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dennysanders

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Nov 6, 2015
380
153
i hear people talking about others remotely accessing their devices and doing crazy things to them but they never elaborate or give much detail. i assume they're just one of those conspiracy theorists thinking everyone is out to get 'em. but is there really a possible way without jailbreaking a device?
 

I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
31,066
19,935
Gotta be in it to win it
There are no zero day vulnerabilities in ios 9.3 on a 5s or later phone. Doing a quick google search would verify it. That is not to say there aren't means to get into a device. Downloading apps using a questionable profile is one way to install malware on your system. Another way is to try and hide malware from apple in an app on the app store...that has happened in the past and apple has removed the apps.

If you have touchid enabled, specialized equipment can replicate your fingerprint and get into your phone, if IOS deems a password is not required. This can be mitigated, if you are the tin-foil type by turning off touch id and using a strong password.

But essentially at this time IOS is fairly secure as long as your phone is on your person.
 
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M. Gustave

macrumors 68000
Jun 6, 2015
1,856
1,712
Grand Budapest Hotel
a possible way? yes theres usually some possible way, no system is 100% secure & probably never will be

I don't think the OP wanted a philosophical discussion on the general vulnerability of human designed systems. They're specifically asking can someone hack into my phone if I'm not jailbroken, and the answer is no.

For evidence of that, see recent dispute between the US Govt and AAPL.
 
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JT2002TJ

macrumors 65816
Nov 7, 2013
1,270
731
I don't think the OP wanted a philosophical discussion on the general vulnerability of human designed systems. They're specifically asking can someone hack into my phone if I'm not jailbroken, and the answer is no.

For evidence of that, see recent dispute between the US Govt and AAPL.

As much as I will stand behind apple's security. The US Government WAS able to get into that phone... So, it is not really a philosophical discussion, more of a how many people/companies know how to bypass apples security. It is safe to assume the general public doesn't know how to bypass it, but, clearly there are people/companies that can.
 

M. Gustave

macrumors 68000
Jun 6, 2015
1,856
1,712
Grand Budapest Hotel
As much as I will stand behind apple's security. The US Government WAS able to get into that phone... So, it is not really a philosophical discussion, more of a how many people/companies know how to bypass apples security. It is safe to assume the general public doesn't know how to bypass it, but, clearly there are people/companies that can.

If you read about that case it was mentioned many times that it was an older phone (5c) that the Israeli company was able to hack, and that Apple has already closed those exploits in newer phones. And I specifically said 'current phones' in my first response above.
 
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JT2002TJ

macrumors 65816
Nov 7, 2013
1,270
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If you read about that case it was mentioned many times that it was an older phone (5c) that the Israeli company was able to hack, and that Apple has already closed those exploits in newer phones. And I specifically said 'current phones' in my first response above.

Do you honestly think, if that company was able to get in to older phones, that they aren't able to get into newer phones with different exploits? The 5c older iOS was only what they were willing to admit to...

And if there is an Israeli company that was able to hack it, do you honestly think that Chinese or Russian teams/companies haven't been able to access it?
 

M. Gustave

macrumors 68000
Jun 6, 2015
1,856
1,712
Grand Budapest Hotel
Do you honestly think, if that company was able to get in to older phones, that they aren't able to get into newer phones with different exploits?

Do you have any actual evidence that they are? We could play guessing games back and forth all day.

The entire resources of the US "intelligence" community was unable to get into a 5c, so it's conceivable.

And if there is an Israeli company that was able to hack it, do you honestly think that Chinese or Russian teams/companies haven't been able to access it?

The Chinese and Russians have never lead on any technology. They follow and copy.
 

JT2002TJ

macrumors 65816
Nov 7, 2013
1,270
731
The entire resources of the US "intelligence" community was unable to get into a 5c, so it's conceivable.

Mine and many others are of the opinion that the US intelligence community was able to get into the phone, but where using the court case to try to force software companies to build back doors. This was their goal all along, so they didn't have to continue to dedicate resources for future OS'.

The Chinese and Russians have never lead on any technology. They follow and copy.

Chinese and Russians have led the hacking community for some time, because they do not have the same laws like the UK and US. These hackers have the freedom to flex their hacking abilities without fear of prosecution.
 

M. Gustave

macrumors 68000
Jun 6, 2015
1,856
1,712
Grand Budapest Hotel
Mine and many others are of the opinion that the US intelligence community was able to get into the phone, but where using the court case to try to force software companies to build back doors. This was their goal all along, so they didn't have to continue to dedicate resources for future OS'.

An opinion without evidence isn't worth much.
 

JT2002TJ

macrumors 65816
Nov 7, 2013
1,270
731
For 18 years.

There is a great vice documentary that aired on HBO with Snowden you should watch... These phones are a lot more vulnerable than you think. Because you haven't heard of it, doesn't mean there aren't documented cases of hacking.

 

C DM

macrumors Sandy Bridge
Oct 17, 2011
51,388
19,455
Do you have any actual evidence that they are? We could play guessing games back and forth all day.

The entire resources of the US "intelligence" community was unable to get into a 5c, so it's conceivable.



The Chinese and Russians have never lead on any technology. They follow and copy.
It's not like the Russians were the first to get into space or anything like that.
 

I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
31,066
19,935
Gotta be in it to win it
There is a great vice documentary that aired on HBO with Snowden you should watch... These phones are a lot more vulnerable than you think. Because you haven't heard of it, doesn't mean there aren't documented cases of hacking.

There is no debate if the government can seize your phone it's a matter of time; minutes or years.

For most of us, the worry would be for "zero day" vulnerabilities.
 

JT2002TJ

macrumors 65816
Nov 7, 2013
1,270
731
There is no debate if the government can seize your phone it's a matter of time; minutes or years.

For most of us, the worry would be for "zero day" vulnerabilities.

I agree. But the question was "is there really a possible way without jailbreaking a device?", and the answer is "Yes"

M. Gustave seemed to feel, iOS devices were only hacked in that single example of the 5c and that the US government couldn't do it. The video was the proof he was asking for in his 18 years of IT experience...

[doublepost=1469109815][/doublepost]
It's not like the Russians were the first to get into space or anything like that.

LOL...
 

I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
31,066
19,935
Gotta be in it to win it
I agree. But the question was "is there really a possible way without jailbreaking a device?", and the answer is "Yes"...
[doublepost=1469109815][/doublepost]

LOL...
But that is not really the question. Most people know that given the vast resources of the government they can crack anything given enough time. It's the petty stuff that most people would care about. Eg most people know the government can force their way into your house, what they want to do is have enough of a deterrent for the common thief.
 

JT2002TJ

macrumors 65816
Nov 7, 2013
1,270
731
But that is not really the question. Most people know that given the vast resources of the government they can crack anything given enough time. It's the petty stuff that most people would care about. Eg most people know the government can force their way into your house, what they want to do is have enough of a deterrent for the common thief.

In that video they show how non-US government hackers hack a Vice reporters phone while he was in another country following a story. They explain that the exploit affects all phones that connect to a cell tower.
 

Savor

Suspended
Jun 18, 2010
3,742
918
If they told you, then what is the point for them to hack? They became hackers through their computer knowledge and secrecy. You really think posters or self-proclaimed hacker here will tell you the how when they don't even want to reveal you the why? If there are whistleblowers on here, hackers probably have other methods.

Like asking a magician all the steps to their tricks. Keep telling yourselves any system is SAFE. None are. For me, the greatest thing ever that hackers did was make TheFappening. I finally got to see Aly Michalka's nips. Plenty of female celebrity iPhone users enjoy selfie nudes. Better than Snapchat. Don't ask. Just let them exploit.

Thank you, hackers and iCloud!

use-icloud.jpg
 

C DM

macrumors Sandy Bridge
Oct 17, 2011
51,388
19,455
If they told you, then what is the point for them to hack? They became hackers through their computer knowledge and secrecy. You really think posters or self-proclaimed hacker here will tell you the how when they don't even want to reveal you the why? If there are whistleblowers on here, hackers probably have other methods.

Like asking a magician all the steps to their tricks. Keep telling yourselves any system is SAFE. None are. For me, the greatest thing ever that hackers did was make TheFappening. I finally got to see Aly Michalka's nips. Plenty of female celebrity iPhone users enjoy selfie nudes. Better than Snapchat. Don't ask. Just let them exploit.

Thank you, hackers and iCloud!

use-icloud.jpg
Except that wasn't really done through a compromise of a device or a service, just essentially through the use of people's information.
 

I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
31,066
19,935
Gotta be in it to win it
In that video they show how non-US government hackers hack a Vice reporters phone while he was in another country following a story. They explain that the exploit affects all phones that connect to a cell tower.
We're going around in circles. If someone gets physical possession of my phone all bets are off.

While the op made a general statement a reasonable person would infer this is not about the government or any other entity that has physical possession gaining access to my phone, but rather doing it via a zero day vulnerability; while it is on my person.

And I'm excluding wiretapping and sting-Ray towers.
 

JT2002TJ

macrumors 65816
Nov 7, 2013
1,270
731
We're going around in circles. If someone gets physical possession of my phone all bets are off.

While the op made a general statement a reasonable person would infer this is not about the government or any other entity that has physical possession gaining access to my phone, but rather doing it via a zero day vulnerability; while it is on my person.

And I'm excluding wiretapping and sting-Ray towers.

They did not have physical possession of the phone in that video. All they needed was the phone number...
 

JT2002TJ

macrumors 65816
Nov 7, 2013
1,270
731
They did not hack the device though, right?

Through the phone number the were able to intercept messages which gave them the needed information (IMEI, SIM) to access devices camera/microphone/gps. They implied they were able to then access all major phone manufactures, iphone/samsung/... I am going to believe them, and Snowden. My IT experience tells me, anything can be hacked, if it hasn't yet, it is a matter of time. There is a major benefit to hacking current iphones, so hackers work on it. The likelihood of the average person being hacked is slim to none, we simply have nothing a hacker would need.
 
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