponentially due to the x264 encoder trying to replicate all of that grain. Its not common but some sources do cause that. Harry Potter Order Of the Phoenix is famous for that as well.

    I would (in your situation) try rf 22 and the denoise filter on weak. Denoise can be like a sledgehammer so try weak first. On strong it can remove enough grain where the picture looks like its in plasticized. Use weak. Btw, the denoise filter does its thing before each frame hits the encoder so x264 will get a less grainy frame to encode. It can make a dramatic decrease in file size.
     

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