How likely is a Quad Core 13" 1H2018?

[BiscottiGelato]

As titled. Would suck if I buy one now and a Quad Core comes out 1H2018! From tests I saw online, Quads are so much faster at compiling it seems!

Late 8GB RAM 2013 13" rMBP here. Haven't moved to High Sierra. Starting to feel the slow down if I have over 3 Xcode projects opened with Spotify and a bunch of Chrome Tabs... I can sit for 2/3 minutes not able to do much and Spotify chopping up if I do a big compile....

 

[Poki]

Very likely. If Intel doesn't mess up again, we should see quad-core 13" MBPs (15W Cannonlake for the nTB, 28W Coffee Lake for the TB model) sometime between march and WWDC.

 

[jerryk]

Just curious, how does memory usage look when this happens? Specifically Memory Pressure.

 

[sublunar]

I wouldn't have thought memory pressure would be affected by number of Cores. If mobile i5 CPUs get more cores they won't have hyper threading. So a nominal Coffee Lake CPU suitable for Macbook Pro with Iris Graphics would get 4 cores but no hyper threading. The current Kaby Lake CPUs have 2 cores with 4 threads.

Both CPUs would have 4 threads but the one with 4 genuine cores would obviously be 'better'.

For what it's worth, I'm expecting a 4 core mobile i5 with Iris Graphics to be one of the last ones to launch by Intel so any refresh would almost certainly be 2Q 2018 - nice timing for Apple as it'd be a year after the Kaby lake refresh.

 

[BiscottiGelato]

Just curious, how does memory usage look when this happens? Specifically Memory Pressure.

If you are asking what I think you are asking. This is 3 small Xcode projects I'm referencing on. 1 medium sized one I'm working on. iPhone 6 simulator running one of the small projects (I run the working project on an actual phone). Spotify, Slack, GitKraken, Chrome with about 10 Tabs.

 

[jerryk]

I wouldn't have thought memory pressure would be affected by number of Cores. If mobile i5 CPUs get more cores they won't have hyper threading. So a nominal Coffee Lake CPU suitable for Macbook Pro with Iris Graphics would get 4 cores but no hyper threading. The current Kaby Lake CPUs have 2 cores with 4 threads.

Both CPUs would have 4 threads but the one with 4 genuine cores would obviously be 'better'.

For what it's worth, I'm expecting a 4 core mobile i5 with Iris Graphics to be one of the last ones to launch by Intel so any refresh would almost certainly be 2Q 2018 - nice timing for Apple as it'd be a year after the Kaby lake refresh.

I was more asking because of your workload. 3 Xcode sessions, Spotify streaming, and a bunch of Chrome tabs may be a bit much for a 13" MBP with 8 GB. Just curious to see if your system is doing a lot of compressing and faulting of memory.

 

[sublunar]

If you are asking what I think you are asking. This is 3 small Xcode projects I'm referencing on. 1 medium sized one I'm working on. iPhone 6 simulator running one of the small projects (I run the working project on an actual phone). Spotify, Slack, GitKraken, Chrome with about 10 Tabs.

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Definitely consider 16Gb of RAM then if there's Xcode involved. Obviously extra cores will come in handy too but I don't think extra RAM would clear up issues with 'big pauses' as much as extra cores would.

 

[BiscottiGelato]

Definitely consider 16Gb of RAM then if there's Xcode involved. Obviously extra cores will come in handy too but I don't think extra RAM would clear up issues with 'big pauses' as much as extra cores would.

I guess I will wait and hope for a Quad then. I dun wanna spend 2k+ and not really feel a huge performance difference...

 

[Poki]

If mobile i5 CPUs get more cores they won't have hyper threading.

Why not? Even the cheapest 8th gen i5 mobile chip offers hyper threading, they have no reason to take that feature away from the more powerful chips. You‘re probably referencing the desktop chips, where hyperthreading is used to differentiate between cheaper and more expensive chips. But since the mobile CPUs are already more expensive, Intel diesn‘t use that strategy here.

 

[jerryk]

I guess I will wait and hope for a Quad then. I dun wanna spend 2k+ and not really feel a huge performance difference...

I am waiting to see if a 6 core 15" appears next year. Also, to see if they update the keyboard even more so it has a bit more travel and is less sensitive to dirt and dust.

 

[Samuelsan2001]

Only intel knows the answer...

 

[andy9l]

Why not? Even the cheapest 8th gen i5 mobile chip offers hyper threading, they have no reason to take that feature away from the more powerful chips. You‘re probably referencing the desktop chips, where hyperthreading is used to differentiate between cheaper and more expensive chips. But since the mobile CPUs are already more expensive, Intel diesn‘t use that strategy here.

True, but Intel need a way to up-sell the mobile i7. Right now there’s little-to-no benefit over the i5. In fact, they are literally the same chip slightly ‘overclocked’. They just came out of manufacturing in slightly better nick than the i5 ones.

Admittedly, not many people do their research to uncover that - but as you say, this differentiation seems to work for desktop CPUs.

I wouldn’t be surprised if in April ‘18 we saw:

1. QC i5 no HT ~10-15% faster than current gen
2. QC i7 with HT ~20-25% faster than current gen

Both with higher turbo speeds due to improved thermal efficiencies.

But then again, I might be being too simple - perhaps HT is important on mobile CPUs and it’ll stay on both i5 and i7.

 

[Poki]

True, but Intel need a way to up-sell the mobile i7. Right now there’s little-to-no benefit over the i5. In fact, they are literally the same chip slightly ‘overclocked’. They just came out of manufacturing in slightly better nick than the i5 ones.

Admittedly, not many people do their research to uncover that - but as you say, this differentiation seems to work for desktop CPUs.

I wouldn’t be surprised if in April ‘18 we saw:

1. QC i5 no HT ~10-15% faster than current gen
2. QC i7 with HT ~20-25% faster than current gen

I can't see that happening. Offering a 15W 8th gen quad-core i5 with hyper threading, but dropping that feature on a 28W chip so that the higher TDP chip might even have worse multicore performance? Also, the desktop i5 CPUs by now have six physical cores, as opposed to four on the mobile ones, making hyper threading less of a necessity for desktop CPUs. Let's not forget that AMD is getting closer as well, with an offensive looking line-up of notebook CPUs scheduled for spring 2018. Intel simply can't afford to lose ground there.

As for differentiation - I think the "small" performance gain is sufficient. Gaining 5 - 15% performance is certainly worth the premium for some users. It's not like i7 means anything either, remember that even 5W dual core Core M chips are now labeled as "Core i7".

 

[andy9l]

I can't see that happening. Offering a 15W 8th gen quad-core i5 with hyper threading, but dropping that feature on a 28W chip so that the higher TDP chip might even have worse multicore performance?

Done a bit more Googling - HT available on both i5 and i7!