Hermés Apple Watch is specially engraved

[Mac 128]

A clock face, brushed metal accents, and numbers is not a distinct design.

Distinct, iconic designs are one like the moon watch, Submariner, GMT, Tank, Reverso, Royal Oak, Nautilus, Panerai, etc. Those are very different from one another, from the watch case shapes to the fonts to the textures to the lugs.

And yes, many companies copy those designs, which are usually called homages (not illegal but generally frowned upon). But if they also put the original brand's logo on it, it's a counterfeit and that's enforceable by law.



But the watch face design *is* Heremes'... the fonts, the placement of the numerals, the logo itself. They're in the design of the Cape Cod, Clipper, and Espace. These are not Apple's designs. Same goes for the bands as many others have pointed out. The rest of the watch, including the lugs, general shape, and obviously everything else software-wise, is Apple's.

It's a fusion of designs, is perhaps the best way to describe it. Arguing that it's soley Apple's or solely Hermes' design doesn't make much sense.

You keep dancing around your own issue -- show me the watch face Huawei has illegally copied from a famous maker luxury watch company, and this debate may end. Until then, your arguments are moot.

Split hairs all you want. Hermes, has their name etched on the watch case itself, which by your own admission Hermes had nothing to do with. It makes about as much sense as this:

 

[Mac 128]

I see the AW Hermes not as imitation but a reinterpretation of those traditional designs for the digital age since Apple and Hermes partnered on it. Hermes can't imitate itself.



Not sure why you're so bothered by this. Apple wants to get into the luxury game, so this is the way they're approaching the game. As someone else pointed out, Rolex used the same approach with Tiffany back in the 50s and 60s, and it worked for them.

Why does it bother you so?

It's a digital interpretation to expressly imitate a mechanical luxury fashion watch, for the purpose of selling the  Watch to luxury fashion watch customers. Split hairs if you must, but don't pretend it's somehow better than what Huawei and others are doing. And don't pretend Apple isn't pursuing the luxury watch market, or won't make purely aesthetic compromises to gain acceptance into the fashion world, when the evidence is quickly mounting up. That's my problem, though not necessarily with you. Apple has already given away top billing to Hermes with the watch face, and taken a backseat with the rest of it, even allowing Hermes to brand the watch case itself. Did you ever think you would see the day where Apple would co-brand a product with anybody else? The closest thing I can think of here is Sony's design of the PowerBook 100. Can you imagine if Apple had put Sonys name anywhere on that product?

I think it's great Apple is doing this, and have predicted it since the beginning. In fact this solidifies the proof that Apple is willing to make significant compromises in order to ingratiate themselves into the fashion world. Seasonal bands, interpretative imitations of classic watch faces, and round watches and other fashion design concessions, all clearly part of a product that marks a turning point in Apple's marketing and design philosophy. But don't pretend it's not.

 

[zetaplus93]

You keep dancing around your own issue -- show me the watch face Huawei has illegally copied from a famous maker luxury watch company, and this debate may end. Until then, your arguments are moot.

http://techcrunch.com/2015/09/02/the-weirdness-of-the-huawei-watch/#.yyg2ft:ZSxC

 

[BigGuy219]

You keep dancing around your own issue -- show me the watch face Huawei has illegally copied from a famous maker luxury watch company, and this debate may end. Until then, your arguments are moot.

Split hairs all you want. Hermes, has their name etched on the watch case itself, which by your own admission Hermes had nothing to do with. It makes about as much sense as this:

I bet you would hate the U2 branded iPod I picked up back in college. I didn't get an iPod until the U2 version came out, because I liked the color and the different design.

There are people who were not in the market for the Apple Watch that suddenly are interested because of this partnership. Particularly young women with loose purse strings.

 

[Mac 128]

http://techcrunch.com/2015/09/02/the-weirdness-of-the-huawei-watch/#.yyg2ft:ZSxC

So, no proof then?

 

[zetaplus93]

So, no proof then?

The article clearly shows the homage watch faces on the Huawei Watch, and the original designs.

 

[Mac 128]

I bet you would hate the U2 branded iPod I picked up back in college. I didn't get an iPod until the U2 version came out, because I liked the color and the different design.

There are people who were not in the market for the Apple Watch that suddenly are interested because of this partnership. Particularly young women with loose purse strings.

Again, I'm all for Apple doing this. I do think it marks a radical departure from previous practice, for better or worse, but let's not pretend it's something better, or other, than it is.

I had no problems with the U2 iPod. But that's actually a completely different thing then the Hermes Watch. For starters, U2 picked those colors. They designed the skin that went on the iPod. Secondly, the U2 branding is secondary to the Apple branding, and certainly no more prominent. And lastly it's not masquerading as something it's not.

EDIT: Here's a fun read --

http://www.fastcocreate.com/3032443...-inside-look-at-the-success-and-future-of-red

 

[Mac 128]

The article clearly shows the homage watch faces on the Huawei Watch, and the original designs.

But it doesn't show copyright infringement or theft as you allege.

Case in point: your article equates these two watch faces, when the two could not be more dissimilar:

 

[zetaplus93]

But it doesn't show copyright infringement or theft as you allege.

As I have repeatedly stated earlier, it's not illegal (fact), but distasteful (my opinion).

It's very similar to the Chinese copycat designs from the car shows. Not illegal to copy Land Rover (or at least not enforceable in China), but everyone knows what the original design is.

 

[zetaplus93]

And don't pretend Apple isn't pursuing the luxury watch market, or won't make purely aesthetic compromises to gain acceptance into the fashion world, when the evidence is quickly mounting up.

Yup, Apple is pursuing the luxury market. Is that a problem?

I don't think Apple's comprising anything. But indeed they are changing the aesthetics with the Hermes partnership to deliver a more compelling product for the fashion conscious buyers. Again, is this a bad thing?

Did you ever think you would see the day where Apple would co-brand a product with anybody else? The closest thing I can think of here is Sony's design of the PowerBook 100. Can you imagine if Apple had put Sonys name anywhere on that product?

I was quite surprised, but not bothered. It'll be interesting to see where they go with this.

I think it's great Apple is doing this, and have predicted it since the beginning. In fact this solidifies the proof that Apple is willing to make significant compromises in order to ingratiate themselves into the fashion world. Seasonal bands, interpretative imitations of classic watch faces, and round watches and other fashion design concessions, all clearly part of a product that marks a turning point in Apple's marketing and design philosophy. But don't pretend it's not.

I think this is the way to go with wearables. It's a fashion product, so it makes sense to churn out products and accessories in this fashion.

I don't see this as a compromise, but rather being smart. Otherwise Apple will forever be just a tech company.

 

[BigGuy219]

Again, I'm all for Apple doing this. I do think it marks a radical departure from previous practice, for better or worse, but let's not pretend it's something better, or other, than it is.

I had no problems with the U2 iPod. But that's actually a completely different thing then the Hermes Watch. For starters, U2 picked those colors. They designed the skin that went on the iPod. Secondly, the U2 branding is secondary to the Apple branding, and certainly no more prominent. And lastly it's not masquerading as something it's not.

Mac, that response just shows how little you know about designer watches. Companies such as Rolex and Omega started out by making excellent, world renowned movements, and eventually their watches evolved into designer/luxury items that conveyed status. But that is not the case from the watches made by Hermès and other fashion houses.

You have posted that picture of a Hermès Cape Cod in numerous threads on MacRumors. All Hermès made on that watch was the leather in the band. The movement is a cheap quartz movement imported from Switzerland, and the case and face were outsourced and machined to Hermès specifications. If you went to a Hermès production facility all you would see were leather makers - some of the finest in the world.

On the Apple Watch Hermès they designed and manufacture the leather bands, which is their specialty. It says Apple designed the face - but really they digitized pre-existing Hermès faces using Hermès exclusive fonts and even Hermès signature orange for the second hand.

So there is as much Hermès in the Apple Watch as there is in the Cape Cod pictured above.

Instead of it saying Hermès Paris on the Cape Cod would you rather it say the name of the Swiss company that manufactured the cheap quartz movement on the inside?

 

[Mac 128]

Instead of it saying Hermès Paris on the Cape Cod would you rather it say the name of the Swiss company that manufactured the cheap quartz movement on the inside?

Well I appreciate that diatribe, but the fact is Hermes owns and manufactures their own watches, movements and faces. Starting in 1978 they outsourced their designs, but beginning in 2012 they began making their own.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/23/fashion/hermes-invests-to-join-watch-industrys-elite.html

But I go back to the primary issue: If you remove the Hermes band from the Watch|Hermes, the watch case continues to say Hermes even though Hermes had absolutely nothing to do with it. Apple is co-branding a product they designed, to accommodate a brand whose only contribution was a leather band designed and made for another watch Hermes designed and manufactured, attached to Apple's lugs. Oh and their name.

Again, I'm thrilled for Apple doing this. But this kind of co-branding marks a radical departure from anything they've previously done.

http://howtospendit.ft.com/gadgets/91013-hermes-new-apple-watch

 

[Mac 128]

It's very similar to the Chinese copycat designs from the car shows. Not illegal to copy Land Rover (or at least not enforceable in China), but everyone knows what the original design is.

You keep saying this despite me showing you direct examples from the article you posted showing this is not the case. Amazing.

 

[BigGuy219]

Well I appreciate that diatribe, but the fact is Hermes owns and manufactures their own watches, movements and faces. Starting in 1978 they outsourced their designs, but beginning in 2012 they began making their own.

But I go back to the primary issue: If you remove the Hermes band from the Watch|Hermes, the watch case continues to say Hermes even though Hermes had absolutely nothing to do with it. Apple is co-branding a product they designed, to accommodate a brand whose only contribution was a leather band designed and made for another watch they designed and manufactured, attached Apple's lugs. Oh and their name.

Again, I'm thrilled for Apple doing this. But this kind of co-branding marks a radical departure from anything they've previously done.

The watch case says Hermès on the underside of the case pressed against the wrist, and likely only the owner will ever see that engraving. Unless some nouveau riche clown rubs it in someone's face. If you change the watch face to something like the Chrono or Mickey the Hermès branding does go away. But the face that does say Hermès is clearly their design - all Apple did was digitize it.

If I photograph the Mona Lisa and tinker around in Photoshop to make it appear more true to life and counter the changes made by the photographic process - did I design the Mona Lisa or did da Vinci?

When it has the Hermès face and the Hermès band it is clearly a Hermès watch, with an Apple case and 'movement'. But the case and the 'movement' take a backseat to the band and the face in this regard.

The people they're targeting with this watch would not be interested if it did not say Hermès on it.

When the iPod came out it fit a need. People could only listen to one cassette or CD at a time (remember those?) and when working out or jogging you weren't about to carry around other discs. Overnight it changed the way we listen to music.

When the iPhone came out it fit a need. Not only could people make calls anywhere on the go, they could now easily access E-mail and other key apps. It was a basic computer in the palm of your hand.

The Apple Watch fits no need. Sure, some people might find the health stuff important, but half of American adults now either have diabetes or pre-diabetes. We are an obese, lazy nation. Calculate what percentage of Americans work out regularly, then calculate which of them would be interested in a fitness app, then calculate which of them have an iPhone, and then calculate which of them have the disposable income for an Apple Watch. This is the smallest demographic Apple as a company ever targeted.

So they quickly and smartly realized that if they want to expand the Apple Watch they have to appeal to the traditional watch customer. Shallow, materialistic, and big on branding.

Simply put I do not like leather bands, but I do like Hermès leather bands. If there was not a large Hermès logo front and center on the face of this watch I would not by it, but because there is I will be getting on a plane and ensuring I have one in hand the morning of October 5.

 

[Mac 128]

But the face that does say Hermès is clearly their design - all Apple did was digitize it.

Technically, they are using Hermes font, and arranging it to create a brand new layout. This is still Apple's creative eye at work, not Hermes, all Hermes did was approve it. And this is clearly why Apple makes a big deal about stating they did the work on their website. All Apple did with the Watch was adapt rounded-rectangles into a product. But they still did the work.

When it has the Hermès face and the Hermès band it is clearly a Hermès watch, with an Apple case and 'movement'. But the case and the 'movement' take a backseat to the band and the face in this regard.

So they quickly and smartly realized that if they want to expand the Apple Watch they have to appeal to the traditional watch customer. Shallow, materialistic, and big on branding.

And these two paragraphs cut to the heart of what I'm saying -- this is a fundemental shift in how Apple has traditionally marketed products, for better or worse. When has Apple ever taken a backseat to anyone else? And just because Apple is doing it with a respected fashion house, does not make it any better than what any other company is doing in the same vein.

You and I are essentially on the same page here. My beef is with those who were quick to criticize other smart watch makers for going after the same crowd, but now that Apple is doing exactly the same thing, it's completely different. Hypocrisy at its finest.

 

[BigGuy219]

Technically, they are using Hermes font, and arranging it to create a brand new layout. This is still Apple's creative eye at work, not Hermes, all Hermes did was approve it. And this is clearly why Apple makes a big deal about stating they did the work on their website. All Apple did with the Watch was adapt rounded-rectangles into a product. But they still did the work.



And these two paragraphs cut to the heart of what I'm saying -- this is a fundemental shift in how Apple has traditionally marketed products, for better or worse. When has Apple ever taken a backseat to anyone else? And just because Apple is doing it with a respected fashion house, does not make it any better than what any other company is doing in the same vein.

You and I are essentially on the same page here. My beef is with those who were quick to criticize other smart watch makers for going after the same crowd, but now that Apple is doing exactly the same thing, it's completely different. Hypocrisy at its finest.

What Apple did was so minimal I'm hesitant to give them any credit at all. I see nothing Apple on the exclusive Apple Watch Hermès that screams Apple to me. In fact, when placed side-by-side next to a Cape Cod I find it hard to tell the difference at all. All Apple did was recreate a classic Hermès design in a digital format, which Hermès then signed off on. In this case it was as if Apple were a sub-contractor working for Hermès on a digital format of their traditional watch face.

I give all the credit to Hermès with an assist from Apple.

As to your second point, I think the difference between what Apple is doing and the others are doing is in the quality of the materials used. If a Hermès watch face was available in OS2 for an existing watch - either free or with a premium price - without the Hermès band I would be disgusted and rolling my eyes to no end.

But what these other companies have done is created a homage to other company's watch faces with no regard for the case or the band. If a company made a Rolex face and the band was 18K gold then we could talk, but when you emulate a $10,000 watch face and pair it with a $50 band ... well then you probably shop in Chinatown instead of Madison Avenue.

It's the total package here with Apple Watch Hermès. The quality of the leather, the quality of the manufacturing process, the pedigree of Hermès, the digitizing of a classic and recognizable face - even the authentic signature orange Hermès box. There's an attention to detail here that doesn't exist elsewhere.

I almost wish that on that on the Apple Watch Hermès it would NOT be possible to change to a non-Hermès face or a non-Hermès band.

 

[zetaplus93]

But it doesn't show copyright infringement or theft as you allege.

Case in point: your article equates these two watch faces, when the two could not be more dissimilar:

Breguet:

Huawei:

 

[douglasf13]

And these two paragraphs cut to the heart of what I'm saying -- this is a fundemental shift in how Apple has traditionally marketed products, for better or worse.

This is EXACTLY the point. Building tech gear is one thing, but building wearable gear is another, and Apple is wise for acknowledging the difference and marketing accordingly. It's why you're not going to see many celebrities and/or wealthy people who want to try smartwatches walking around with that Hauwei on their wrist.

 

[BigGuy219]

I live within walking distance of an Omega Boutique. When I walk in there's a rather large display of George Clooney on a classic Italian speedboat on Lake Como wearing an Omega prominently.

I want to be on that boat on Lake Como with George. Heck, I want to be George. But, I can't. But, I can wear the same watch!

And that's how you sell a $10,000+ watch.

Apple hasn't been able to do that yet. But I think Apple Watch Hermès is going to move them closer. I predict that most of these will be received as gifts rather than direct purchases and that the number one seller will be the 38mm Double Tour in Fauve (brown).

I've had two friends wives contact me this week and ask me to mention it to their husbands. They never once asked me about the AWS or SS. And if you look at the marketing so far it's designed primarily for women. I wouldn't be surprised if I'm the only guy in my area that gets one.

Edited to add. Here's a link to George's Omega for anyone interested: http://www.omegawatches.com/watches...0-m/co-axial-chronograph-44-mm/23123445006001

 

[douglasf13]

I live within walking distance of an Omega Boutique. When I walk in there's a rather large display of George Clooney on a classic Italian speedboat on Lake Como wearing an Omega prominently.

I want to be on that boat on Lake Como with George. Heck, I want to be George. But, I can't. But, I can wear the same watch!

And that's how you sell a $10,000+ watch.

Apple hasn't been able to do that yet. But I think Apple Watch Hermès is going to move them closer. I predict that most of these will be received as gifts rather than direct purchases and that the number one seller will be the 38mm Double Tour in Fauve (brown).

I've had two friends wives contact me this week and ask me to mention it to their husbands. They never once asked me about the AWS or SS. And if you look at the marketing so far it's designed primarily for women. I wouldn't be surprised if I'm the only guy in my area that gets one.

Yeah, it's a step in the right direction, and I'm surprised we haven't seen more celebrity endorsements, yet. That will go a long, long way, just as it does in the luxury watch world.

 

[BigGuy219]

Yeah, it's a step in the right direction, and I'm surprised we haven't seen more celebrity endorsements, yet. That will go a long, long way, just as it does in the luxury watch world.

They got Serena, didn't they? Although I think her ad was primarily geared towards the fitness features, which makes sense. But Serena is as passionate about fashion as she is her tennis, so maybe something more fashionable will come later.

 

[WarHeadz]

Did you ever think you would see the day where Apple would co-brand a product with anybody else? The closest thing I can think of here is Sony's design of the PowerBook 100. Can you imagine if Apple had put Sonys name anywhere on that product?

Remember when HP manufactured iPods? Makes you cringe don't it?

 

[Rogifan]

They got Serena, didn't they? Although I think her ad was primarily geared towards the fitness features, which makes sense. But Serena is as passionate about fashion as she is her tennis, so maybe something more fashionable will come later.

That's interesting considering she was wearing a different watch during her matches (I'm sure some sort of endorsement deal).

 

[Bagaholic]

You keep dancing around your own issue -- show me the watch face Huawei has illegally copied from a famous maker luxury watch company, and this debate may end. Until then, your arguments are moot.

Split hairs all you want. Hermes, has their name etched on the watch case itself, which by your own admission Hermes had nothing to do with. It makes about as much sense as this:

LOL the first picture of the case is a counterfeit Hermès product. Second picture, Hermès has ZERO input on the phone so of course the branding on it is ridiculous.

The Hermès AW on the other hand, has the strap made by Hermès, and the face inspired by Hermès products and heritage, so co-branding is valid.

Also, I don't understand why you have to let this bother you so much you go after everyone with your repetitive arguments that simply don't stand about a product that is clearly not belong in your world. You are not its target market and you are clearly clueless and in denial about how marketing/business work and everything around it. Everyone has been pointing out to the fact that co-branding like this has existed for decades. Also, this is an Apple Watch forum, who cares about your Huawei that you seeks credit for so bad. OMG!

 

[Mac 128]

Breguet:

Huawei:

LOL, I can only assume you have an ocular impairment. Those watches couldn't be more dissimilar.