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Hig res with streamer

A

al.aiello

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Feb 14, 2022
9
1
Forgive my ignorance. I have apple music and play through a marantz NA 6006 network streamer using Airplay 2. The quality is lossless.
If I want to play in hig res instead I have to use a usb cable and physically connect it without airplay2, right ??
Can applications like TIDAL instead do it directly on the Marantz without connecting with a USB cable? Excuse me but no one has been able to explain it.
Thanks, a warm greeting.
Alessandro Aiello, Rome, Italy
 
Marco Klobas

Marco Klobas

macrumors 6502
Jul 14, 2017
436
890
Italy
In order to get Apple Music in hi-res you need to connect your iOS/iPadOS/macOS device to a USB DAC.

If the Marantz offers a USB DAC input, then you can achieve that. Check if the USB port is really a DAC input or only a storage input. If it's the latter then it won't work.
 
Marco Klobas

Marco Klobas

macrumors 6502
Jul 14, 2017
436
890
Italy
If you're referring to Tidal Connect, then no, it's not the same. The direct connection to a USB DAC with Apple Music app isn't managed remotely.

I have no experience with Tidal Connect. As far as I know it's more similar to AirPlay except the audio stream goes directly to the destination device:

AirPlay started from device A destined to device B:
Audio Stream -> A -> B

Tidal Connect started from device A destined to device B:
Audio Stream -> B

Currently you can't have hi-res audio streamed via a network protocol (either wired or wireless) with Apple Music.
 
A

al.aiello

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Feb 14, 2022
9
1
Marco Klobas said:
If you're referring to Tidal Connect, then no, it's not the same. The direct connection to a USB DAC with Apple Music app isn't managed remotely.

I have no experience with Tidal Connect. As far as I know it's more similar to AirPlay except the audio stream goes directly to the destination device:

AirPlay started from device A destined to device B:
Audio Stream -> A -> B

Tidal Connect started from device A destined to device B:
Audio Stream -> B

Currently you can't have hi-res audio streamed via a network protocol (either wired or wireless) with Apple Music.
Click to expand...
You think in future Apple works via a network protocol? I prefer Apple Music selection than others….
 
Marco Klobas

Marco Klobas

macrumors 6502
Jul 14, 2017
436
890
Italy
My hope is that Apple will extend hi-res streaming via AirPlay eventually. Rumors say that Apple is committed to extent AirPods bandwidth capabilities. Perhaps this will lead to AirPlay improvements too.

Apple is more interested in Spacial Audio than hi-res, though.
 
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Crunchynut

Crunchynut

macrumors member
Jan 10, 2022
59
12
Derby, England
I agree with @Marco Klobas .

However, I believe you are mistaken thinking that Airplay 2 is lossless. Reliable opinion is that ALAC sources are converted to AAC (compressed) for Airplay 2.

For lossless 16/48 you need to use Airplay 1. Personally I use a 3rd gen Apple TV as a receiver because it is Airplay 1 and has an optical audio out. If you have an optical input on your Amp then this might work.

But, as stated, for higher res you need USB connection from IOS device to a DAC. Alternatively use something like an iFi Zen Stream that will take either an Airplay 1 feed from IOS or allow an IOS device to run tidal connect upon it. Then coax or USB out to your DAC.
 
Marco Klobas

Marco Klobas

macrumors 6502
Jul 14, 2017
436
890
Italy
Yes, from an "audiophile" point of view, I confirm that Apple Music through AirPlay is handled better with version 1 rather than version 2.

This is a recap scheme I made a few months ago:

Apple-Music-Audiophile-Style-AirPlay.jpg
 
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Marco Klobas

Marco Klobas

macrumors 6502
Jul 14, 2017
436
890
Italy
@Crunchynut The scheme is addressing the "bit perfectness", not the sample rate capabilities of Apple devices. That's the reason why even Mac is red crossed.

The Music app injects 8 bits more than requested making the stream not bit perfect. The reason is unknown. Qobuz, for example, doesn't do that.

Sonically speaking it's debatable if the difference is hearable or not.

Speaking of sample rates: it's worth to note that Apple Music on Mac still can't work in Exclusive Mode (automatic sample rate switching in Audio MIDI Setup).

AirPlay (both, 1 and 2) as a protocol can handle lossless signals up to 44 kHz (for audio contents – for video contents up to 48 kHz). It is Apple Music streaming service through its app that specifically messes with AirPlay 2, sending an AAC stream instead of ALAC as you correctly stated. The protocol per se is capable of lossless audio.
 
Crunchynut

Crunchynut

macrumors member
Jan 10, 2022
59
12
Derby, England
Ah I see. Makes sense.

Is that because USB is always 32 bit or nothing to do with that? Does that imply that 16 bits are added to a 16 bit source and 8 bits added to a 24 bit source?
 
Marco Klobas

Marco Klobas

macrumors 6502
Jul 14, 2017
436
890
Italy
Here’s a thread addressing the issue. I contributed to the thread with some tests. The extra bits were discovered by another user – it seems they contain a sort of dithering.
 
Uofmtiger

Uofmtiger

macrumors 68020
Dec 11, 2010
2,308
1,028
Memphis
I know you didn’t specifically ask, but I have a Denon with Heos that will support Amazon Hi Res files using Heos ( Marantz May work the same). if you want to stream, you may need an app like Audirvana or Logitech Media Server running on a computer using Qobuz or Tidal. It will send the hi res audio quality via DLNA to your Marantz.

As mentioned, I don’t know a way to stream with Apple Music over wifi and get hi res. The closest thing is using an iPhone (usb Adapter) with Siri or an Apple Watch to control it.
 
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