How Apple Minimizes its Corporate Tax Burden

[VulchR]

The clever getting richer.

Actually, worldwide the richer have been getting richer. In Western countries like the US and the UK, they have been doing this in part through tax avoidance and outright tax evasion.

As for 'the clever getting richer', I have to ask what was so clever about the lemming-like bankers who drove the global economy into a nosedive? In the UK they seemed to have retired early, using their amassed wealth to sit on their fat, parasitic arses while living a comfortable life doing absolutely nothing of value to anybody.

.... And please show me where Apple has up and moved when not getting a local tax break.

Fair enough. I was sloppy in my language. They threaten to leave (for instance).

 

[AustinIllini]

A company is ethically obligated to minimize its own tax burden IMO. I would fault a company that does otherwise. The humans involved in the company (employees, investors) already pay taxes, as well they should since they're the ones who directly benefit from most government services.

Blaming a company for taking advantage of legal tax loopholes is like blaming water for finding leaks in a boat.

Everyone is mad because our government has no idea how to spend money they don't have. If the budget were balanced no one would care.

 

[matthiasgoodman]

Why?

If store A sells you a product for $20 and store B sells you the same product for $5, you would buy it from store B, right? You don't feel bad about taking business away from store A, you don't feel like you're doing wrong, you just evaluate the options and take the cheapest route. Perhaps to get the cheaper price from store B you need to set up a membership account or jump through a few hoops, but you'd do it if it saved you enough money.

In addition to this, rember that all corporate taxes are payed by the customer.

 

[nikhsub1]

Don't blame Apple. It's the current tax code that leaves the burden on the individual's. Look it up!

Agreed 100%

There is legality and then there are ethics...

So you think Apple has an "ethical" obligation to pay more tax?

Good for Apple. The more US companies that expose the idiocracy of our tax code the quicker things might change.

The US government has nobody to blame but themselves.

Agreed 100%

How many of you volunteer to pay MORE income tax because you think it's the 'right' thing to do? Yeah, that's what I thought. Why should Apple?

 

[cadillac1234]

Ireland is in a austerity nightmare yet the government still allows billions (possibly trillions) to funnel through it's shores and a huge discount. Even a .5% increase on the current corporate taxes would help out the ROI immensely

It's not just Apple doing it. Google and GE run the same tax structures.

I believe if companies want to utilize the outstanding corporate benefits allowed by the US government there should be an AMT-type of tax for corporations based on global revenue.

Stop putting all the burdens on the citizens and force corporations to a fairer share.

 

[NunoBerny]

You can't fault companies and people for taking advantage of legal loopholes but this is a perfect example of why we should eliminate them.

If I find a way to kill you without getting arrested, is it legal?
I really dislike this "bend the rules" attitude.
In the good old days, the "spirit of the law" was what mattered. Now, it's digging thorugh thousands of laws to find something where you can bypass it.

It's disgusting and it's harming the society much more than is apparent.

 

[TheStoof]

Legal or not, this is a burden on society.

We all have no choice but to pay taxes, yet corporations like Apple avoid paying their fair share while brainwashing the masses to buy their iPods and iPhones, and we know none of it is going to help California or the USA.

I love Apple, and I'm looking to get a new 15" (or 17" if they are still here this Fall), so I'm not an Apple basher.

This is as bad as Romney. Sigh.

 

[-Ken-]

Actually, worldwide the richer have been getting richer. In Western countries like the US and the UK, they have been doing this in part through tax avoidance and outright tax evasion.

As for 'the clever getting richer', I have to ask what was so clever about the lemming-like bankers who drive the global economy into a nosedive? In the UK they seemed to have retired early, using their amassed wealth to sit on their fat, parasitic arses while living a comfortable life doing absolutely nothing of value to anybody.

Agreed. A gold standard or heck, any standard would have prevented this mess. Instead our governments print more money for obligations they cannot meet. But I digress, thats another topic for another day.

 

[cadillac1234]

How many of you volunteer to pay MORE income tax because you think it's the 'right' thing to do? Yeah, that's what I thought. Why should Apple?

If I was making more than enough to get by and I saw a huge portion of my fellow citizens struggling I certainly would try to help.

I'm a dirty socialist though

 

[thejadedmonkey]

Agreed 100%

So you think Apple has an "ethical" obligation to pay more tax?

Agreed 100%

How many of you volunteer to pay MORE income tax because you think it's the 'right' thing to do? Yeah, that's what I thought. Why should Apple?

Well actually, I'm sure a lot of people would offer to pay more taxes if the services received were to balance it all out. Most european countries have a much higher tax than America, and they don't seem to be immigrating en mass to places with lower taxes. But they also have a better educational system, and healthcare.... Need I go on? Your point is moot.

 

[Lennholm]

And the intelligent consumer should buy from Apple because the intelligent consumer knows the price of products would increase if subjected to higher taxes.

And the even more intelligent consumer will realize that if Apple avoids paying taxes the government will collect the taxes it needs somewhere else, and guess where that is... What we get is a situation where all tax paying citizens are subsidizing Apple's prices.

 

[Mr_Ed]

If I find a way to kill you without getting arrested, is it legal?

In self defense. Sure. It's legal. Otherwise, no it isn't. Merely failing to get arrested does not make the act legal as there are still legal grounds to arrest you. A corporation that does not break any legal statutes in the course of doing business is not doing anything illegal. Period.

 

[AustinIllini]

Ireland is in a austerity nightmare yet the government still allows billions (possibly trillions) to funnel through it's shores and a huge discount. Even a .5% increase on the current corporate taxes would help out the ROI immensely

It's not just Apple doing it. Google and GE run the same tax structures.

I believe if companies want to utilize the outstanding corporate benefits allowed by the US government there should be an AMT-type of tax for corporations based on global revenue.

Stop putting all the burdens on the citizens and force corporations to a fairer share.

I've lived in three cities: Detroit, Austin, and Chicago. Detroit has no business as a result of overregulation and a collapsed motor economy. It's awful. Chicago has so many people it is having a debt crisis.

Austin gives money to corporations to help them build in the city. Austin is the fastest growing city in the United States for ten straight years. Don't put the burden on business or the consumer, put the burden on the government to do a better job managing their money.

 

[Abazigal]

So Apple still pays taxes. I thought they would have found a way to avoid paying a single cent altogether!

 

[-Ken-]

And the even more intelligent consumer will realize that if Apple avoids paying taxes the government will collect the taxes it needs somewhere else, and guess where that is... What we get is a situation where all tax paying citizens are subsidizing Apple's prices.

If anything, eliminating corporate taxes would level the playing field for small businesses to compete with the larger 'tax dodgers' and in the end, make our country more competitive.

Meanwhile strictly enforce personal income taxes and eliminate loopholes. THAT is what would be ethical.

 

[benspratling]

Yeah!

You go Apple, set up phony subsidiaries and employee scores of people around the world in unnecessary locations, just like the tax men want you to! After all, if they wanted you to engage in lean and green business practices, they'd have made it cheaper for you not to go to all this trouble.

It's pretty funny listening to people saying companies paying taxes is "being green" especially since folks who believe in such hoaxes want to use taxes to alter people's behavior. Well, Apple altered their behavior, and now you complain??? It's not unusual at all. Folks who want to use taxes as a means to alter behavior never understand the fundamental economic problem: alternate means for the same end, and alternate uses for the same resource.

To those who think this should be illegal, or is in fact immoral, I pose this question: "What is Apple supposed to do, set up the maximum tax configuration of their business and maximize their prices?"

Ultimately, customers pay all the taxes anyway, so operating in a minimizing tax locations reduces the price to customers. (Some argue that employees share in the tax burden... but where does the revenue come from if not customers?) It also increases the money stream to employees, and wasn't someone complaining Apple employees aren't being paid enough?...

So, Thanks Apple! We appreciate your working hard to avoid the things governments don't want you to do (the highly-taxed things) to bring us the lowest prices (from the lowest taxed things).

(Well, ok, maybe it's just me since we've got a bunch of people who don't understand basic economics on this forum.)

 

[JAT]

If I find a way to kill you without getting arrested, is it legal?
I really dislike this "bend the rules" attitude.

If you are going to use an analogy, please use one that works. If you kill a person LEGALLY, then yes, that would be legal. Self-defense comes to mind. Or an officer on duty, or many other things.

Being "arrested" has nothing to do with a determination of "legal".

Was there an actual point here?

 

[floatingspirit]

It's the fault of our corrupt Congress who write a corrupt tax code.

Here! Here! Right.

The NYT seems to like Apple bashing anyway. Even their smaller headlines occasionally cast Apple event with a negative light in contrast to the wording of other news sources.

 

[dtlee1974]

Businesses do not pay taxes, ever.

The costs are merely added to the prices of goods and services.

Instead, we should be looking at Apple's payroll. How many hundreds of millions of dollars do their employees get paid?

THEY pay taxes.

This is 100% correct. Every dollar taxed from a corporation at the end of the day comes from the pocket of a shareholder, employee or customer. The company has a fiduciary duty to their shareholders to minimize their taxes through any legal means. In fact, if they didn't take reasonable measures to do so, they could be liable to a shareholders lawsuit.

Secondly, how many of you people complaining about ethics write the IRS an extra check every year? They'll take it you know. My guess is that every single one of you pays what's legally required of you and not one dime more. In fact, I bet many of you have personal tax preparers just for the purposes of minimizing your tax burden and ensuring strict compliance with the law. And guess what, there's nothing wrong with that.

 

[siddavis]

If I was making more than enough to get by and I saw a huge portion of my fellow citizens struggling I certainly would try to help.

I'm a dirty socialist though

No, that's called charity. Don't force me to provide to a system that is so unbelievably inefficient (and corrupt).

 

[benspratling]

If I was making more than enough to get by and I saw a huge portion of my fellow citizens struggling I certainly would try to help.

I'm a dirty socialist though

Well, you're spending your time commenting on an internet forum commenting on somebody else's international tax structure. My guess is you're either 1) already making enough to get by and therefore I'm perplexed that you've posed your help for others as "if" instead of "i do", 2) very bad at time management and critical decision making, 3) don't understand that there is no such thing as "enough to get by", 4) don't have a record of the charitable donations of Apple employees.

Actually, strike that, it's probably all of them.

 

[siddavis]

I've lived in three cities: Detroit, Austin, and Chicago. Detroit has no business as a result of overregulation and a collapsed motor economy. It's awful. Chicago has so many people it is having a debt crisis.

Austin gives money to corporations to help them build in the city. Austin is the fastest growing city in the United States for ten straight years. Don't put the burden on business or the consumer, put the burden on the government to do a better job managing their money.

No doubt. And when will people wake up and understand that publicly traded companies have a responsibility to their shareholders to reduce their tax burden. If you were a holder of APPL, you would be furious if they didn't.

Companies don't "ship jobs overseas", our govt and sweet tax code do.

 

[Judas1]

Since corporations are people now, shouldn't they pay the same rates as you or I?

 

[JAT]

Apple treats opening new offices the same as any other company. Apple didn't invent local tax breaks, they are simply playing the game. And please show me where Apple has up and moved when not getting a local tax break.

Definitely. I used to work for an apartment building. You should see the breaks that place got, simply by agreeing to (not kidding): keep 20% of its apartments used or available for people making "only" 80% of the local median wage. Which calculates to something like $55k/year. This was using the low-income housing rules (which should apply to those making <$20k/yr), but modified. It is a luxury high-rise in a downtown area. They have basically never paid tax of any kind (except sales), and have a ridiculously low interest rate on the bonds that back their mortgage. Just to make sure the lawyers and other professionals coming out of college have a gorgeous place to live before they have a chance to make real money.

 

[carlgo]

It is the overseas production that allows for this, the real reason corporations go to China. That and the upcoming revelations about overseas pollution, bribes and all sorts of unsavory things.

It is not about wages, evil unions, benefits, etc.