How do you choose your word processor?

[gplusplus]

You what? Pages is more intuitive than Word and Libre. I like Libre, but when it comes to intuitive, Pages does take the crown. Pages is overall fantastic actually. I use it all the time, and LaTeX support makes it pretty useful even for a lot of my university work. Including great collaboration features. The iWork suite in general is fantastic.

In my opinion, the whole Inspector thing is a joke.

LibreOffice can open, edit and create Excel 2007-2019 xlsx files. It's there something missing compared to Microsoft's Excel?

Lots. Performance, macros, extended formula support, data source support, extensions, and integrations.

If you’re a home user, you’d probably never notice. But I have to work with people who use Excel as their primary data manipulation tool, so they’re using all the advanced features. Even if you’re only using the common subset of features, Excel’s performance versus LibreOffice is absolutely night and day when it comes to massive spreadsheets. I’m talking several gigabytes.

The instant LibreOffice fails, I’m wasting my time, wondering why I didn’t go ahead and pay the $10/month for Microsoft Office. So yea.

 

[casperes1996]

In my opinion, the whole Inspector thing is a joke.

The inspector has been a standard UI concept, especially on the Mac, for decades. It's a concept in Preview as well. iMovie, Final Cut, Motion and so on. There's no way to really dispute an opinion, but I respectfully disagree 🙂. The inspector is easy to use, contextually aware and much preferred to something like a Ribbon menu that throws a confusing mess at you.

Furthermore, what version of Pages was the last you tried? Since you mention the inspector you've likely had experience with an older version - I don't think it's formally called that in the newer versions, at least within the app. Pages 5+ is much easier for new users I think, though still lacks a few features of prior iterations though pretty much fully featured. And I can't stress this enough, LaTeX support is great

 

[gplusplus]

The inspector has been a standard UI concept, especially on the Mac, for decades. It's a concept in Preview as well. iMovie, Final Cut, Motion and so on. There's no way to really dispute an opinion, but I respectfully disagree 🙂. The inspector is easy to use, contextually aware and much preferred to something like a Ribbon menu that throws a confusing mess at you.

Furthermore, what version of Pages was the last you tried? Since you mention the inspector you've likely had experience with an older version - I don't think it's formally called that in the newer versions, at least within the app. Pages 5+ is much easier for new users I think, though still lacks a few features of prior iterations though pretty much fully featured. And I can't stress this enough, LaTeX support is great

LaTeX support is meaningless to me. I’m not writing or editing academic papers anymore.

But you’re right; it’s been a long time since I’ve given Pages a shot. I want to say circa 2012? The thing is, I really have no real reason to. The only office-like software I ever absolutely need to use is Excel. Otherwise, if I’m writing documentation, it’s either in a code editor or a collaborative word processor like Google Docs or Office Online. I have zero regular need for a word processor on the desktop. So that one-off time that I need a word processor, I already have Microsoft Word. It’s good and it’s cheap.

 

[casperes1996]

But you’re right; it’s been a long time since I’ve given Pages a shot. I want to say circa 2012? The thing is, I really have no real reason to. The only office-like software I ever absolutely need to use is Excel. Otherwise, if I’m writing documentation, it’s either in a code editor or a collaborative word processor like Google Docs or Office Online. I have zero regular need for a word processor on the desktop. So that one-off time that I need a word processor, I already have Microsoft Word. It’s good and it’s cheap.

That's entirely fair and valid. But Pages genuinely is really good. And it's collaboration is really excellent as well. IMO actually works better than Google Docs. That is updating is a tad slower, but it's more feature rich and nicer to use, and otherwise collaboration is as smooth an experience. Pages and Overleaf are the only collaboration-writers I touch and for uni I write a lot in collaboration.
And Word may be cheap, but Pages is free 😉

 

[gplusplus]

That's entirely fair and valid. But Pages genuinely is really good. And it's collaboration is really excellent as well. IMO actually works better than Google Docs. That is updating is a tad slower, but it's more feature rich and nicer to use, and otherwise collaboration is as smooth an experience. Pages and Overleaf are the only collaboration-writers I touch and for uni I write a lot in collaboration.
And Word may be cheap, but Pages is free 😉

Uhhh the collaboration is pretty terrible if the other person doesn’t have iCloud/Pages. The number of businesses using Pages/iCloud is something close to zero.

You’re a hopeful college student. Trust me; you will see the world differently when you hit the real world. 😉

 

[macintoshmac]

LibreOffice can open, edit and create Excel 2007-2019 xlsx files. It's there something missing compared to Microsoft's Excel?

Excel has a simple button for checking duplicates in cells. It is just for that button that I use Excel. I don't think that exists in Numbers, does it in LibreOffice? If so, I can remove that obscenely space-hogging Excel from my computer. One program is in gigabytes!

 

[MacBH928]

You what? Pages is more intuitive than Word and Libre. I like Libre, but when it comes to intuitive, Pages does take the crown. Pages is overall fantastic actually. I use it all the time, and LaTeX support makes it pretty useful even for a lot of my university work. Including great collaboration features. The iWork suite in general is fantastic.

I really feel sorry for iWork. I wish more people use it, Apple has put in the effort but everyone seems to use MS Office solution. While better for enterprise, for Home use iWork is more than enough and simpler to use. I would really like to know how many people use iWork. I hate monopolies.

Maybe Apple should push it forward to at least make a "prosumer" choice for small businesses. Anything to break from monopolistic clutches.

 

[macintoshmac]

@casperes1996, it does not matter that Word is cheap and Pages free and genuinely good, since price and value and suitability to purpose depend on the purpose and environment. @gplusplus mentioned that he already has the Microsoft Office suite for Excel, thereby getting Word for free as well, in a way, since his purpose of subscribing to MS Office is Excel.

It is a fact that while iWork suite is great in a lot of ways, for a lot of purposes, it does not work well (and probably was not designed to either) in the majority of the real-world uses where Windows OS and Microsoft Office are staple.

iWork suite would probably work great within a Mac environment, but outside of it, it is enthusiast at best, not professional. There is a reason Microsoft Office is where it is, and it is not because of its Word app, it is because of its other apps, Excel being one.

I am in a macOS environment, I use Pages sometimes. But in my domain, I am now not required to format or stylise my content before delivery, so there go both Word and Pages out the window, and in come simple editors focussed on words such as Bear or Ulysses that offer Markdown support as well. I can write in these apps, and export in whatever format my client wants in simple text that is not stylised.

If I were looking specifically into long-form writing, or even for myriad other uses centring around words, I would look at Scrivener, not the free Pages or the paid MS Word.

If I were in Windows OS environment, my first choice would have been MS Office if I could digest the annual cost, or most likely Scrivener since that would be a one-time payment and suited to my purpose. If I were to number-crunch, and more so, if I were to work in the corporate realm with collaboration and number-crunching requirements, it must only be MS Excel, at which point, since the thread is about which word-processors we use, I would be getting MS Word "for free" and then that would make it the first choice, albeit not the ideal choice.

It all depends on what you do most.


- - -

@MacBH928, you are right - for home use and for quite a lot more than home use - we need not look further than the free apps by Apple. It is for when you begin to need something more specific or something that suits your own individual workflows better that you can then pay for and use.

 

[gplusplus]

Maybe Apple should push it forward to at least make a "prosumer" choice for small businesses. Anything to break from monopolistic clutches.

For Apple to compete, they would have to make iWork available for Windows. This would be fantastic on many levels, one of which is people would stop saying iWork is free. It’s not; it’s amortized into the cost of a Mac.

 

[macintoshmac]

For Apple to compete, they would have to make iWork available for Windows. This would be fantastic on many levels, one of which is people would stop saying iWork is free. It’s not; it’s amortized into the cost of a Mac.

True this. I think people know this, but in common parlance it’s just called free since we aren’t paying for it over and above the cost of the Mac. I think most would know that nothing is free, they’re claiming the cost of that software in their prices for hardware.

 

[bogdanw]

Excel has a simple button for checking duplicates in cells. It is just for that button that I use Excel. I don't think that exists in Numbers, does it in LibreOffice? If so, I can remove that obscenely space-hogging Excel from my computer. One program is in gigabytes!

There is an extension which adds a Remove Duplicates button https://extensions.libreoffice.org/extensions/remove-duplicates-fast

 

[MisterSavage]

If it's an official doc we're publishing at work I use Word. Otherwise Libre Office or Google Docs.

 

[macintoshmac]

There is an extension which adds a Remove Duplicates button https://extensions.libreoffice.org/extensions/remove-duplicates-fast

I see this has been aded recently! Thank you so much for this!

 

[casperes1996]

Uhhh the collaboration is pretty terrible if the other person doesn’t have iCloud/Pages. The number of businesses using Pages/iCloud is something close to zero.

You’re a hopeful college student. Trust me; you will see the world differently when you hit the real world. 😉

Sure. I never meant collaboration was good in a corporate setting either. But between individuals and in a study setting it's great. Preferably through the apps, but if the other person uses Windows, it does also work decently well with the web client, I've been told by someone I've worked with at uni. (My usual partner and I are both on the Mac and have a pretty fleshed out workflow, so when the Windows user came on, we had a long talk about whether the workflow also worked for him, since we used tools like Pages, and it supposedly worked perfectly fine)

@casperes1996, it does not matter that Word is cheap and Pages free and genuinely good, since price and value and suitability to purpose depend on the purpose and environment. @gplusplus mentioned that he already has the Microsoft Office suite for Excel, thereby getting Word for free as well, in a way, since his purpose of subscribing to MS Office is Excel.

The comment about the price was more meant to be taken a bit cheekily, and as a response to the poster's comment about MS Office being relatively cheap. Obviously value is a subjective matter also related to needs and such. In no way do I dispute MS Office is worth the asking price for those who want or need it. But if we do get into a cost argument, Pages is free to Apple customers, as well as anyone with an iCloud account through the web portal (though I wouldn't really use it I must admit). If Pages does everything you want and need, and there's no real benefit to switching to Office for your needs, Pages is undoubtably better value, I assume we can agree. If you for any reason whatsoever, even just because you prefer it with no good arguments for why, want to use Word instead, well, it's price might not matter diddly squat to your perceived value of the product, and that's perfectly fine and valid, and never did I state otherwise 🙂. But I'll defend that Pages is a great product that'll be more than adequate for most users.

For Apple to compete, they would have to make iWork available for Windows. This would be fantastic on many levels, one of which is people would stop saying iWork is free. It’s not; it’s amortized into the cost of a Mac.

There is the web portal offering a somewhat similar experience to Google Docs. Now I personally hate web portals for that sort of thing, but for collaborating with users on other platforms at least it's positive it's there.

 

[JustAnExpat]

Scrivener does the same thing as Microsoft Word?
I have to use both Scrivener (to write), and Microsoft Word (to convert/ layout) as part of my workflow.

 

[topcat001]

My entire day (and sometimes night) is spent in vi. Otherwise Google docs suffices for sharing stuff.

 

[gplusplus]

There is the web portal offering a somewhat similar experience to Google Docs. Now I personally hate web portals for that sort of thing, but for collaborating with users on other platforms at least it's positive it's there.

You’re missing the big picture.

Just because it’s a word processor that works in a web browser doesn’t mean it’s even in the same league as Google Docs or Microsoft Word Online. Docs and Word are part of G-Suite and Office 365. Both of these services have integrations into an entire ecosystem of productivity, organization, and security mechanisms. You can run your entire organization with Microsoft’s and Google’s productivity services. Even more so with Microsoft.

I’m glad to hear iWork has worked well for your student needs. I do want you to think about something, though. For all practical purposes, large businesses have practically unlimited budget, especially compared to students. But even if the business runs 100% on Mac, they still use Microsoft Office 99% of the time. If iWork was so great, businesses would use it because there’s one thing all businesses have in common: they all want to make money. Another thing they tend to have in common is Microsoft Office. 😉

Apple is probably the only company that uses iWork firm-wide. And that’s probably more like Stockholm syndrome than choice.

 

[MacBH928]

Lots. Performance, macros, extended formula support, data source support, extensions, and integrations.

If you’re a home user, you’d probably never notice. But I have to work with people who use Excel as their primary data manipulation tool, so they’re using all the advanced features. Even if you’re only using the common subset of features, Excel’s performance versus LibreOffice is absolutely night and day when it comes to massive spreadsheets. I’m talking several gigabytes.

The instant LibreOffice fails, I’m wasting my time, wondering why I didn’t go ahead and pay the $10/month for Microsoft Office. So yea.

You are not wrong, Excel is the better option, but those better option are needed for a low percentage of MS users. I am betting that 90% of MS users are not using more than 5% of its feature set(and they don't know how). On the other, I really hate it when a company has a dominance in a market area. If you are in the enterprise its either MS Office or nothing which bothers me. This way, they own you, you don't own them.

Also, today I learned Excel file can reach a Gigabyte in size, larger than 3D games. I didn't imagine RAM can handle that.

Scrivener does the same thing as Microsoft Word?
I have to use both Scrivener (to write), and Microsoft Word (to convert/ layout) as part of my workflow.

Why not just type in MS Word in the first place?

 

[casperes1996]

You’re missing the big picture.

Just because it’s a word processor that works in a web browser doesn’t mean it’s even in the same league as Google Docs or Microsoft Word Online. Docs and Word are part of G-Suite and Office 365. Both of these services have integrations into an entire ecosystem of productivity, organization, and security mechanisms. You can run your entire organization with Microsoft’s and Google’s productivity services. Even more so with Microsoft.

I’m glad to hear iWork has worked well for your student needs. I do want you to think about something, though. For all practical purposes, large businesses have practically unlimited budget, especially compared to students. But even if the business runs 100% on Mac, they still use Microsoft Office 99% of the time. If iWork was so great, businesses would use it because there’s one thing all businesses have in common: they all want to make money. Another thing they tend to have in common is Microsoft Office. 😉

Apple is probably the only company that uses iWork firm-wide. And that’s probably more like Stockholm syndrome than choice.

I feel like I've already said this a lot, but I'll say it again.

I am not arguing for the use of iWork in a corporate setting. All I am saying is to consider it as an option for whatever situation you're in, because it's a great option for a lot of needs.

I will say though that the iWork suite also has an ecosystem of productivity, organisation and security around it, but again, I'm not arguing for its use in business. If a business wants to use it I think that could work out just fine frankly, but in all my posts I've mostly been talking about the angle of personal use, where I think Pages, and iWork in general, is a great choice.
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My entire day (and sometimes night) is spent in vi. Otherwise Google docs suffices for sharing stuff.

As great as VIM is, I must admit I don't really get the usecase, unless all you have is a Terminal. For quick edits, might as well use Nano. For larger scale things fire up a full IDE. Pretty much the only thing I use VIM for anymore, is writing my git commit messages, since it's still my default terminal editor, so git commit -a brings it up for the message. Again, I do like VIM and think it's a great program, but I don't see where it slots in, between easier to use editors and a full IDE.

 

[macintoshmac]

Even for personal use, I stopped using Pages for my everyday words almost 5 years ago. I now use Pages rarely, and that is when I need:

- to print on a letterhead
- any text that needs to go in print and in a certain format
- to open the old files that were created in Pages (and they stay in Pages since they are all formatted files).

So, in short, if I need formatted text/ stylised text in a way that I can pass off to people either as PDF or print, I use Pages.

If all that I need is to write for myself (repository) or write and export into whatever format for the client, I now use Bear Notes and Ulysses as my everyday "word processors". The moment I will need to add elements along with words, I will go back to Pages (for personal and mildly professional use).

Pages is primarily a page-layout tool that does word processing as well.

 

[millerj123]

For my home use, OpenOffice is adequate. I have the full Office suite at work, and on home windows computers, so I can always verify that my information can be shared.

 

[JustAnExpat]

You are not wrong, Excel is the better option, but those better option are needed for a low percentage of MS users. I am betting that 90% of MS users are not using more than 5% of its feature set(and they don't know how). On the other, I really hate it when a company has a dominance in a market area. If you are in the enterprise its either MS Office or nothing which bothers me. This way, they own you, you don't own them.

Also, today I learned Excel file can reach a Gigabyte in size, larger than 3D games. I didn't imagine RAM can handle that.



Why not just type in MS Word in the first place?

Word isn't stable, and doesn't break up the documents into sections like I want. Plus, it also doesn't let me keep my files organized in one place, take snapshots of individual sections, remove formatting/ HTML links automatically, and other nice features. With Scrivener, I can:

1. Choose which sections to print out, just by clicking a checkbox.
2. Reformat a section, just by selecting a dropdown list (i.e. reference vs. appendix)
3. Take notes on each section, on the side
4. Keep a collection of documents for reference
5. Allow me to trash sections, and undelete them, if needed.

Wonderful program, if you're doing any type of writing. Of course, it doesn't do tables though :\. And I can't figure out how to get grammar check to check if there's two spaces after a period, and not one.

 

[sgtaylor5]

Wonderful program, if you're doing any type of writing. Of course, it doesn't do tables though :\. And I can't figure out how to get grammar check to check if there's two spaces after a period, and not one.

In Scrivener, can you Find "two spaces" and Replace All "one space"?

 

[Spacetime Anomaly]

I can't figure out how to get grammar check to check if there's two spaces after a period, and not one.

I don't know how to adjust the grammar checker for this (Scrivener uses the OSX default), but to clean up double spaces in Scrivener, you first select the text, then choose: Edit > Text Tidying > Replace Multiple Spaces With Single Spaces.

There are a few other goodies in the Text Tidying menu if you happen to import some text from word processor apps that have added unnecessary page breaks and tabs etc.

 

[blueprint1983]

Libre Office actually feels more like MS Office than MS Office. The only thing you have to learn is where certain editing features are like line-spacing, etc..

It's compatibility with other programs is better than Pages from my experience.