Headless Mac Display

[Itinj24]

Probably a dumb question but I’m willing to ask it anyway. Please go easy on me lol.

Anyone know if the AVP should be able to be used as the primary display for a headless Mac Mini? I didn’t watch all the reviews but I only saw it being used as an external display for a MacBook.

 

[Night Spring]

I read somewhere that you can connect through the control panel. Can't remember where I read that, sorry.

 

[Itinj24]

I read somewhere that you can connect through the control panel. Can't remember where I read that, sorry.

It’s a start. Appreciate the reply. In the review demo, there’s a little banner that asks if you want to connect the two. Wondering if you get the same with a headless Mac Mini.

 

[Night Spring]

It’s a start. Appreciate the reply. In the review demo, there’s a little banner that asks if you want to connect the two. Wondering if you get the same with a headless Mac Mini.

I'm surprised there is no mention of how to connect to a headless mini, either in Apple's marketing materials or in any of the major reviews. That seems like a very obvious use case to me. {shrug}

 

[Itinj24]

I'm surprised there is no mention of how to connect to a headless mini, either in Apple's marketing materials or in any of the major reviews. That seems like a very obvious use case to me. {shrug}

Well, if it’s even possible lol

 

[Night Spring]

Well, if it’s even possible lol

I'd be very surprised and disappointed if it isn't! I don't plan to get a VP yet, as I don't have $3500 to spend on a first gen product, but one of the things I'd want to do with VP is to work on my Mac mini, which is sitting in the living room, from my bedroom. My Mac mini does have a monitor attached, but I'd want to be able to just connect to the mini from my bedroom, without having to walk to the living room.

 

[Itinj24]

I'd be very surprised and disappointed if it isn't! I don't plan to get a VP yet, as I don't have $3500 to spend on a first gen product, but one of the things I'd want to do with VP is to work on my Mac mini, which is sitting in the living room, from my bedroom. My Mac mini does have a monitor attached, but I'd want to be able to just connect to the mini from my bedroom, without having to walk to the living room.

Absolutely!

 

[fwmireault]

This video dates back to WWDC, but the SVP is quite clear that you can connect Mac Studio (and I assume Mac mini) with Vision Pro. Timestamp 1:15:30

 

[Rychiar]

I'd be very surprised and disappointed if it isn't! I don't plan to get a VP yet, as I don't have $3500 to spend on a first gen product, but one of the things I'd want to do with VP is to work on my Mac mini, which is sitting in the living room, from my bedroom. My Mac mini does have a monitor attached, but I'd want to be able to just connect to the mini from my bedroom, without having to walk to the living room.

Well this is a definite. The question sis will it work without a disploy attached

 

[Macalway]

Probably not right out the gate. It's IOS so there's thing like Astropad (headless mode). Sidecar doesn't have headless I don't think.

 

[klasma]

I'm surprised there is no mention of how to connect to a headless mini, either in Apple's marketing materials or in any of the major reviews. That seems like a very obvious use case to me. {shrug}

You still need keyboard and trackpad/mouse, because the Mac can’t be operated by eye-tracking and finger pinching. So it’s not exactly headless.

That being said, there are HDMI dongles that pretend there’s an actual display attached, so if all else fails that should work.

 

[4sallypat]

This video dates back to WWDC, but the SVP is quite clear that you can connect Mac Studio (and I assume Mac mini) with Vision Pro. Timestamp 1:15:30

Well this makes me feel better as I plan on using my Studio Mac M1 with my AVP.

Have the Touch ID full size wireless keyboard & Apple Mouse.

Looking forward to it tomorrow....

 

[PowerMac5500]

Deleted

 

[PowerMac5500]

Deleted

 

[jtkiley]

I've seen reviews with Apple Vision Pro with a connected keyboard and trackpad for AVP apps, and I've also seen Mac passthrough using the Mac's keyboard/trackpad (because they always demo with MBPs). But, has anyone seen whether an AVP with a connected keyboard and trackpad can be used to control a passthrough Mac?

 

[Timpetus]

I'm fairly certain there will be a way with any modern mac to connect it to AVP, it's just that Apple isn't sharing all the technical details yet because they don't want people to think the AVP is "just a wearable display" instead of its own independent device. Time will tell whether its strengths lie more in what it can do standing alone or in what it adds to an already full ecosystem. Personally, I see the latter as being more useful to me. If it's able to enhance my experience with all of my other Apple devices enough, I could see myself picking up a later version someday.

 

[Itinj24]

The only reason I ask is I wanted to start dabbling in HomeBridge and need an always on computer. If I can get a Mac Mini and use the AVP as its primary display, with a physical keyboard and mouse, then I’ll be golden. I’m not a Mac power user by any means.

 

[Itinj24]

This video dates back to WWDC, but the SVP is quite clear that you can connect Mac Studio (and I assume Mac mini) with Vision Pro. Timestamp 1:15:30

Awesome… thank you for that! I just hope there isn’t a physical limitation with the Mac Mini as opposed to the Studio.

 

[Itinj24]

You still need keyboard and trackpad/mouse, because the Mac can’t be operated by eye-tracking and finger pinching. So it’s not exactly headless.

That being said, there are HDMI dongles that pretend there’s an actual display attached, so if all else fails that should work.

Apologies for not using the proper nomenclature. When I said “headless” I meant without a physical display.

 

[mattspace]

Probably a dumb question but I’m willing to ask it anyway. Please go easy on me lol.

Anyone know if the AVP should be able to be used as the primary display for a headless Mac Mini? I didn’t watch all the reviews but I only saw it being used as an external display for a MacBook.

An Airplay AppleTV can't as far as I'm aware be the sole display for a Mac. An iPad in Sidecar mode can't be the sole display for a Mac. But, you can remote administer a headless mac via ARD... except the display has no graphics acceleration, and a limit to the resolution it can display, hence the popularity of HDMI / DP dummy dongles.

 

[mattspace]

I'm fairly certain there will be a way with any modern mac to connect it to AVP, it's just that Apple isn't sharing all the technical details yet because they don't want people to think the AVP is "just a wearable display" instead of its own independent device. Time will tell whether its strengths lie more in what it can do standing alone or in what it adds to an already full ecosystem. Personally, I see the latter as being more useful to me. If it's able to enhance my experience with all of my other Apple devices enough, I could see myself picking up a later version someday.

The AVP is a platform, and peer device, not a peripheral. I think the AVP becoming a proper "plug-in" display for another device is about as likely as the return of discreet PCI GPUs / eGPUs

 

[kreasu_]

Worst case scenario is that you’d have to use a dummy hdmi plug.

 

[AdonisSMU]

Yes you can. Forgot John Gruber asked this question.

I thought you could only use M MacBooks previously. I say try it out and see.

 

[azcoyote]

According to a video Brian Tong just posted going over the various Vision Pro settings, the Mac virtual display currently only works with Apple Silicon MacBook and MacBook Pro’s. It does not work with Mac Studio, Mac Mini, etc. That’s a bummer as I have a Mac Studio M2 I was hoping to use with my Vision Pro. Hopefully desktop Mac support gets added in an update.

 

[RamGuy]

I'm eager to see how the Apple Vision Pro works with virtual displays. This is the one feature I feel has some great potential. I'm currently using 2x 49-inch 32:9 Super Ultrawide monitors stacked vertically, and they work great, but the Apple Vision Pro should be more flexible and won't take up this massive amount of space in my office.

There are some clear downsides. I will be limited to the Apple ecosystem as there are no inputs on the Apple Vision Pro. And even though people claim the Apple Vision Pro gives you a "full 4K" virtual monitor, I'm sceptical about its quality and fidelity. There are no hardware inputs on the device, so it all has to be done wirelessly. The Apple Vision Pro and my MacBook Pro are limited to 802.11ax/WiFi-6 using 2x2. That's only a maximum of 1200 Mbps / 1.2 Gbps under ideal conditions. And this has to be shared with regular wireless usage so even at ideal 1200 Mbps the throughput will be shared with general wireless use, it's not dedicated to the video for the virtual display.

3480x2160 (4K) at 60Hz at 4:2:0 chroma at 8-bits (desktop use is normally 4:4:4) requires 8.16 Gbps. That's 6.8x times the bandwidth WiFi-6 at 2x2 streams can provide under perfect conditions. If we go 4:4:4 it requires 17.82 Gbps. And this is all 8-bit SDR, if we add 10-bit HDR we are talking 11.14 Gbps at 4:2:0 and at 4:4:4 we are talking 22.28 Gbps.

In other words, this all needs some heavy compression and transcoding to work. To avoid a noticeable lag/delay, you have to opt for fast transcoding, which tends to lead to less overall quality. I need to see this to conclude how well it works in real life. Of course, the compression will work much better for static use like spreadsheets, documents, etc. Once you start adding rendering and video, it should begin to show its limitations.

People asking for multiple virtual displays will not see them anytime soon. Since this is all bandwidth-constrained, having 2x 4K@60Hz virtual displays running over WiFi-6 is not feasible.

Of course, there is the issue of eye strain. Working for hours per day with a display wrapped this close to your face might not be good for your health. What effect will it have on your eyesight and your head? Chronic headaches and migraines have already become more frequent with today's use of digital displays throughout most of the day. I can't see how this will make it any better.