Horrific Apple Store experience, can anyone help me out here with my Apple Watch?

[Yebubbleman]

Actually they did have the phone in stock, they just wouldn't give one to me.

Brand new stock isn't what they give for repairs or warranty replacements. This is common knowledge and common practice among most consumer electronics vendors. This isn't new or even remotely unique to your situation.

And pretty much everything in this forum is first world problems, but that doesn't mean we can't talk about them.

You can talk about them. I never said you couldn't. But I am also just as allowed to point out how ridiculous those are.

And you didn't read regarding the watch so I'm not getting into that again.

No, I did. I have owned Apple Watches on two different occasions, the first of which had me rotating between two different watches. I understand how fitness data and restoring that data from phone to phone works. Sucks that the dude at the Apple Store doesn't. But it's also really not that complicated. In fact, that's an area where Apple makes things TOO simple. RTFM could've saved everyone a lot of headache there.

 

[Fruit Stand]

I don’t really understand the outrage regarding the Apple Watch and the data.

Regardless of a back up, all the health and activity data syncs to iCloud regardless of having a back up or not.

If you didn’t have it enabled that’s a whole different story.

A back up literally just saved how your watch was setup including the arrangement of icons on the Home Screen and the watch faces you had setup.

 

[DMG35]

Brand new stock isn't what they give for repairs or warranty replacements. This is common knowledge and common practice among most consumer electronics vendors. This isn't new or even remotely unique to your situation.



You can talk about them. I never said you couldn't. But I am also just as allowed to point out how ridiculous those are.


No, I did. I have owned Apple Watches on two different occasions, the first of which had me rotating between two different watches. I understand how fitness data and restoring that data from phone to phone works. Sucks that the dude at the Apple Store doesn't. But it's also really not that complicated. In fact, that's an area where Apple makes things TOO simple. RTFM could've saved everyone a lot of headache there.

Good Lord, did I say I was aksing for a brand new replacement phone? I asked if they had any refurbished 14 Pro Max's that they could let me use or swap out for mine. He said they had them but couldn't give them out as a loaner or replacement as my phone was directed to be repaired and the XR was the only phone they would lend out as a loaner phone. They had them they just didn't want to lend one out.

Hmm, so what action would you have had me complete to unpair my watch from the phone that wasn't coming on and pair it to the loaner phone? Its not a scenario that happens often so when the Apple store employees tell me to erase and reset my Apple watch and then pair it to the loaner phone and all of my data will be there I would think they should know. You don't know how to do it either because there really isn't a way to do it. The only option was to erase the Apple watch and then pair it to the loaner and hope that it asked to pair from a backup. It asked to restore my apps and data, which I chose, but it failed to do. So RTFM wouldn't have done anything.

 

[KaliYoni]

Brand new stock isn't what they give for repairs or warranty replacements. This is common knowledge and common practice among most consumer electronics vendors. This isn't new or even remotely unique to your situation.

Plus scams like this have pushed Apple to reduce how many non-refurbs it gives out as replacements:

Man Who Duped Apple into Replacing Fake iPhones for Authentic Devices Worth $1 Million Convicted and Sentenced

A man has been sentenced to 26 months time served in prison for his involvement in a conspiracy to defraud Apple out of more than $1 million by...

www.macrumors.com

(What’s better than a new iPhone in a sealed box on Craigslist? A new iPhone in a sealed, non-refurb box on Craigslist!)

 

[DMG35]

I don’t really understand the outrage regarding the Apple Watch and the data.

Regardless of a back up, all the health and activity data syncs to iCloud regardless of having a back up or not.

If you didn’t have it enabled that’s a whole different story.

A back up literally just saved how your watch was setup including the arrangement of icons on the Home Screen and the watch faces you had setup.

Yeah you'd think that but it didn't. I have backup turned on but something happened between erasing the watch and pairing it with the loaner phone. It didn't put any of my health data back on the phone or the watch.

 

[DMG35]

OK… maybe I overlooked it… but since this is about possibly lost Health data: Isn’t iCloud backup activated? If yes: What‘s the problem?

The AW itself doesn’t hold the data, it syncs it back to the phone and therefore it definitely isn’t lost. Even if unpairing the Watch, the data will be there and if pairing it again, it will register as „new“ data source, adding to the already existing data.

So what am I missing, apart from the fact that this store experience was crappy and yes, exchange replacement is the way to go if you have AC+?

Dude, can you let me know how to unpair a watch from a phone that isn't working? When you figure that out please let me know. Apple doesn't give the option to unpair from the watch itself. You can only erase and reset the watch and then try to pair it to another phone and hope it asks to use a backup of the watch.

 

[okkibs]

The provided service is within what was promised at time of purchase. To expect special treatment that was never agreed upon is not reasonable. It's a business, you purchase something, you have a contract, fine print et al. You're an adult, if you don't inform yourself beforehand, especially about what to do when your supposedly business-critical device fails, and you don't bother reading the fine print before spending 1.5k, that's not on Apple.

The phone failed on a Thursday and OP mentioned an express replacement shipment would have been too late, since it would have had to arrive until sunday and Monday would have been too late. At least that is how I understood it. And that's an incredibly tight schedule to meet, for any support contract. Something like that will cost more than AC+. OP expected a support time window he never paid for in the first place.

Dude, can you let me know how to unpair a watch from a phone that isn't working?

Have they still not returned a working 14 Pro Max to you? If you absolutely must pair the watch to a phone that was set up fresh (without backup restore) you will need to erase the watch and set it up again. Unless you absolutely need it, it would be simpler to restore the fixed 14 Pro Max from backup and then you can resume using the watch without unpairing/resetting. The health data should still be stored with Apple, but it would be annoying regardless having to redo the watch setup.

 

[DMG35]

Have they still not returned a working 14 Pro Max to you? If you absolutely must pair the watch to a phone that was set up fresh (without backup restore) you will need to erase the watch and set it up again. Unless you absolutely need it, it would be simpler to restore the fixed 14 Pro Max from backup and then you can resume using the watch without unpairing/resetting. The health data should still be stored with Apple, but it would be annoying regardless having to redo the watch setup.

No they haven't returned anything to me nor given me any type of communication regarding when it might be fixed. My assumption is that it can't be fixed and they are going to send a replacement because they couldn't fix it in the store.

The repair status just says "Service requested, check back again."

Assuming they fix it that would make sense, but I already paired it to the loaner phone because they told me my data would be brought over to it.

 

[Yebubbleman]

Regardless of a back up, all the health and activity data syncs to iCloud regardless of having a back up or not.

Unless this changed since watchOS 6, this is not true. You'd think it would be and it honestly ought to be, but it's not. The health and activity data isn't saved to iCloud due to privacy concerns (or at least, that was the prevailing logic in the watchOS 6 and earlier days). Heath and fitness data from a watch is stored on the iPhone and only preserved in the form of a full device backup of the iPhone (not the watch) to iCloud.

Good Lord, did I say I was aksing for a brand new replacement phone? I asked if they had any refurbished 14 Pro Max's that they could let me use or swap out for mine. He said they had them but couldn't give them out as a loaner or replacement as my phone was directed to be repaired and the XR was the only phone they would lend out as a loaner phone. They had them they just didn't want to lend one out.

This is Apple bureaucracy. I'm not saying it's a good thing, but it's absolutely commonplace, especially with the iPhone. And it's that way BECAUSE people flood their already poorly managed Genius Bars with phone requests specifically. Not justifying it. But this sort of thing is far from news. Happens all the time.

Hmm, so what action would you have had me complete to unpair my watch from the phone that wasn't coming on and pair it to the loaner phone? Its not a scenario that happens often so when the Apple store employees tell me to erase and reset my Apple watch and then pair it to the loaner phone and all of my data will be there I would think they should know. You don't know how to do it either because there really isn't a way to do it. The only option was to erase the Apple watch and then pair it to the loaner and hope that it asked to pair from a backup. It asked to restore my apps and data, which I chose, but it failed to do. So RTFM wouldn't have done anything.

Step 1. Turn in iPhone to be repaired/replaced
Step 2. Receive Loaner Phone
Step 3. Restore Loaner Phone to newest iOS release
Step 4. Restore Loaner iPhone to your last iCloud backup of the phone being repaired/replaced
Step 5. Use the Watch app to communicate with your watch and, if need be, force a restore of your watch

And mind you, that's if you absolutely couldn't miss a day or two of fitness tracking and HAD to keep using the watch while you were without a permanent iPhone.

 

[DMG35]

Unless this changed since watchOS 6, this is not true. You'd think it would be and it honestly ought to be, but it's not. The health and activity data isn't saved to iCloud due to privacy concerns (or at least, that was the prevailing logic in the watchOS 6 and earlier days). Heath and fitness data from a watch is stored on the iPhone and only preserved in the form of a full device backup of the iPhone (not the watch) to iCloud.



This is Apple bureaucracy. I'm not saying it's a good thing, but it's absolutely commonplace, especially with the iPhone. And it's that way BECAUSE people flood their already poorly managed Genius Bars with phone requests specifically. Not justifying it. But this sort of thing is far from news. Happens all the time.



Step 1. Turn in iPhone to be repaired/replaced
Step 2. Receive Loaner Phone
Step 3. Restore Loaner Phone to newest iOS release
Step 4. Restore Loaner iPhone to your last iCloud backup of the phone being repaired/replaced
Step 5. Use the Watch app to communicate with your watch and, if need be, force a restore of your watch

And mind you, that's if you absolutely couldn't miss a day or two of fitness tracking and HAD to keep using the watch while you were without a permanent iPhone.

Unfortunately I couldn't restore the phone to the last iCloud backup as it didn't have enough storage on it so I had to set it up as new and then sign into iCloud. Then trying to pair the watch with the phone didn't restore any of my health data and essentially set my watch up as new.

 

[jz0309]

Unless this changed since watchOS 6, this is not true. You'd think it would be and it honestly ought to be, but it's not. The health and activity data isn't saved to iCloud due to privacy concerns (or at least, that was the prevailing logic in the watchOS 6 and earlier days). Heath and fitness data from a watch is stored on the iPhone and only preserved in the form of a full device backup of the iPhone (not the watch) to iCloud.

well, I do a full backup of my iPhone to my Mac, not to iCloud, but check out my post here: #70
In addition, below shows what is in my iCloud. I am certainly not going to experiment and see if I can erase/restore but I do believe the Health data does indeed gets backed up to iCloud (unless you have it disabled, see post 70).

 

[Yebubbleman]

Unfortunately I couldn't restore the phone to the last iCloud backup as it didn't have enough storage on it so I had to set it up as new and then sign into iCloud. Then trying to pair the watch with the phone didn't restore any of my health data and essentially set my watch up as new.

At that point, I would've just waited to mess with my Apple Watch again until I got the replacement/repaired phone back. Perfect attendance on Apple Watch fitness rewards doesn't mean anything. It's the actual exercise that matters.

well, I do a full backup of my iPhone to my Mac, not to iCloud, but check out my post here: #70
In addition, below shows what is in my iCloud. I am certainly not going to experiment and see if I can erase/restore but I do believe the Health data does indeed gets backed up to iCloud (unless you have it disabled, see post 70).

View attachment 2180322

That's either new and/or that doesn't actually allow for restoring of watchOS provided data separate from a full iCloud backup of the phone you paired the watch to. I remember this being a pain the one time I had to send an Apple Watch out for repair. So much so that I bought a second Apple Watch to use in the meantime. I definitely regret that.

 

[jz0309]

That's either new and/or that doesn't actually allow for restoring of watchOS provided data separate from a full iCloud backup of the phone you paired the watch to. I remember this being a pain the one time I had to send an Apple Watch out for repair. So much so that I bought a second Apple Watch to use in the meantime. I definitely regret that.

I was not suggesting you could restore watchOS, merely that your health data is backed up to iCloud (via your phone).
so, this should bring your health data back once a new AW is paired to the phone, at least in theory but as I said, I'm not going to try it out.
There are plenty posts here of people losing badges and activity/health data from the AW/iPhone and almost all of them re-appear after a couple days, iCloud sync seems to have issues at time

 

[dawnrazor]

I feel the word ‘horrific’ has been abused and misused with respect to this thread…

‘Unfortunate’ would have served you better …

It’s all a. bit ‘first world problems’ to be fair…

 

[DMG35]

I feel the word ‘horrific’ has been abused and misused with respect to this thread…

‘Unfortunate’ would have served you better …

It’s all a. bit ‘first world problems’ to be fair…

This entire forum is first world problems, doesn't mean it can't be discussed.

 

[DMG35]

I was not suggesting you could restore watchOS, merely that your health data is backed up to iCloud (via your phone).
so, this should bring your health data back once a new AW is paired to the phone, at least in theory but as I said, I'm not going to try it out.
There are plenty posts here of people losing badges and activity/health data from the AW/iPhone and almost all of them re-appear after a couple days, iCloud sync seems to have issues at time

I hope that's the case, would love it if it reappeared.

 

[Fruit Stand]

Unless this changed since watchOS 6, this is not true. You'd think it would be and it honestly ought to be, but it's not. The health and activity data isn't saved to iCloud due to privacy concerns (or at least, that was the prevailing logic in the watchOS 6 and earlier days). Heath and fitness data from a watch is stored on the iPhone and only preserved in the form of a full device backup of the iPhone (not the watch) to iCloud.

This is absolutely not true. HealthKit data is synced independently and not backed up to iCloud as a backup like an iPhone or iPad, it does however back up as part of an iPhone back up if paired during that back up or unpaired prior to it. I've never used a back up to setup my new Watches yet my health data from 2015 to now is still intact which then feeds into the Activity app.

Former Apple employee here, so I not pulling this out of my behind.

As per Apple's website: "When your phone is locked with a passcode, all your health and fitness data in the Health app — other than your Medical ID — is encrypted. Your health data stays up to date across all your devices automatically using iCloud, where it is encrypted while in transit and at rest. Apps that access HealthKit are required to have a privacy policy, so be sure to review these policies before providing apps with access to your health and fitness data."

Source: https://www.apple.com/ca/ios/health/

 

[bricktop_at]

Dude, can you let me know how to unpair a watch from a phone that isn't working? When you figure that out please let me know. Apple doesn't give the option to unpair from the watch itself. You can only erase and reset the watch and then try to pair it to another phone and hope it asks to use a backup of the watch.

„Dude“ you should read what I wrote…
It‘s not necessary to unpair it as the data is constantly synced to the phone and then backed up to iCloud. I should have been clearer, even without unpairing, the data will stay on the phone and in iCloud as the Watch is kept as data source entry in Health. The backup when unpairing it is just a backup of your settings

 

[BigMcGuire]

Unfortunately I couldn't restore the phone to the last iCloud backup as it didn't have enough storage on it so I had to set it up as new and then sign into iCloud. Then trying to pair the watch with the phone didn't restore any of my health data and essentially set my watch up as new.

Hopefully when you get your 1TB phone back and do a full iCloud backup restore all that stuff will come back.

As someone who has reset my Ultra twice with 2 different phones recently - all my health data transferred super quickly with no problems. (I was dumb enough to wipe the old phone first before doing anything with my watch so I had to wipe my watch twice and restore it completely from backup twice).

If I got a tiny little phone to tide me over, I'd set it up as new and not restore from backup then restore from backup when I get my original phone back (just what I'd do) - and leave my watch until I got my original phone back.

 

[onenorth]

The flood of crazed negative hype is beyond belief at times. Look at this in depth dive into a minor inconvenience. The bandwidth wasted on nitpicking complaints is astounding.

Since when did we become concerned about conserving bandwidth? The Internet is and has always been the ultimate time waster.

 

[onenorth]

Apple got to be one of the biggest companies in the world by having consistent procedures in place. I work for a large company. Things like this are what can make or break your P&L.

Profits are never high enough are they? Apple is fine.

Who's worried about Apple's P&L these days. Shareholders.

 

[BeatCrazy]

Profits are never high enough are they? Apple is fine.

Who's worried about Apple's P&L these days. Shareholders.

Shareholders elect Apple's Board of Directors (Tim Cook's bosses), so blame everyone that owns Apple shares, I guess?

 

[Yebubbleman]

I was not suggesting you could restore watchOS, merely that your health data is backed up to iCloud (via your phone).
so, this should bring your health data back once a new AW is paired to the phone, at least in theory but as I said, I'm not going to try it out.
There are plenty posts here of people losing badges and activity/health data from the AW/iPhone and almost all of them re-appear after a couple days, iCloud sync seems to have issues at time

This is absolutely not true. HealthKit data is synced independently and not backed up to iCloud as a backup like an iPhone or iPad, it does however back up as part of an iPhone back up if paired during that back up or unpaired prior to it. I've never used a back up to setup my new Watches yet my health data from 2015 to now is still intact which then feeds into the Activity app.

Former Apple employee here, so I not pulling this out of my behind.

As per Apple's website: "When your phone is locked with a passcode, all your health and fitness data in the Health app — other than your Medical ID — is encrypted. Your health data stays up to date across all your devices automatically using iCloud, where it is encrypted while in transit and at rest. Apps that access HealthKit are required to have a privacy policy, so be sure to review these policies before providing apps with access to your health and fitness data."

Source: https://www.apple.com/ca/ios/health/

To clarify to both of you, health data IS synced. Fitness and Watch data is something I've never had synced. You wipe your iPhone and don't restore from its iCloud or iTunes backup, that fitness and watch data is gone. Mind you, I haven't used the Apple Watch since watchOS 6; this is a feature that I'd think Apple would have addressed by then.

 

[DMG35]

Well I got notified today that hey couldn’t fix my phone and they are shipping me a replacement device. I guess when I restore it from backup and re-pair my Watch I’ll see if the health data recovers. I realize it’s not the end of the world if it doesn’t but just frustrating that all those years of data are potentially gone.

 

[jz0309]

To clarify to both of you, health data IS synced. Fitness and Watch data is something I've never had synced. You wipe your iPhone and don't restore from its iCloud or iTunes backup, that fitness and watch data is gone. Mind you, I haven't used the Apple Watch since watchOS 6; this is a feature that I'd think Apple would have addressed by then.

Well, if what you’re saying were true, then anyone who gets a new iPhone and sets it up as “new” vs transfer/restore would lose their fitness data, right?
For at least the last 4 or 5 years I’ve transferred my data from old to new iPhone so don’t have experience but if that were the case I’m sure we would constantly see posts here.
Also, below screenshot is my local iPhone storage for the Health app, 2.46GB vs 442MB in iCloud and that delta is most likely due to compression. And you can see all the fitness data is there. The Fitness app shows 2.4MB of data which clearly is not my 7+ years of data…