Headphone Amps / Dacs /Headphones

[AndyMacAndMic]

Have you guys heard of iFi audio? They do all manner of portable/desktop DAC/amps. This one has just come out - hip-dac - I'm still looking for a way to improve the sound from my iphone when travelling so thinking this could be the way to go. I can also hook it up to my MacBook when I'm work offsite etc.

It's starting to get some good reviews in, include one that compares it to a Topping that someone mentioned earlier (I think!)

Yes iFi audio is a British well known brand of dacs. They are in the same league (quality wise) as companies like Chord, Schiit audio, Audioquest etc. etc.).

Which sounds better? That is a matter of personal taste. Also it matters what kind of headphones you use, or if you want to use the dac also with speakers. If the usage is with low quality headphones or iem's the difference in sound quality is impossible to hear.

I don't know your usage. For portable/headphone usage the AudioQuest Cobalt DAC gets high praises as well.

 

[Silvestru Hosszu]

Cobalt is a questionable option..

Objective: AudioQuest DragonFly Cobalt Review

An objective look at the AudioQuest DragonFly Cobalt with measurements, teardowns, and a comparison to the Red and Black DragonFlys.

audiophilestyle.com

 

[AndyMacAndMic]

Cobalt is a questionable option..

Objective: AudioQuest DragonFly Cobalt Review

An objective look at the AudioQuest DragonFly Cobalt with measurements, teardowns, and a comparison to the Red and Black DragonFlys.

audiophilestyle.com

Most 'affordable' portable DACS in that price range (100-250 USD) do not measure very well. The iFi Zen DAC (the predecessor of the new 'hip Dac' and technically almost the same) does not measure well either.

More expensive DACS (> 1000 USD) start to measure really well, but those differences are really hard to hear in a portable setup (Mobile phone + moderate headphones). Those prices only make sense when listening to an expensive stereo-set with good loudspeakers.

But indeed in the review you provided a link for maybe it is better to consider the Audioquest Red. Funny enough most reviewers swear that the Cobalt sounds much better than the Red.

Measurements are important but the proof is in the listening I suppose

 

[Silvestru Hosszu]

The guy who wrote the review, Mans Rullgard, is very highly regarded on AS and not only there.
It is true, he is a strong "objectivist", which can be a capital sin in the audiophile world.
My suggestion was to consider the Red.
If we are talking about inexpensive desktop dacs, the Schiit Magni is hard to beat (and it measures well ).

 

[Queen6]

Been trawling through endless reviews and forums in search of a new DAP, and with nowhere better to post 🙂

Current DAP’s; Fiio M11 Pro, Sony ZX300...

The ZX300 remains a keeper, the M11 Pro through no fault of it’s own may go, as it simply has many features that I’ll likely never use. Have to say that I’m not a huge fan of Android based DAP’s, with or without Google. I’m also finding the M11Pro over time to be a little unsatisfying to the ear. Difficult to pinpoint, maybe the DAP is just a touch too analytical, lacking that certain organic magic that the Sony so comfortably presents.

Did consider Sony’s new ZX500, however thx to the implementation of Android & streaming services etc. The battery life is diminished compared to the older model. As I travel frequently runtime wins out any minor improvements in SQ the ZX500 offers over the ZX300.

Fiio’s new M15 is a superb DAP; big beefy & powerful, equally not best suited to low impedance IEM’s and Fiio’s first attempt at a top of the line DAP. To me the M15 has a few, (very few) niggles; highish impedance, beautifully executed wooden box, however no case??? I’d far rather forgo the “wooden box” and a good quality leather case be included, given the price and the intended usage. I love the implementation of an analogue volume dial, however why “shiny plastic”? Small things can & do irritate…

Looked at all the other usual culprits; A&K, Cayn, FiiO, Hiby, L&P and then some, equally all seem to have one or more issue/feature that puts me off. Naturally the DAP’s with the desired sound signature are also priced accordingly. That said one DAP slowly started to standout from the crowd for me...

Finally looped back to Sony with the Signature Series WM1A; ultimately I only want the DAP to play music nothing more, nothing less. Sony also has a knack of delivering excellent quality, taste and practicality with their high-end hardware. The WM1A isn't cheap by any means nor outlandishly overpriced for what it delivers. Similar to the M15 I think at these price points a case should be included and not an additional purchase.

The WM1A’s Build quality is as expected superb, typical high-end Sony, sound signature will take some time to mature, although immediately excellent out the box. Having Bluetooth is advantageous as there’s times when being wireless is useful. WiFi not so much for my needs. WM1A has tremendous runtime on battery, as I only generally listen with IEM’s way more than enough power. With the larger battery capacity I can also take further advantage of Sony’s DSP options as and when I want, without being concerned about the players battery dying prematurely.

Although the WM1A is a few years old now Sony remain to update the firmware and with care the firmware can be manually updated and geographic region switched to open up many more possibilities for the sound signature of the player. I was sorely tempted by Sony’s WM1Z, as ever it’s very much a game of diminishing returns and also want to expand my range of IEM’s.

Another DAP that I still may pickup is the Quloos QA361, very far from a mainstream device. This player only has one purpose above everything else; to present the most accurate reproduction of music as is technically possible in a portable device. Bare bones UI, absolutely no glamour only outputting music as the artist intended.

No doubt Sony will update the WM1A/Z in time, hopefully they will resist the trend of everything being online or a least remain to offer a DAP that is purely music focused as is the WM1A/Z. Undoubtedly I’m in the minority here, and in many respects at these price points the DAP/IEM/HP combination is very personal experience as they are very nuanced.

WM1A remains to be a TOTL DAP; it plays everything & anything without fuss, equally with high quality tracks & IEM the WM1A will “send you” to new places with ease. Currently listening to Poets of the Fall – Jealous Gods (FLAC 44.1/16), have to say never sounded better, you can feel the emotion only problem is that if I come across a WM1Z at a good price….

IEM’s; Dunu 3001 Pro, Campfire Andromeda (V3), Westone W40 & AKG N40. Next up hopefully Campfire Polaris (V2), Sony 1ER-Z1R & ThieAudio Voyager 14

Q-6

 

[D.T.]

Its not only the cans, amp and dac but also the synergy between those parts.

I liked this when originally posted, but in revisiting the thread (and re-reading it), I chuckled because I said almost the exact same thing just a few days ago. I actually equated it to shocks/springs/tires on a performance vehicle, and how they may individually be outstanding, but the combined results require a harmony between all those components.

Anyway, thought it was worth repeating

Vali 2 hybrid tube with a Electro Harmonix 6922 / E88CC (Balanced), in a socket saver
Modi 3 DAC. Fed via USB on an '18 Mini, or analog (direct to amp) from Teac CD-P650, Sennheiser 6XX (open), Beyerdynamic Custom Studios (closed), and I really need to review the latter, short version: 80 Ohm DT770s + modular components + adjustable base ports + detachable cable. On the desktop, I run a pair of near field R1280 power speakers, they get a touch of tube-a-fication

FWIW, I've changed my primary source from the '18MM to our 3rd Gen iPadPro, pretty cool.


I'd also say, there's a touch of aesthetic consideration for me - since I have this right on my desk, I wanted a small footprint, and I wanted components that would be easy to stack in the same place, one reason I shopped both Schiit and Topping.

 

[Silvestru Hosszu]

Been trawling through endless reviews and forums in search of a new DAP, and with nowhere better to post 🙂

Current DAP’s; Fiio M11 Pro, Sony ZX300...

The ZX300 remains a keeper, the M11 Pro through no fault of it’s own may go, as it simply has many features that I’ll likely never use. Have to say that I’m not a huge fan of Android based DAP’s, with or without Google. I’m also finding the M11Pro over time to be a little unsatisfying to the ear. Difficult to pinpoint, maybe the DAP is just a touch too analytical, lacking that certain organic magic that the Sony so comfortably presents.

Did consider Sony’s new ZX500, however thx to the implementation of Android & streaming services etc. The battery life is diminished compared to the older model. As I travel frequently runtime wins out any minor improvements in SQ the ZX500 offers over the ZX300.

Fiio’s new M15 is a superb DAP; big beefy & powerful, equally not best suited to low impedance IEM’s and Fiio’s first attempt at a top of the line DAP. To me the M15 has a few, (very few) niggles; highish impedance, beautifully executed wooden box, however no case??? I’d far rather forgo the “wooden box” and a good quality leather case be included, given the price and the intended usage. I love the implementation of an analogue volume dial, however why “shiny plastic”? Small things can & do irritate…

Looked at all the other usual culprits; A&K, Cayn, FiiO, Hiby, L&P and then some, equally all seem to have one or more issue/feature that puts me off. Naturally the DAP’s with the desired sound signature are also priced accordingly. That said one DAP slowly started to standout from the crowd for me...

Finally looped back to Sony with the Signature Series WM1A; ultimately I only want the DAP to play music nothing more, nothing less. Sony also has a knack of delivering excellent quality, taste and practicality with their high-end hardware. The WM1A isn't cheap by any means nor outlandishly overpriced for what it delivers. Similar to the M15 I think at these price points a case should be included and not an additional purchase.

The WM1A’s Build quality is as expected superb, typical high-end Sony, sound signature will take some time to mature, although immediately excellent out the box. Having Bluetooth is advantageous as there’s times when being wireless is useful. WiFi not so much for my needs. WM1A has tremendous runtime on battery, as I only generally listen with IEM’s way more than enough power. With the larger battery capacity I can also take further advantage of Sony’s DSP options as and when I want, without being concerned about the players battery dying prematurely.

Although the WM1A is a few years old now Sony remain to update the firmware and with care the firmware can be manually updated with official and custom firmware, and geographic region switched to open up many more possibilities for the sound signature of the player. I was sorely tempted by Sony’s WM1Z, as ever it’s very much a game of diminishing returns and also want to expand my range of IEM’s.

Another DAP that I still may pickup is the Quloos QA361, very far from a mainstream device. This player only has one purpose above everything else; to present the most accurate reproduction of music as is technically possible in a portable device. Bare bones UI, absolutely no glamour only outputting music as the artist intended.

No doubt Sony will update the WM1A/Z in time, hopefully they will resist the trend of everything being online or a least remain to offer a DAP that is purely music focused as is the WM1A/Z. Undoubtedly I’m in the minority here, and in many respects at these price points the DAP/IEM/HP combination is very personal experience as they are very nuanced.

WM1A remains to be a TOTL DAP; it plays everything & anything without fuss, equally with high quality tracks & IEM the WM1A will “send you” to new places with ease. Currently listening to Poets of the Fall – Jealous Gods (FLAC 44.1/16), have to say never sounded better, you can feel the emotion only problem is that if I come across a WM1Z at a good price….

IEM’s; Dunu 3001 Pro, Campfire Andromeda (V3), Westone W40 & AKG N40. Next up hopefully Campfire Polaris (V2), Sony 1ER-Z1R & ThieAudio Voyager 14

Q-6

I very seriously considered the WM1A myself. I auditioned it and one of my cans are Sony MDR-Z7 MkII which do sound nice together with the WM1A.
What stopped me is the lack of streaming. I do have a decent hi rez collection but I do streaming very often so I will look for something else. To be honest I`m not in a hurry, my old Fiio X7 Mk II still serves me well.

 

[S.B.G]

@Queen6 Nice write up on the DAP exploration. Your thoughts on the Fiio, mimick those of Zeos a bit. I recall a few of his Fiio reviews, which he liked quite a bit and mentioned some of the same cons as well.

Have you considered any of the Pioneer DAP's?

I have a Pioneer XDP 300R (black). I quite like it. The only cons I have with it is there is no case of any kind to be found for my model. The one that they did make for didn't have very good reviews because it covered the SD card ports. You had to take it out of the case to get to them. That would be a problem for me since I frequently remove the SD card to add new music to it. The other con is that I feel it is mildly underpowered. Though that can be corrected with a portable amp, as some Fiio makes.

Some of the pros I like about the Pioneer is that it is Japanese made. It even shipped directly from Pioneer in Japan. It has two SD card ports, balanced 2.5 mm and unbalanced 3.5 mm jacks and decent battery life. I extend the battery by keeping it in airplane mode all the time. It also has two DACs and two amps and the sound is very nice.

Something to think about and consider if you're still looking around for a DAP.

High-Res Audio

www.pioneerelectronics.com

 

[Queen6]

I very seriously considered the WM1A myself. I auditioned it and one of my cans are Sony MDR-Z7 MkII which do sound nice together with the WM1A.
What stopped me is the lack of streaming. I do have a decent hi rez collection but I do streaming very often so I will look for something else. To be honest I`m not in a hurry, my old Fiio X7 Mk II still serves me well.

@Queen6 Nice write up on the DAP exploration. Your thoughts on the Fiio, mimick those of Zeos a bit. I recall a few of his Fiio reviews, which he liked quite a bit and mentioned some of the same cons as well.

Have you considered any of the Pioneer DAP's?

I have a Pioneer XDP 300R (black). I quite like it. The only cons I have with it is there is no case of any kind to be found for my model. The one that they did make for didn't have very good reviews because it covered the SD card ports. You had to take it out of the case to get to them. That would be a problem for me since I frequently remove the SD card to add new music to it. The other con is that I feel it is mildly underpowered. Though that can be corrected with a portable amp, as some Fiio makes.

Some of the pros I like about the Pioneer is that it is Japanese made. It even shipped directly from Pioneer in Japan. It has two SD card ports, balanced 2.5 mm and unbalanced 3.5 mm jacks and decent battery life. I extend the battery by keeping it in airplane mode all the time. It also has two DACs and two amps and the sound is very nice.

Something to think about and consider if you're still looking around for a DAP.

High-Res Audio

www.pioneerelectronics.com

I do stream music and find it excellent for music discovery, although overall I prefer that the albums are loaded on the DAP. I tend to travel a lot internationally as a factor of my profession. The price of microSD cards are ever dropping, so travelling with a decent sized library is easily enough achieved. The new Sony ZX500 is Android based, I did consider as the smaller capacity ZX505 (16Gb, ZX507 being 64Gb) is significantly cheaper than the WM1A. SQ wise I feel the ZX500 is a little too close to my ZX300, I also wanted to step up, not that pricing always equates to better SQ.

The M11 Pro is definitely a step up on the M11, sharing the same overall sound signature. I don't entirely agree with all Zeos says. Personally if already owning an M11 the Pro isn't a big leap in terms of what you'll get for your money. If looking for an M11 the Pro is the better DAP sonically for purely SQ, as it does present a near black background, with improvements in SQ being discernible.

Absolutely subjective; the M11 Pro executes perfectly, more so now FiiO have released a patch to allow Google Apps etc. What I feel or more to the point, I don't feel is engagement, best I can describe is that when listening, sonically the M11 Pro comes across as a Digital Audio Player. The WM1A comes across as a vehicle to present high quality music to the listener. To me WM1A delivers that factor at a very high level, the Sony is simply far more engaging & organic, in todays very much digital age.

Sony DAP's have their own unique flavour, as Sony literally designs & produces it's own DAC/AMP chips and more. A big factor for the WM1A is the ability for the user to be able to tune the DAP to one's individual listening taste, which few others can. Admittedly this takes a little technical knowledge, however the benefits are tangible.

Sony's WM1Z, I'm unsure of as although Sony's current premier DAP, it's also warmer than WM1A. Admittedly I would want time to listen to the WM1Z in detail and consider the benefits if any (for my use). There is also the factor of the WM1Z's cost as undoubtedly Sony has a replacement in the works, equally Sony has had a good period of time to polish the tuning of both WM1A/Z...

Pioneer I've not looked at in any depth I'm aware of the brand, however little chance to audition.

Why DAP's & IEM's? As an expat travel is simply a factor of life, residential or rotational, although I did have a semi decent home system and still retain, it's now old, nor do the current room acoustics allow it to stretch it's legs. Modern DAP's & IEM's allow me to enjoy music regardless of my physical location. If I was to go back to a home focused setup, I'd likely opt for a far simpler purely stereo setup with high quality active speakers. I was very much considering, however started looking at modern DAP's and instantly saw the advantage as ultimately I can still pickup the speakers at a later date...

DAP's
Sony WM1A & ZX300 set to Japan region (J) stock 3.02 firmware, FiiO M11 Pro

IEM's
Campfire Andromeda, Dunu 3001 Pro, Westone W40 & AKG N40

Q-6

 

[cbautis2]

I do stream music and find it excellent for music discovery, although overall I prefer that the albums are loaded on the DAP. I tend to travel a lot internationally as a factor of my profession. The price of microSD cards are ever dropping, so travelling with a decent sized library is easily enough achieved. The new Sony ZX500 is Android based, I did consider as the smaller capacity ZX505 (16Gb, ZX507 being 64Gb) is significantly cheaper than the WM1A. SQ wise I feel the ZX500 is a little too close to my ZX300, I also wanted to step up, not that pricing always equates to better SQ.

The M11 Pro is definitely a step up on the M11, sharing the same overall sound signature. I don't entirely agree with all Zeos says. Personally if already owning an M11 the Pro isn't a big leap in terms of what you'll get for your money. If looking for an M11 the Pro is the better DAP sonically for purely SQ, as it does present a near black background, with improvements in SQ being discernible.

Absolutely subjective; the M11 Pro executes perfectly, more so now FiiO have released a patch to allow Google Apps etc. What I feel or more to the point, I don't feel is engagement, best I can describe is that when listening, sonically the M11 Pro comes across as a Digital Audio Player. The WM1A comes across as a vehicle to present high quality music to the listener. To me WM1A delivers that factor at a very high level, the Sony is simply far more engaging & organic, in todays very much digital age.

Sony DAP's have their own unique flavour, as Sony literally designs & produces it's own DAC/AMP chips and more. A big factor for the WM1A is the ability for the user to be able to tune the DAP to one's individual listening taste, which few others can. Admittedly this takes a little technical knowledge, however the benefits are tangible. Recently flipping my CN region to J for a richer more accurate sound signature, presenting the best; timbre, soundstage & control of bass/sub bass, impressively so. Custom firmware is also now available, so one can now literally tune the DAP to a specific IEM/HP setup with ease thx to a tremendous active community.

Sony's WM1Z, I'm unsure of as although Sony's current premier DAP, it's also warmer than WM1A. Admittedly I would want time to listen to the WM1Z in detail and consider the benefits if any (for my use). There is also the factor of the WM1Z's cost as undoubtedly Sony has a replacement in the works, equally Sony has had a good period of time to polish the tuning of both WM1A/Z...

Pioneer I've not looked at in any depth I'm aware of the brand, however little chance to audition.

Why DAP's & IEM's? As an expat travel is simply a factor of life, residential or rotational, although I did have a semi decent home system and still retain, it's now old, nor do the current room acoustics allow it to stretch it's legs. Modern DAP's & IEM's allow me to enjoy music regardless of my physical location. If I was to go back to a home focused setup, I'd likely opt for a far simpler purely stereo setup with high quality active speakers. I was very much considering, however started looking at modern DAP's and instantly saw the advantage as ultimately I can still pickup the speakers at a later date...

DAP's
WM1A & ZX300 set to Japan region (J) stock 3.02 firmware, FiiO M11 Pro

IEM's
Campfire Andromeda, Dunu 3001 Pro, Westone W40 & AKG N40

Q-6

We have the same earphones (Campfire Andromeda). I use it with the iPod Touch 7th gen and it sounds great!

 

[Queen6]

We have the same earphones (Campfire Andromeda). I use it with the iPod Touch 7th gen and it sounds great!

Andromeda are a solid choice for IEM's mine are the V3 Green. I'd like to try Campfire's Solaris, although they may have fit issues. Sony's own IER-Z1R are also a consideration as they should match well with the WM1A.

Q-6

 

[cbautis2]

Andromeda are a solid choice for IEM's mine are the V3 Green. I'd like to try Campfire's Solaris, although they may have fit issues. Sony's own IER-Z1R are also a consideration as they should match well with the WM1A.

Q-6

I also have fit issues with Solaris since my tragus aren't large enough for Solaris's bore. I've heard the IER-Z1R a few months ago. They're good complement to warmer sounding Andromedas. Bass is incredibly deep and full-bodied while Andromeda has more noticeable "undertones" to the bass. They fit my ears much better than the Solaris but can cause tragus fatigue after a few hours due to the heavy shell especially compared to Andromeda. Sadly, the Z1R sounds strident when driven by the iPod Touch 7G due to lack of power and it should definitely benefit from WM1A 4.4 mm balanced jack

 

[Queen6]

I also have fit issues with Solaris since my tragus aren't large enough for Solaris's bore. I've heard the IER-Z1R a few months ago. They're good complement to warmer sounding Andromedas. Bass is incredibly deep and full-bodied while Andromeda has more noticeable "undertones" to the bass. They fit my ears much better than the Solaris but can cause tragus fatigue after a few hours due to the heavy shell especially compared to Andromeda. Sadly, the Z1R sounds strident when driven by the iPod Touch 7G due to lack of power and it should definitely benefit from WM1A 4.4 mm balanced jack

I'd really like to try the Z1R as all being equal they should be a good match with the WM1A. To me the balance of the fit and SQ is key to good IEM's. My most comfortable IEM is Westone's W40, although not the same class as Andromeda, Solaris, Z1R etc.

I picked up a set of Dunu 3001 Pro, not top of the line IEM's, however definitely one of the better in class and Dunu's ingenious cable solution allows one to effortlessly switch between 4.4/2.5 balanced and 3.5 single ended, without excessively wearing the MMCX connections. The fit for me with the 3001 Pro is also good. Not really set on next IEM, may leave it to luck and see what I come across and like.

Q-6