I wrote Apple asking for a 14'' MB. Would you like such a MB?

Discussion in 'MacBook' started by asiga, Jun 12, 2017.

  1. asiga macrumors 6502a

    Nov 4, 2012
    I wrote MacBook feedback at the Apple website, asking for a 14'' MB (well, 14'' or greater, but I guess 14'' would be the size one could realistically expect).

    Being a lover of my Late 2010 MacBook Air, I feel that there's currently no real upgrade for it in terms of design (in terms of performance yes, but not on design), because there's no MacBook lighter than my MBA if you don't reduce the screen size. The only option for reducing weight is moving from 13'' to 12'', and that shouldn't be the case, as 7 years have passed since 2010.

    Also, if you have been using MBAs for years, I guess you'd enjoy the display to be bigger. At least 14''.

    I feel like the natural upgrade path of my MBA would be a bigger display with the same (or lower if possible), weight.

    So, I gave them feedback, asking for this:

    * 14'' (or bigger) display
    * Completely fanless operation.
    * Designed to be hold with one hand (like the MB and MBA are)... this means weight should be equal or less than the current 13'' MBA.
    * Two (or more) ports, but two at the very least.
    * Thunderbolt 3.

    Would you enjoy this MacBook, or am I alone?

    Do you think it's realistic to expect this from Apple? (I hope so, as I really think there's a gap in the current product line, I feel there's no natural upgrade path from the MBA if you really love the MBA main points: lightness with a decent screen size).
  2. mtneer macrumors 68030


    Sep 15, 2012
    I think Apple created the MB with a vision of a thin, small and light portable laptop. Increasing the size/ and or weight of the system would go against the grain of the vision. Apple already has the MBP at 13" and 15" sizes for those looking for larger size. A 14" MB would not be any cheaper than the rMBP's anyways, so they would occupy the same market space.
  3. asiga thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Nov 4, 2012
    I truly believe there's a gap in the MacBook product line. You seem to imply that being ultralight means having an small display. If that was true, the MacBook Air would have never got a 13'' display. The MBA, in its origin, wasn't a low-cost product, but a premium one, and the concept was about absolute lightness while keeping adequate Mac performance and good screen size. If being ultralight would mean small display, all MBAs would be 11''.

    The MacBook product line has currently three different lines:

    1- The low cost line: MacBook Air (13'')
    2- The absolute lightness line: MacBook (12'')
    3- The performance/lightness compromise line: MacBook Pro (13'' and 15'')

    So, users who want today a good sized display in an ultralight MacBook have no product to buy. The only option would be the MacBook Air, but the weight and the screen size are the same as the 13'' MBP, so you're leaving the ultralight concept and entering the MacBookPro concept, which is different.

    Regarding your comment about price overlap, market space isn't just price. In fact, all MacBooks (except the MBA) are in a very similar price range, so similar that the choice between a fully equipped 12'' rMB and a 13'' MBP isn't price, but your preference about weight and performance (if you can afford a fully equipped 12 '' rMB, then the 13'' MBP is just $100 ahead, ie: basically same price). Again, the choice between a 13'' MBP and a 15'' MBP isn't price (a difference of about $400 is nothing if you're going to be using your MBP for the usual average lifetime of all Apple products- it's not money what will make you buy the 13'' MBP, but your size-weight-GPU preference). Of course, the MBA falls outside these rules: the MBA pricing is clearly below the rest of MacBooks.

    So, yes, the price of a 14'' MB would be quite similar to all the rest of MacBooks, for sure. It wouldn't be a low-cost MB, in fact it should be slightly more expensive than the 12'' MB.
  4. asiga thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Nov 4, 2012
    (I'm reposting this from another thread because it was meant to be in this thread)

    I just found the LG gram (didn't know it existed), which offers 14 inch and 15 inch displays at a weight similar to the 12-inch MacBook. The quality of the LG gram seems to be low, specially the keyboard, but I really hope Apple realizes there's a market for ultralight 14/15 inch MacBooks.

    If the LG gram was a MacBook, I'd buy it today. And I'm not kidding: today. But it's not a MacBook. I'll keep my Late-2010 MBA for another year, hoping I'll see a 14 inch or 15 inch MacBook below 1Kg next year...
  5. Saturn1217 macrumors 6502a

    Apr 28, 2008
    I would definitely consider such a laptop. However, I don't think Apple is going to make it. Simply because they seem to be targeting the 13" nTB MBP at users who want thin and light but basic computer use.

    I completely agree with you though. It would be nice to get an actual UPGRADE from my current macbook Air. I can't go to 1 port and a 12" screen but I very highly value battery life/portability over performance (this may change in the future but still...) From that standpoint the 13" nTB MBP doesn't meaningfully improve on the 2 biggest reasons that I picked my current computer. A 2.5-2.7lb 14" MB with 2 ports would get there. But I think we are going to have to wait for the 12" MB to drop in price a lot (enough to get rid of the MBA) before this happens. And that is going to take a while.

    To put it in perspective. The last time I upgraded (2009 13" MBP to 2013 13" MBA) I was able to enjoy the benefits of 4.5 lbs => ~3lbs and 7hr battery life => 12hr battery life. Obviously the rate of progress is going to slow down as we hit the limits of physics but other companies are still making progress in these areas without going all the way to 12", 1 port computers that can't really be used by many as a primary machine.
  6. asiga thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Nov 4, 2012
    My feelings exactly. I perceive it as a downgrade going from the MBA to the MB, because of getting only 1 port and a 12'' display, even if I'd get two things that I highly desire: a lighter weight and fanless operation. Also, I don't perceive as an upgrade going from the MBA to the 13'' MBP (in terms of performance yes, but I'm getting the same display size -higher resolution but the same size- and the same weight... so I feel like: come on!! around $2000 for getting the same size and the same weight?? I'd happily pay more than $2000, but it requires to look as a long lasting purchase, and for that I require 2 or more ports, a bigger display, and lighter than my MBA. Then, it would be worth paying more than $2000, and I'd pay that price.

    I've been waiting for so long that, honestly, I don't care about price in this moment, because I've been saving for more than 5 years for a new MacBook. So, I'd consider it fair to pay current MBP prices for a 14/15 inch MB.
  7. robbietop macrumors regular


    Jun 7, 2017
    Good Ol' US of A
    My first laptop was the 14" iBook, so I do understand your desire for such a screen size!
    I have used every screen size Apple has ever made:
    -12" PowerBook (The most cult favorite of all Apple fans. New MacBook scratches this itch to great success!)
    -14" iBook G4
    -13" MacBook Pro
    -15" MacBook Pro
    -17" Macbook Pro.

    Out of all these screen sizes, my personal favorite is the 12" PowerBook/Macbook. It is the best screen size with the best amount of power.
    However, there are times when I enjoyed the 13" but I felt it was too small and then the 15" too big.

    If Apple were to just cut through the middle and have a 14" MacBoom Pro as the only size, I would seriously consider it.

    But as it is, I remember my iBook G4 fondly. And I love the 14". But these odd numbered sizes always feel too big or too small. Maybe's it's because they're odd?

    I can definitely agree that would solve the problem I have with the Pro series screen size.
  8. asiga thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Nov 4, 2012
    I just had a (very crazy) idea, which might allow me to get an almost 13 inch display below 1kg: what if I get a 12.9 iPad Pro and I jailbreak it? All I need is TexLive for my LaTeX documents, and LLVM-clang for compiling portable source code. I also believe X11 is available in Cydia. With clang, X11, and TeXLive, I think I have everything I need.

    Yes, it's quite crazy, but perhaps a better option than the 12-inch MacBook (one inch bigger, and lighter)
  9. throAU macrumors 603


    Feb 13, 2012
    Perth, Western Australia
    I'd say you're crazy. What is your intended build target for clang? You're so far into unsupported territory at this point you'd be better off with a DELL XPS 14" and Linux.

    Except it would have to be secondhand because dell look or have dropped the 14" form factor.
  10. asiga thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Nov 4, 2012
    I'm not really interested in exactly 14''. It can be 15'' as well, but with a weight similar to the 12'' MacBook, and preferably fanless as well.

    Regarding clang targets, I wouldn't use it for final production executables, just test executables that can be run from the terminal in cydia.

    Anyway, you're right saying it's a crazy idea. Moreover, I'm only getting one inch more than the MacBook.

    Regarding your Dell advice, I'd choose the LG gram instead, as it's closer to the MacBook concept. However, not having MacOS nor iOS would be too bad. Even if a hackintosh would be possible in those or similar laptops, I don't think the bundled trackpad would be natively supported in MacOS with multitouch gestures, so... no way.

    I'll have to wait, I'm afraid.
  11. throAU, Jun 28, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2017

    throAU macrumors 603


    Feb 13, 2012
    Perth, Western Australia
    I don't think your 14-15" machine in MacBook 12" weight and fanless request is being realistic (yet) to be honest.

    Closest you'll get is a 15" retina with integrated graphics. Not that heavy, and when not doing much the fan will turn off completely.

    The market for the machine you want doesn't really exist, but I do think a 15" base model Retina might be close.
  12. turbineseaplane macrumors 68040


    Mar 19, 2008
    To answer the OP question..

    Yes. Badly want one.
    It's essentially my dream laptop these days..

    I basically love everything about the 12" except I need a touch more screen size.
  13. asiga thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Nov 4, 2012
    The LG gram proves it is technically possible to make today a 14/15 inch laptop below 1kg. Of course, LG quality cannot be compared to Apple quality, but I really think Apple can release a 15 inch MacBook with the same weight of a MBA, or even less (if LG can do it below 1kg, Apple could do it at 1.3kg)
  14. turbineseaplane macrumors 68040


    Mar 19, 2008
    If they do it, I think they should do 12 & 14 for MB and keep 13 & 15 for MBP
  15. Eggtastic macrumors 6502a


    Jun 9, 2009
    While I agree with you, it comes down to business. If you want the larger screen size, you will pay more $$$ by going with the pro version despite you not needing the extras (hence why I think they offered the base 13" rMBP with the standard function keys).

    If apple came out with a 14" rMB I am sure it would sell well, but they would need to make it at a price in-between the rMB and rMBP and that would also cut into the pro sales. Tons of people buy the pro models when they don't even need it (hell I did it back in 2006 because it was an awesome laptop), and if apple were to offer the rMB 14" then it would essentially be less profit vs. people buying the 13"pro.

    I could be completely wrong here, but I can't see any other reason why they wouldn't have done this by now.
  16. turbineseaplane macrumors 68040


    Mar 19, 2008
    @Eggtastic I don't know about that..
    Apple has no qualms about premium pricing.

    I could very easily see an insanely sexy/thin/light larger MacBook where you're paying way more than we might expect simply for that form factor and appeal. If anyone could/would make a super premium product like that and fully divorces specs from pricing reality, it's Apple (and I applaud that in this case honestly)

    The highest margins come from premium allure and pricing to match.
  17. asiga thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Nov 4, 2012
    I think we are basically talking here about the successor to the MacBook Air. The origin of the MBA was as a premium product, and I bought mine back in 2010 for using it with professional software (when most of the people were telling me it was a wrong choice and that I should have chosen a MBP instead... but my decision proved right, the MBA was perfect to run professional software in a very light MacBook, yet with a decent screen size, and it was indeed the pioneering concept of the MBPs we have today).

    Nowadays the MBA is left as a low-cost entry solution, but its concept (ultralight with decent screen size) has no successor. People will argue that the 13'' MBP has the same weight as the MBA, but, however, the 13'' MBP is not the MBA successor (if it were, it would be lighter than the MBA rather than having the same weight, because we are 10 years after the MBA... weight would improve in the successor, rather than remaining constant).

    Regarding the pricing for a 14/15 inch rMB, I think it would be quite similar to the 13'' MBP, and it would make sense: given a price, you could choose between more performance with an smaller screen and heavier weight, or less performance with a larger screen and lighter weight. It would make sense.

    BTW, I don't really think the current MacBook pricing avoids "cannibalization", because the whole range (except perhaps the MBA) falls within less than $1000 difference. If you can afford the 12'' rMB, you can also afford the 13'' MBP with just a minor extra cost effort. I don't think the choice between the 12'' rMB and the 13'' MBP today is a matter of money, but tastes/preferences.
  18. turbineseaplane macrumors 68040


    Mar 19, 2008

    You nailed it. The product we are talking about would slot back into premium territory.
  19. p8blr macrumors newbie


    Sep 12, 2016
    Wichita, KS
    I'd like to see a 13" or larger Macbook in place of the Air. I like the style of the Macbook; 12" is just too small for me, the 13" Air is too outdated (i.e. screen), and I prefer the thin wedge design over the design of the lowest-tier MBP.
  20. mcpryon2 macrumors 6502a


    Dec 12, 2008
  21. wave84 macrumors newbie

    Sep 11, 2014
    This would be my dream computer. I would pay a FORTUNE for a 15" fanless ultralight Macbook. The CPU is more than adequate for my work, just get me the largest possible laptop with the lowest possible weight. The technology clearly exists to make lighter 15 inchers, since others have done it.

    I went throught the same problems as you, asiga. I now have a 15" 2015 Macbook Pro, which I love except for the weight, which is horrible. With the charger it takes like half of my luggage weight when I'm away on small trips. If you're flying a budget airline you're allowed like 7kgs, so when my laptop takes 3, it sucks.
    Most of the time I use it at home with an attached monitor.

    So what are my options?

    1. The 12" Macbook is way too small. You're just going to slowly ruin your eyes with that one.

    2. A large iPad Pro would be an interesting proposition, especially since you could maneuvre it better, keep it closer when needed, etc. But going the iOS route is tricky. For absolute emergency work it might do, but why would I corner myself like that? It would also not completely replace my main computer, so that means 2 devices to manage, sync files, etc.

    3. I also pondered the LG Gram. And the Samsung Notebook 9 15". And all the other windows ultraportables. First there's the windows nightmare, and then there's subpar built quality and other issues. Like bad trackpads, bad sound, bad reliability, bad resale value, etc. The Gram also has that horrible keyboard with numeric keys, as well.

    4. The new 15" Macbook Pro is still way too heavy! 1.8 kgs vs 2 kg (my current Pro) is too small of an upgrade. And everything else about it (price, keyboard, magsafe, ports) is a downgrade mostly, so why would I spent a fortune for a sidegrade, at most?

    My wife is also in the exact same situation, but her main computer is a 2012 Macbook Air 13". She desperately needs to upgrade at this point, she would enjoy a larger screen, but what can she get? Doesn't want a Macbook (too small for her eyes), doesn't want a Macbook Pro 13" (too bulky, despite same weight it's thicker, + hates keyboard, hates ports). Getting a new Air with the exact same internals as 3 years ago, at the same price(!!!) also feels like a ripoff. And that screen is so old.. The iPad pro doesn't run her software (SPSS, statistics stuff). She hates Windows with a passion. The 15" is way too heavy for her to carry around all day.

    Now we're both pondering the Huawei Matebook X Pro, but Windows....... Oh, and we live in Eastern Europe, where the Huawei is a unicorn anyway. It literally doesn't exist in real life, not outside the US websites' reviews. No way to get it.
  22. BODYBUILDERPAUL macrumors 65816

    Feb 9, 2009
    Why would it happen when the FANTASTIC quad core MacBook Pro is only £400 more expensive than the MacBook 12" where exactly would a 14" MacBook fit in price wise? Answer - the same as that very impressive MacBook Pro. The Core M is simply not strong enough to drive a 14" screen and I guess that you'd want P3 wide colour gamut and TrueTone?

    It would simply over complicate the line up and probably create a lot of bad press for Apple with a hugely expensive under performing machine. It simply does not make sense when the new 13" & 15" MacBook Pro's are now so damn good.

    I'm a huge fan of the MBK but I know that it's hugely overpriced at £1250 upwards in the UK. We don't get the bargain offers like the BestBuy prices here in Brexit land :(

    I truly believe that the MBK was meant to be chic and tiny and different from the MBKP. A 14" doesn't fit.
    --- Post Merged, Jul 13, 2018 ---
    Oh WAVE, you really don't deserve to own a MacBook Pro if you pondered over LG & Samsung Windows rubbish. Seriously man, that's like a Ferrari driver being jealous of a shiny door mirror of a beige Ford Focus. Come on man, appreciate what you have! Some people have nothing in life!
  23. Cardino macrumors member

    Jun 2, 2018
    Removing thunderbolt and touchbar from mbp can give us an more affordable 13 or 14 inch macbook. I should buy it brainless if it has an edge-to-edge retina display and powered by i7-8565u.
  24. madat42 macrumors regular

    Mar 25, 2011
    I'd love a 13- or 14-inch MacBook, but as mentioned above it's got to be closer to 2.5 pounds or less. Else, I'd just get the MacBook Pro. There's a reason why the little MB is such a favorite and go-to device for so many.

Share This Page