How many more years does non-retina MBP have?

[A Hebrew]

Just a general curiosity:

How many more updates do you think the non-retina MBP has before it's life is over? I know some think it doesn't have a future and that the somewhat recent update was its last. Does anyone have reasoning to support or negate that claim?

I am extremely interested because I prefer upgrading laptops myself to what I want for a much cheaper price.


Thanks.

 

[175170]

The retina Macbook Pro is called the next generation MacBook Pro. By next generation, it'll be the only 15" MacBook Pro available.

 

[miles01110]

Probably not more than one more refresh.

 

[dallas112678]

Just a general curiosity:

How many more updates do you think the non-retina MBP has before it's life is over? I know some think it doesn't have a future and that the somewhat recent update was its last. Does anyone have reasoning to support or negate that claim?

I am extremely interested because I prefer upgrading laptops myself to what I want for a much cheaper price.


Thanks.

This is more likely the final year for the non-retina. After all, they called the retina the "next-generation macbook pro".

Also, before these were officially announced, this entire setup with the cMBP and the newer retina was reported before hand. That same source said that the retina would replace the classic by the next release. If that report was right about the two lines then I would also think there is a good chance it would be right about the replacement of the non-retina completely.

 

[Queen6]

End of line now, unless the Retina does not meet Apple`s expectation on sales, which is looking unlikely at present.

 

[ixodes]

Based on my experience & the direction Apple seems to be headed, I'd say if anyone wants a conventional, user upgradeable MBP, you'd better get it now. Apples testing the waters by offering a choice & sadly they're winning big.

Don't get me wrong, I like Apples products a lot, but you've got to be vigilant & aware. They've just successfully moved nearly everyone up market into expensive (especially given the current market) MBP's by doing what Apple does best. Creating a heck of a lot of buzz... This time it's around retina, then going in for the kill.

Is retina nice... Absolutely! Is it essential? Hardly.

Go back to this time in 2010 & 2011 and you'll find most everyone that bought the newly refreshed MBP's just as satisfied as ever.

Apple is _built_on clever product names, and brilliant smoke & mirrors marketing. Combine that, with an insatiable cult like following & it's no surprise that Apples cash reserves make big oil jealous.

 

[thekev]

Also, before these were officially announced, this entire setup with the cMBP and the newer retina was reported before hand. That same source said that the retina would replace the classic by the next release. If that report was right about the two lines then I would also think there is a good chance it would be right about the replacement of the non-retina completely.

That isn't really much of an absolute. If sales fall off a cliff for some reason after the initial surge, they will rethink elements of it. The things that I expect to remain no matter what are the display type and the extra thunderbolt port. I also think this is a better design for the 13" than the tapered air design. You can get much more out of it without the tapering.

Is retina nice... Absolutely! Is it essential? Hardly.

Go back to this time in 2010 & 2011 and you'll find most everyone that bought the newly refreshed MBP's just as satisfied as ever.

Apple is _built_on clever product names, and brilliant smoke & mirrors marketing. Combine that, with an insatiable cult like following & it's no surprise that Apples cash reserves make big oil jealous.

2011 finally brought in quad cpus. That made a huge difference in terms of performance at the notebook level. Gpus are still a major sticking point in relative terms. The update to an IPS panel is actually my favorite part of it. It improves viewing angles considerably for better overall visual consistency.

 

[nuckinfutz]

Apple can't kill the cMBP soon enough.

Since only the RAM & HDD are upgradable it doesn't necessarily add much value over a Retina.

 

[sweetbrat]

Apple can't kill the cMBP soon enough.

Since only the RAM & HDD are upgradable it doesn't necessarily add much value over a Retina.

The value it adds is largely dependent on what the user is looking to do with it. While it may not be worth it to you, it still is to a lot of people. You don't define value for everyone, just yourself.

I'd say there will be possibly one more refresh, then it will be gone.

 

[sireShonBohn]

Is retina nice... Absolutely! Is it essential? Hardly.

....it's no surprise that Apples cash reserves make big oil jealous.

What a troll statement.

How are Apples cash reserves any indication of the lifespan of the non-retina MBP? I do believe that is the subject of this thread. Perhaps you should start a thread entitled "Why Apple's cash reserves make me cry when I look in the mirror."

Of course Retina is the future and therefore "necessary" in as much as anything beyond food, water, & shelter is necessary.

You're an embarrassment to trolling BTW, you should learn better.

 

[Interstella5555]

Apple can't kill the cMBP soon enough.

Since only the RAM & HDD are upgradable it doesn't necessarily add much value over a Retina.

I love that we've reached a point where tech is automatically obsolete and unusable the minute something new comes out. Guess I should just trash my 6 month old MBP, clearly it won't work now that the Retinas are out.

 

[Marui]

i am about to buy my first MBP 13' 2012

but after seeing this thread, i have a second thought...

...

should i wait for the next refresh?

do you think the price of new rMBP 13' will be a lot higher?

(it's not like iPhone right? same price, new spec?)

 

[edk99]

i am about to buy my first MBP 13' 2012

but after seeing this thread, i have a second thought...

...

should i wait for the next refresh?

do you think the price of new rMBP 13' will be a lot higher?

(it's not like iPhone right? same price, new spec?)

The base 13" rMBP will be higher then the base 13" cMBP. That is a given because it would likely have 8gb RAM and a 256 SSD drive. To give you a ball park number just add 8gb of RAM and a 256gb SSD to the current 13" base MBP and you get $1799. I would wager to bet the price will be around that number. Maybe $1699. We won't know for a few months.

I think we just saw the last refresh for the cMBP.

 

[NewbieCanada]

I love that we've reached a point where tech is automatically obsolete and unusable the minute something new comes out. Guess I should just trash my 6 month old MBP, clearly it won't work now that the Retinas are out.

You should get, depending on your needs and how software evolves, several years of use out of your cMBP.

You shouldn't, however, expect to ever be able to buy another one.

 

[Eallan]

Based on my experience & the direction Apple seems to be headed, I'd say if anyone wants a conventional, user upgradeable MBP, you'd better get it now. Apples testing the waters by offering a choice & sadly they're winning big.

Don't get me wrong, I like Apples products a lot, but you've got to be vigilant & aware. They've just successfully moved nearly everyone up market into expensive (especially given the current market) MBP's by doing what Apple does best. Creating a heck of a lot of buzz... This time it's around retina, then going in for the kill.

Is retina nice... Absolutely! Is it essential? Hardly.

Go back to this time in 2010 & 2011 and you'll find most everyone that bought the newly refreshed MBP's just as satisfied as ever.

Apple is _built_on clever product names, and brilliant smoke & mirrors marketing. Combine that, with an insatiable cult like following & it's no surprise that Apples cash reserves make big oil jealous.

This is just so condescending and ridiculous. Could it simply be that to most people, myself included, the rMBP is a much better computer?

Yeah, I think that's it. They're not brainwashing anyone, they're not doing any smoke and mirrors, it's a thin, powerful laptop with a brilliant display. That's it.

 

[arashb]

Well, for 15" in 2011 I payed extra for my 1680x1050 resolution screen, and there has always been 1920x1200 resolution screens as well.

I'm saying this because even though there are higher resolution screens out there, 1440x900 remained the standard resolution for the 15". And the fact that they just released non-retina MBPs means they're going to support it for a few more years.

And I think user upgradeability will still be around, Apple has always supported hard disk upgrades and ram upgrades. They even have official how-tos. Also they were quick to undo the removal of EPEAT, which there's no way in hell the retina MBP is getting.

i am about to buy my first MBP 13' 2012

but after seeing this thread, i have a second thought...

...

should i wait for the next refresh?

do you think the price of new rMBP 13' will be a lot higher?

(it's not like iPhone right? same price, new spec?)

If your budget stops at a 13" MBP then just purchase it now. If you can wait long enough then go ahead and wait for the next MBP to come out. There will still be a classic MBP for ~1100 but it will be upgraded. But then again why stop there? keep waiting until a newer and better one comes out for the same price.

Point is, if you need it now buy it now. If you don't need it yet then wait because for computers there will always be a better one later for the amount you're trying to spend now. But never listen to rumors, ESPECIALLY about Apple products and don't ever listen to forum members about speculations on Apple products. Grab some popcorn and find someones previous posts and look at all their posts saying what Apple will do next. It'll be fun, I promise :]

 

[sofianito]

This is just so condescending and ridiculous. Could it simply be that to most people, myself included, the rMBP is a much better computer?

Yeah, I think that's it. They're not brainwashing anyone, they're not doing any smoke and mirrors, it's a thin, powerful laptop with a brilliant display. That's it.

Are you willing to pay $3000 for a new laptop every 3 years systematically (AC warranty expiration)? Most of mortal would not. Do you think you can resell your non upgradable laptop easily after three years?

 

[Marui]

The base 13" rMBP will be higher then the base 13" cMBP. That is a given because it would likely have 8gb RAM and a 256 SSD drive. To give you a ball park number just add 8gb of RAM and a 256gb SSD to the current 13" base MBP and you get $1799. I would wager to bet the price will be around that number. Maybe $1699. We won't know for a few months.

I think we just saw the last refresh for the cMBP.

thanks for the reply.

so basically, *IF* it's true that last month's refresh is the final line of cMBP, the cheapest MBP (13" base) would be more than $1600 right?

i guess i'll just buy this cMBP 13" 2012 then :\

 

[NewbieCanada]

I'm saying this because even though there are higher resolution screens out there, 1440x900 remained the standard resolution for the 15". And the fact that they just released non-retina MBPs means they're going to support it for a few more years.

Support, sure.

Update six laptop models indefinitely? Absolutely not.

----------

thanks for the reply.

so basically, *IF* it's true that last month's refresh is the final line of cMBP, the cheapest MBP (13" base) would be more than $1600 right?

i guess i'll just buy this cMBP 13" 2012 then :\

Just like the MacBook Air was introduced at a premium price and is now at the low end of the line-up, rMBPs will, within a year or two, cost the same or less than current cMBPs

 

[arashb]

Support, sure.

Update six laptop models indefinitely? Absolutely not.

Well obviously they won't update them indefinitely. The beauty of OS X is that the operating system is tailored specifically to certain Mac configurations. But then again they can only support these for so long, then you install ubuntu and be happy again.

But 2012 MBPs are definitely going to be in on the next two OS updates, assuming it'll be a year each.

 

[NewbieCanada]

But 2012 MBPs are definitely going to be in on the next two OS updates, assuming it'll be a year each.

No question - but I think the thrust of the thread is how long will they continue to be sold and updated, not supported by the OS.

 

[arashb]

No question - but I think the thrust of the thread is how long will they continue to be sold and updated, not supported by the OS.

Ah, by update I thought the OP meant software wise.

But I still think hardware wise it will continue to be updated until that resolution can easily be supported financially, physically and easily by the gpu.

Because usually MBPs come slightly underclocked on the GPUs right? Or was that just an old tactic? There has always been an entry level Macbook that people could buy and it costs 17" MBPs $200 just to upgrade do the hi-def display of 1920x1200, so I think it'll still take some time. Especially for a retina 13", that's going to be a lot more of a price jump between 13" classics and 13" retina.

Only reason why we got out iPhone 4s for so cheap when it was released is because we get it under contract, out of contract it's over $600.

 

[pgiguere1]

I think they will do it when costs of SSD and Retina Display becomes low enough to have the 15" rMBP at $1999 like when the cMBP was introduced. I think the main reason they didn't remove the cMBP is the price of the rMBP, and the fact that it's even more expensive if you want a lot of storage, which the cMBP provides.

Sure, there's also the fact that some people complain about soldered RAM, no anti-glare option and the lack of an optical drive and ethernet port, but those same people will still be complaining next year anyway, so I don't think it's a factor as important as price.

No doubt that if they introduce a 13" rMBP, it will cost significantly more than the 13" cMBP, but however I expect it to stay more expensive so that it stands apart from the 13" MBA. I expect it to have 8GB standard and probably 256GB SSD.

My expectations:

2013 lineup:

MBAs keep their current design and displays, 4GB RAM, storage capacity bump or price drop depending on models.

13" rMBP : 1599$. Dual or quad-core (35W TDP) Core i7, 256GB SSD, 8GB RAM, integrated graphics
13" rMBP : 1899$. Faster dual or quad-core (35W TDP) Core i7, 512GB SSD, 8GB RAM, integrated graphics

15" rMBP : 1999$. Quad-core (45W TDP) Core i7, 256GB SSD, 8GB RAM, new discrete graphics
15" rMBP : 2399$. Faster Quad-core (45W TDP) Core i7, 512GB SSD, 8GB RAM, new discrete graphics

2014 lineup:

Same products and prices but with double the storage capacity and obviously with newer CPU/GPUs.

 

[arashb]

I think they will do it when costs of SSD and Retina Display becomes low enough to have the 15" rMBP at $1999 like when the cMBP was introduced. I think the main reason they didn't remove the cMBP is the price of the rMBP, and the fact that it's even more expensive if you want a lot of storage, which the cMBP provides.

Sure, there's also the fact that some people complain about soldered RAM, no anti-glare option and the lack of an optical drive and ethernet port, but those same people will still be complaining next year anyway, so I don't think it's a factor as important as price.

No doubt that if they introduce a 13" rMBP, it will cost significantly more than the 13" cMBP, but however I expect it to stay more expensive so that it stands apart from the 13" MBA. I expect it to have 8GB standard and probably 256GB SSD.

My expectations:

2013 lineup:

13" rMBP : 1599$. Dual or quad-core (35W TDP) Core i7, 256GB SSD, 8GB RAM, integrated graphics
13" rMBP : 1899$. Faster dual or quad-core (35W TDP) Core i7, 512GB SSD, 8GB RAM, integrated graphics

15" rMBP : 1999$. Quad-core (45W TDP) Core i7, 256GB SSD, 8GB RAM, new discrete graphics
15" rMBP : 2399$. Faster Quad-core (45W TDP) Core i7, 512GB SSD, 8GB RAM, new discrete graphics

And I expect the 2014 lineup to have the same prices but with double the storage capacity and obviously with newer CPU/GPUs.

So you're assuming all will be retina + i7 and on top of it all you're saying that 2880x1800 can run off of integrated graphics?

 

[NewbieCanada]

So you're assuming all will be retina + i7 and on top of it all you're saying that 2880x1800 can run off of integrated graphics?

It runs off it today. The rMBP has integrated and retina.