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Populus

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This is the off topic subforum, right? I hope I’m posting it in the right place.

No, I’m not going to share pictures of my rooms because they are embarrassing. And no, this isn’t just about cable or external drives management… this is actual physical clutter build over many, many years, and the difficulty I have when it comes to throw things to the bin. I have this “reuse everything” mentality and, because almost anything can be useful down the road, I have too many objects in drawers, onto the tables (piles of card boxes and papers and med boxes, and other objects).

I know it is difficult you can help this fellow MR member out easily, but I’m gonna try to describe some of the objects that are within my eyesight that I genuinely don’t know either to throw to the trash, or save it in a place… but I’m running out of places to keep the things. And I have 3 entire rooms full of things. Mind you, it is not “trash”, but rather things that fall in one of this categories:

A) They have an emotional value (toys and books from my early days).

B) They could be useful down the road (screws, cables and devices’ boxes).

C) Clothes.

D) Books.

I decided to post here because I suspect there might be other fellow members that carry the same burden of being a “chaotic genius”, or just are a mess. The thing is, this is the best way to find things! Almost everything I need, I know where it is! And the other problem is that, no matter how I discard objects and try to put order in my room, after just a couple of weeks it just gets back to the previous high entropy state.

A list of some of the things that I don’t know what to do about… either throw them away, or put them in a closet, or just keep them at hand.

Papers: Lots and lots of papers. Some are medical, some are legal, some are just from the grocery store with the week deals, some are important, others remind me of that date or that cinema I had with significant people, or that restaurant that no longer exist…

Hard drives: The problem with the external drives is that… I’ve lost some of them. Yes, that’s the level of clutter. I have some of them, I try to put them in the same drawer, but they get spread with the use… I feel like fighting against myself.

Clothes: Two categories, again. 2) Clean clothes that are folded waiting to be put on a closet, but currently there’s no place for them, and 2) dirty clothes that are waiting for the washing machine. I guess number 2 has a relatively easy solution: have a dirty clothes bin or throw them into the washing machine. But some clothes aren’t suitable for a washing machine so… IDK.

Books: There are two categories in here, 1) Books I keep for nostalgia or because I may read them some day, if there’s an apocalypse and the internet closes… and 2) Books I really use for my studies, or books I like to read every now and then. The first category takes the 80% of the books I have, and they are in a piece of furniture that is breaking slowly and I’d like to throw or replace, but there are too many objects there.

Boxes: This one is a big category. I have many, many boxes and they, again, fall in two distinct categories: 1) Amazon boxes I save in case I have to make a return of an item, so I don’t have to purchase one to send the item, and 2) Product boxes I keep in case I need them for warranty. See, I live in Europe, in my country we have 3 years of warranty by our consumers law, and I always think “what If I’m required to send the product on its original box”? That way, boxes have slowly taken up 30 to 40% of the space of my closets and tables… Then, there are the useful boxes, the shoe boxes I use to put the shoes I am not currently using. But too many boxes, honestly.

Toys and board games: This category has been bothering me less because I put most of them into card boxes, and this boxes have been in the same place for 15 years, taking up space of my shelves… I don’t feel like throwing them away, but maybe I should throw some of them? I don’t know, my infancy is tied to those.

Random objects: Two categories, some of them I use them regularly, others every once in a while, and others are there just in case. This includes: screws of all sizes and shapes, tools to fix things in my home, fragrances, binoculars, a CD archiver with CDs and DVDs (I no longer have a disk drive lol), a music box with a lot of sentiments inside, the drill and other tools, a suitcase that I have always open just in case I have to go somewhere (and only use it every once in a while, but there’s just no room on my closets), some old electronic equipment to communicate through radio waves with its giant power source from the 80s, a box with all my meds, because they no longer fit in the medicine cabinet, some paintings with a frame that I’m not sure I’ll put again in the walls but have an emotional charge… I could go on and on.

The problem is that, in order to have everything in a tidy way, I would have to empty all the closets, throw away half the things, and organize them inside again, and then do the same for the things that are outside the closet, throw away half of it, and the remaining put it on the closet because now there would be space again.

It’s nearly 30 years worth of objects, of a lifetime, and I feel like I am no longer able to control the beast, it has gotten so out of hands, the chaos has spread over several rooms, that I really don’t know how to solve it. Each object, each paper, each box that I hold in my hands, keeps me wondering for 10 or 20 minutes wether I should keep it or not. And that makes it eternal…

Any kind of advice will be welcome, as long as it comes with respect.

Thank you.
 
This is the off topic subforum, right? I hope I’m posting it in the right place.

No, I’m not going to share pictures of my rooms because they are embarrassing. And no, this isn’t just about cable or external drives management… this is actual physical clutter build over many, many years, and the difficulty I have when it comes to throw things to the bin. I have this “reuse everything” mentality and, because almost anything can be useful down the road, I have too many objects in drawers, onto the tables (piles of card boxes and papers and med boxes, and other objects).

I know it is difficult you can help this fellow MR member out easily, but I’m gonna try to describe some of the objects that are within my eyesight that I genuinely don’t know either to throw to the trash, or save it in a place… but I’m running out of places to keep the things. And I have 3 entire rooms full of things. Mind you, it is not “trash”, but rather things that fall in one of this categories:

A) They have an emotional value (toys and books from my early days).

B) They could be useful down the road (screws, cables and devices’ boxes).

C) Clothes.

D) Books.

I decided to post here because I suspect there might be other fellow members that carry the same burden of being a “chaotic genius”, or just are a mess. The thing is, this is the best way to find things! Almost everything I need, I know where it is! And the other problem is that, no matter how I discard objects and try to put order in my room, after just a couple of weeks it just gets back to the previous high entropy state.

A list of some of the things that I don’t know what to do about… either throw them away, or put them in a closet, or just keep them at hand.

Papers: Lots and lots of papers. Some are medical, some are legal, some are just from the grocery store with the week deals, some are important, others remind me of that date or that cinema I had with significant people, or that restaurant that no longer exist…

Hard drives: The problem with the external drives is that… I’ve lost some of them. Yes, that’s the level of clutter. I have some of them, I try to put them in the same drawer, but they get spread with the use… I feel like fighting against myself.

Clothes: Two categories, again. 2) Clean clothes that are folded waiting to be put on a closet, but currently there’s no place for them, and 2) dirty clothes that are waiting for the washing machine. I guess number 2 has a relatively easy solution: have a dirty clothes bin or throw them into the washing machine. But some clothes aren’t suitable for a washing machine so… IDK.

Books: There are two categories in here, 1) Books I keep for nostalgia or because I may read them some day, if there’s an apocalypse and the internet closes… and 2) Books I really use for my studies, or books I like to read every now and then. The first category takes the 80% of the books I have, and they are in a piece of furniture that is breaking slowly and I’d like to throw or replace, but there are too many objects there.

Boxes: This one is a big category. I have many, many boxes and they, again, fall in two distinct categories: 1) Amazon boxes I save in case I have to make a return of an item, so I don’t have to purchase one to send the item, and 2) Product boxes I keep in case I need them for warranty. See, I live in Europe, in my country we have 3 years of warranty by our consumers law, and I always think “what If I’m required to send the product on its original box”? That way, boxes have slowly taken up 30 to 40% of the space of my closets and tables… Then, there are the useful boxes, the shoe boxes I use to put the shoes I am not currently using. But too many boxes, honestly.

Toys and board games: This category has been bothering me less because I put most of them into card boxes, and this boxes have been in the same place for 15 years, taking up space of my shelves… I don’t feel like throwing them away, but maybe I should throw some of them? I don’t know, my infancy is tied to those.

Random objects: Two categories, some of them I use them regularly, others every once in a while, and others are there just in case. This includes: screws of all sizes and shapes, tools to fix things in my home, fragrances, binoculars, a CD archiver with CDs and DVDs (I no longer have a disk drive lol), a music box with a lot of sentiments inside, the drill and other tools, a suitcase that I have always open just in case I have to go somewhere (and only use it every once in a while, but there’s just no room on my closets), some old electronic equipment to communicate through radio waves with its giant power source from the 80s, a box with all my meds, because they no longer fit in the medicine cabinet, some paintings with a frame that I’m not sure I’ll put again in the walls but have an emotional charge… I could go on and on.

The problem is that, in order to have everything in a tidy way, I would have to empty all the closets, throw away half the things, and organize them inside again, and then do the same for the things that are outside the closet, throw away half of it, and the remaining put it on the closet because now there would be space again.

It’s nearly 30 years worth of objects, of a lifetime, and I feel like I am no longer able to control the beast, it has gotten so out of hands, the chaos has spread over several rooms, that I really don’t know how to solve it. Each object, each paper, each box that I hold in my hands, keeps me wondering for 10 or 20 minutes wether I should keep it or not. And that makes it eternal…

Any kind of advice will be welcome, as long as it comes with respect.

Thank you.
So We all have issues with clutter. But here is my take on your predicament.

Papers Easiest solution. Bin what you don't need, scan what you want to keep, file what you want to keep hard copies of. Then as more 'paper' comes in be ruthless and follow the bin/scan/file rules.

Hard drives. So how many TB are we talking? Personally I keep all my files on my internal Mac mini drive, backed up on my TimeMachine drive with an offsite copy in my desk drawer at work. How many copies do you need?

Clothes I can't really relate to this one. I'm either wearing my clothes or they are in the wash bin or they are in the closet. I'm not much of a clothes holder. I'm wearing a fleece right now that is probably 20+ years old.

Books Get a book shelf. When it's full, any book you want to keep after it's been read swap out one from the bookshelf to make space for it.

Boxes Keep a few flat packed and bin the rest. If you need to return something you do not have to return it in its original packaging. That is not how warranties work. You just have to get it back safely. You are going to do more purchases than returns, so you will easily accumulate more boxes as time goes on. Again stick them in the recycling bin.

Toys and Board games Apart from some Things that we keep in the loft from when our daughter was with us we don't have any. I'm not really looking to recapture my childhood with toys.

Random objects Again you need to evaluate and be ruthless. If you no longer have a CD player no point in keeping a CD burner. Donate to goodwill or the tip.


If you sort out the things you don't need, you will have a better living space and space for things that you want to buy in the future. The trick is to be ruthless and try to minimise the "I'll keep it just in case" when you know that scenario will never arise.

Hope that helps!
 
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So We all have issues with clutter. But here is my take on your predicament.

Papers Easiest solution. Bin what you don't need, scan what you want to keep, file what you want to keep hard copies of. Then as more 'paper' comes in be ruthless and follow the bin/scan/file rules.

Hard drives. So how many TB are we talking? Personally I keep all my files on my internal Mac mini drive, backed up on my TimeMachine drive with an offsite copy in my desk drawer at work. How many copies do you need?

Clothes I can't really relate to this one. I'm either wearing my clothes or they are in the wash bin or they are in the closet. I'm not much of a clothes holder. I'm wearing a fleece right now that is probably 20+ years old.

Books Get a book shelf. When it's full, any book you want to keep after it's been read swap out one from the bookshelf to make space for it.

Boxes Keep a few flat packed and bin the rest. If you need to return something you do not have to return it in its original packaging. That is not how warranties work. You just have to get it back safely. You are going to do more purchases than returns, so you will easily accumulate more boxes as time goes on. Again stick them in the recycling bin.

Toys and Board games Apart from some Things that we keep in the loft from when our daughter was with us we don't have any. I'm not really looking to recapture my childhood with toys.

Random objects Again you need to evaluate and be ruthless. If you no longer have a CD player no point in keeping a CD burner. Donate to goodwill or the tip.


If you sort out the things you don't need, you will have a better living space and space for things that you want to buy in the future. The trick is to be ruthless and try to minimise the "I'll keep it just in case" when you know that scenario will never arise.

Hope that helps!

Many thanks for your tips!

Regarding hard drives, I have 4 small SSDs (like the Samsung T5 or T7), those are fast and I have them at reach. However, I have like 4 or 5 drives, they are 2,5” 1TB Hard Drives, and from those, I only have one in a known place. I guess that the others will surface as the clutter diminishes… However, those HHD are only for long term backups, and rarely used.

By the way, even though most of my cables are now in three different drawers, my plan is to put all hard drives, and all cables (USB, video/audio, power…) all in one single drawer. The problem comes with the use: as I need one, I grab it, and afterwards it is left on the table… and the cable clutter grows again.
 
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Books - I used to have the same problem, but I really leaned into our public library and their digital library system. I kept some of my favorites and some of the books I reread frequently. But a lot of my favorites are at the Library. I might have to wait for them to come around, but it forces me to find a new favorite in the meantime. I even got heavy handed getting rid of my work reference collection. Fortunately, we have a library at work where some of the better tomes found a home!

I woodwork in a very small shop, so I get it. I have scraps everywhere! Broken tools that I was sure I could fix. Projects that I will get around to (eventually). But I had to come to the reality that I needed to make room for things I could actually use and projects that were right in front of me. So again I had to get ruthless and real.
 
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Papers; set up a well-lit comfortable scene where you can use an iphone to photograph each paper. Souldn't take more than a few sec/paper. (You might even have a scanner/printer with the ability to scan stuff automatically). Open the files on a mac and use Preview or another app capable of optical character recognition to convert them into simple text files, maybe find a way to automate the process. Then maybe some AI app can help you categorize and sort into folders.

End result: searchable text files.

Just a thought. I've been planning to do this myself for a long time.
 
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This is more general, a way of thinking advice, but maybe it's useful!

One end goal you can aim for is to have a place for everything to 'rest' once you're done using it. You have to be ruthless to reach that goal, though. If something doesn't have a place to 'rest', either you need more appropriate storage space, have to get rid of the thing, or have to get rid of something else to make room for it.

For example: you bought a three-person couch. It's not supposed to become a one-person couch over time, otherwise you could have just bought a comfy chair.

The floor, counters and tabletops are also not the proper resting place for most stuff. A good way to think about desk surfaces is to aim for 80% empty without precarious stacking. 60% for floors. It's not the exact percentages that are important, though - it's the idea that more than half of floorspace and an overwhelming majority of working surfaces should be free when not being actively used for something.

For example: clean plates rest in the cupboard. If there's no space in the cupboard they sit in the dishwasher. If the dishwasher is full dirty dishes start piling up in the sink. If the sink is full you can't wash your dirty pots and pans so you leave them on the stove "for now". In the end the inertia you'd need to overcome to make proper, nutritious food becomes too much, so you eat out or order in not because it's an occasion, but because of the friction.

You might be good with plates and the dishwasher and the sink. But apply the same logic to something you're struggling with and you'll trace a path to the root cause of the issue. Solve that root issue, and the next step in the chain becomes easier to solve.
 
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This is more general, a way of thinking advice, but maybe it's useful!

One end goal you can aim for is to have a place for everything to 'rest' once you're done using it. You have to be ruthless to reach that goal, though. If something doesn't have a place to 'rest', either you need more appropriate storage space, have to get rid of the thing, or have to get rid of something else to make room for it.

For example: you bought a three-person couch. It's not supposed to become a one-person couch over time, otherwise you could have just bought a comfy chair.

The floor, counters and tabletops are also not the proper resting place for most stuff. A good way to think about desk surfaces is to aim for 80% empty without precarious stacking. 60% for floors. It's not the exact percentages that are important, though - it's the idea that more than half of floorspace and an overwhelming majority of working surfaces should be free when not being actively used for something.

For example: clean plates rest in the cupboard. If there's no space in the cupboard they sit in the dishwasher. If the dishwasher is full dirty dishes start piling up in the sink. If the sink is full you can't wash your dirty pots and pans so you leave them on the stove "for now". In the end the inertia you'd need to overcome to make proper, nutritious food becomes too much, so you eat out or order in not because it's an occasion, but because of the friction.

You might be good with plates and the dishwasher and the sink. But apply the same logic to something you're struggling with and you'll trace a path to the root cause of the issue. Solve that root issue, and the next step in the chain becomes easier to solve.
Thank you for your elaborated reasoning, I’ll try to extrapolate the plates analogy to the things in my room (papers, books, shoe boxes, screw jars, etc).

And look for proper places for objects to rest that aren’t the visible/reachable surfaces.
 
Papers; set up a well-lit comfortable scene where you can use an iphone to photograph each paper. Souldn't take more than a few sec/paper. (You might even have a scanner/printer with the ability to scan stuff automatically). Open the files on a mac and use Preview or another app capable of optical character recognition to convert them into simple text files, maybe find a way to automate the process. Then maybe some AI app can help you categorize and sort into folders.

End result: searchable text files.

Just a thought. I've been planning to do this myself for a long time.
This is a good idea and, in the past, I’ve done it with some papers. Just the photo/scanning thing, not the OCR. For some reason OCR never works well for me, although maybe now with Apple’s machine learning this has improved…

But before doing that, I think I’ll just save the important documents on a plastic folder I have with several pockets (categories).
 
I think… one word I’d like to use to emphasize how I feel when I try to start organizing is… overwhelming. I feel so overwhelmed when I face the disorder with so many different things, different categories, different importance… that it’s a bit difficult to focus. And then, there’s the difficulty to throw away like 30 or 40% of the things to make room.
 
Check out macmost's video:

I use it all the time; take a screenshot and copy the text in the image.
Automating it... well I I haven't gotten that far yet.
 
Papers: Lots and lots of papers.

Don’t evaluate each one. Just scan or photograph them, dump the files in an album in Photos where you can search for text if you ever need to, and get rid of the originals.


Boxes: This one is a big category.


See, I live in Europe, in my country we have 3 years of warranty by our consumers law, and I always think “what If I’m required to send the product on its original box”?

This one is easy. You are not required to keep the original packaging, so don’t.

Keep good boxes of different sizes that fit inside each other, so you only store ”one” box. Get rid of the rest!
 
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My two car garage was so cluttered at one point we couldn’t even park our cars in it. So each day over a year period I would take one item and throw away. The rules I would follow to get me going, if I haven’t used in the last 2 years no need to keep, and if it’s under $10 it can be easily repurchased if I need it again.

As my uncles says. You cannot be buried with your belongings.
 
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Well, you can be buried with your belongings, but it won't do anyone any good! 😉

There are so many of our neighbors who park their cars on the driveway because they can't fit them in the garage. We park two cars in the garage, and always make sure we're able to do that. We don't have a lot of clutter, but my better half is always wanting to pare down our "stuff" so our sons have less to deal with when we depart. And no, we won't be buried with any of that stuff.

One easy rule is that if you're saving multiple duplicates of something, throw out all but one. That will make it easier to determine if any of those things have become obsolete, and then the last one can go in the trash.
 
My two car garage was so cluttered at one point we couldn’t even park our cars in it. So each day over a year period I would take one item and throw away. The rules I would follow to get me going, if I haven’t used in the last 2 years no need to keep, and if it’s under $10 it can be easily repurchased if I need it again.

As my uncles says. You cannot be buried with your belongings.
Thank you very much @Flamingdeathbolts (awesome game Stray BTW, loved it).

I like that strategy, but let me tell you a couple of caveats I find to it.

First, if I have to throw away just one item per day… I know each year has 365 days, but if we count each document, paper and newspaper as one item, I could be well more than two years throwing stuff.

Second, the main trouble to do this, as you may guess, is that there are objects that I find difficult to throw. Either because of their sentimental value, or because they can be of use, which leads us to the third caveat.

Third: about the $10 rule, I find it wasteful. For example, I have a couple of flasks with screws of many, many sizes and shapes. Throwing them wouldn’t free a lot of space but whenever I needed a screw, I would have to purchase a box or a bag of those again. There are other examples of items that may be useful down the road, that yes, I could throw them and re-purchase them if needed. But again, I feel like generating waste… but maybe it’s a distorted argument because maybe, out of 100 kept items, I will only end up needing 10 or 12 down the road.
 
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