i7 processor, maybe a mistake?

[sjinsjca]

I see no reason why it needs to be done more than once. And no, deep cycling is not good for the battery.

I admit to have spoken glibly when saying "good for" the battery. You're quite correct, it shouldn't be done too often with Lithium-based batteries.

It is indeed a good thing, however, to run the battery down occasionally (maybe every other month or so) rather than (for example) leaving it plugged in all the time.

Best yet, per Apple, is light cycling with the aforementioned occasional deep discharge. See http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1490 and http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1764220

The occasional deep discharge fine tunes the calibration and accommodates aging of the battery. In my own experience (and, admittedly, this is anecdotal) the battery-meter accuracy is improved significantly by at least a second calibration discharge within the first month of usage. But this might be overkill. I'd imagine the calibration would be further finessed if the discharging is done during normal usage rather than putting the machine on a desk and letting it run until it dies.

In any case, my February-issue MBP's battery meter is scary accurate now. And my occasional deep discharge--either purposeful or on a long flight--should keep it that way.

 

[2high2aim]

wow I am contemplating b/t i5 2.4ghz or i7 2.66ghz and the only reason I am considering i7 is for the 512mb 330m...I think the i5 is adequate enough for me just the graphics department that's a little concerning. But hearing the individuals like yourself talking about heat issues and lower battery life I am hesitant as I need a machine to be able to run for awhile on battery and be comfortable to use.

 

[c.e.p]

wow I am contemplating b/t i5 2.4ghz or i7 2.66ghz and the only reason I am considering i7 is for the 512mb 330m...I think the i5 is adequate enough for me just the graphics department that's a little concerning. But hearing the individuals like yourself talking about heat issues and lower battery life I am hesitant as I need a machine to be able to run for awhile on battery and be comfortable to use.

The battery and maybe heating issues is because too many programs trigger the graphics card. An OS update could easily fix this in the near future!

 

[2high2aim]

So my main question is, the problem due to the i7 cpu and 512mb 330m or is it similar in power consumption and heat when compared to i5 n 256mb 330m?

 

[a4209797]

So my main question is, the problem due to the i7 cpu and 512mb 330m or is it similar in power consumption and heat when compared to i5 n 256mb 330m?

similar

 

[2high2aim]

Can u define similar I am trying to see if the pros outweigh the cons. While performance is a factor battery life and heat are also big factors in my decision.

 

[a4209797]

The i7 has the same TDP (max wattage) and voltage draws as the i5. The TDP will also effect the temp, so the temp won't differ much either.

i5 = 0.8 - 1.4 V & 35 W TDP
i7 = 0.8 - 1.4 V & 35 W TDP

the difference between the 512mb and the 256mb 330m would be negligible if anything. what usually will draw more power is if you have more ram chips (2 ram sticks vs 4 ram sticks). but i'm thinking that it's the same amount of chips but they just have a different capacity, i could be wrong.

bottom line, if you lose any battery life over i5 vs i7 and 512 vs 256 it will be measured in minutes, hardly noticeable.

 

[LedCop]

i5 = 0.8 - 1.4 V & 35 W TDP
i7 = 0.8 - 1.4 V & 35 W TDP

the difference between the 512mb and the 256mb 330m would be negligible if anything. what usually will draw more power is if you have more ram chips (2 ram sticks vs 4 ram sticks). but i'm thinking that it's the same amount of chips but they just have a different capacity, i could be wrong.

bottom line, if you lose any battery life over i5 vs i7 and 512 vs 256 it will be measured in minutes, hardly noticeable.

*cough* and here are some hard numbers:

http://anandtech.com/show/3669/appl...o-more-battery-life-tests-display-evaluated/2

 

[0186279]

Does anybody think that the OP's issue could be due to having the 7200rpm model as opposed to the 5400?

 

[2high2aim]

thanks for the link what does the benchmark's x-axis represent like units? Because idk what a few point like 170 vs. 174 mean? Is a 4 point difference be witnessed in real life applications or is it just for comparison purposes (no real life affects)

 

[Abstract]

People who post threads, or even posts, purporting low battery life experiences with their new laptop based on what they see in the battery life estimator in the top-right part of the screen are wasting everyone's time.

Grab a watch, or at least glance over at a clock, and time you battery life. I can understand the confusion over battery calibration, but using the on-screen battery life indicator as the be-all sign of poor battery life is preposterous. It changes all the time based on usage.

To the rest of you, thanks. I'm getting my new 15" i5 shipped to me soon, and will report my experiences post-battery calibration.

 

[LedCop]

thanks for the link what does the benchmark's x-axis represent like units? Because idk what a few point like 170 vs. 174 mean? Is a 4 point difference be witnessed in real life applications or is it just for comparison purposes (no real life affects)

The page I linked to discusses battery life so the units are in minutes.

To summarize, a Core i5 MBP at 2.4GHz could last as little as 15 minutes longer than a Core i7 MBP or as much as 40 minutes longer, depending on the usage, of course.

People who post threads, or even posts, purporting low battery life experiences with their new laptop based on what they see in the battery life estimator in the top-right part of the screen are wasting everyone's time.

Grab a watch, or at least glance over at a clock, and time you battery life. I can understand the confusion over battery calibration, but using the on-screen battery life indicator as the be-all sign of poor battery life is preposterous. It changes all the time based on usage.

To the rest of you, thanks. I'm getting my new 15" i5 shipped to me soon, and will report my experiences post-battery calibration.

Truth! And even then, since everyone's usage varies, the actual battery life isn't necessarily applicable for another person.

 

[sjinsjca]

Does anybody think that the OP's issue could be due to having the 7200rpm model as opposed to the 5400?

Probably not. When I researched upgrading the hdd in my Lenovo laptop, I found very little difference between high-end 5400s and 7200s.

 

[breatheasy]

i got the i5 2.4ghz.

Does it run hot? yeah my temperature monitor says that the cpu reached 100 degrees celsius when playing call of duty 4.

Is the 9 hour battery life a lie? No, My laptop says around 4-5 hours to start but today it lasted me between 8-9 hours fairly heavy use. I must say I am impressed.

So what if the processor runs at 100 degrees, isn't the hardware designed to tolerate it?

 

[drambuie]

Actually, the step up from the 2.53GHz i5 to the 2.66GHz i7 isn't that bad a value for money. For the extra $200, you get a CPU that's worth $75 more per 1k lot, at Intel wholesale prices, and an additional 256MB of video RAM.

On the other hand, the $300 increase from the 2.4GHz 13" MPB, (P8600 C2D), to the 2.66GHz one, (P8800 C2D), gives you a CPU worth $32 more at 1k lot prices, and an HD enhancement worth $50 more at retail.

 

[green86]

wow I am contemplating b/t i5 2.4ghz or i7 2.66ghz and the only reason I am considering i7 is for the 512mb 330m...I think the i5 is adequate enough for me just the graphics department that's a little concerning. But hearing the individuals like yourself talking about heat issues and lower battery life I am hesitant as I need a machine to be able to run for awhile on battery and be comfortable to use.

That isn't the only reason you should be considering a i7. You get a full 1MB more of cache, a higher turbo boost speed along with a higher base clock. These little things Do add up. I think the OP went with the right choice... the i7 is a good deal and more future proof then the other chips. It's the way to go if you can afford it.

 

[m85476585]

1 MB more of cache will make very little difference, unless you are doing calculations on large data sets. Here's a graph of cache miss rate vs size for the SPEC CPU2000 integer benchmark (an industry standard):

(lower is better)
The cache in my Core 2 Quad is 24-way associative according to CPU-Z, so that puts it somewhere between 8-way and full. I assume the mobile i7's have a similar associativity. As you can see, past 1MB the miss rate is already so low that adding more cache has little effect. Note the scale: the miss rate at 1MB is 10^-6, or one miss per million instructions. Also note that as you approach infinite cache size, the miss rate only improves a little more! Of course larger data sets will benefit from a larger cache, but most applications will not see much or any benefit.

It would be much better to spend the money on a SSD. A typical disk read (~10 ms) takes millions of times longer than a cache (~1 ns, I think) or memory read (~10 ns), and a SSD might reduce that by 100 (to ~.1ms) though that is still 10,000 times longer than memory.

 

[Jaro65]

Skype probably uses the discrete graphics to accelerate videoconferencing.
get serviced.

And so it would make perfect sense for it to activate the 330 GPU if you were to turn on the camera, right? But unless you do that, what's the point? Sounds like though maybe this is something that needs to be fixed on Skype's end?

I have Skype on all day, and it would be just silly to be constantly using a higher-powered GPU just because of that - and especially if there are voice or video conversations taking place.

 

[stefan15]

Mine gets hot when the 330M needlessly kicks in. Many programs and situations trigger the discrete graphics. One stupid example, the chrome "incognito" window turns it on... why? Apple needs to look into offering a manual solution. Otherwise this is the coolest laptop I've ever owned.

 

[EndlessMac]

The battery and maybe heating issues is because too many programs trigger the graphics card. An OS update could easily fix this in the near future!

I think that might be the cause of the issue. I have the previous generation MBP and when I use the 9600 discrete graphics card my laptop can also get really hot. My battery life is also reduced greatly.

I'm sure the more powerful i7 processor is adding to the heat but if the OP is getting a hot laptop from doing basic tasks that doesn't stress out the processor then it's probably the discrete graphics card. My laptop also runs hotter doing basic tasks when I'm using the discrete graphics card.

The auto switching of graphics card is a nice feature but Apple should not have taken away the choice to also manually choose the integrated card instead of only the discrete card.

 

[barefeats]

If the outer skin is warm, it means the aluminum is doing its job of dissipating heat. I suggest using some kind of stand to allow air to circulate at the bottom. I use a gel filled keyboard wrist rest to left the back end an inch off my desk.

A good way to check internal temps is Hardware Monitor. It samples temps of CPU, GPU, hard drive, etc. I open the window that shows the maximum temps.

 

[penter]

To the OP, yeah, mine runs pretty hot, too. Not as hot as yours. I'd be freaking out. As a matter of fact, my GPU ran up to 74 ºC once, before iStat stopped reporting it's temperature.

First, have you calibrated your battery?

What do you mean by this??

Also, to the person who asked about the fan noise, I think it would be safe to say that the fan speed could be raised to 3000 rpm without making much noise. They definitely sound at around 4000.

 

[mdatwood]

All you're running is Skype?

I have the i7 17" and it's running at 63C right now. The apps I have currently have running are:

Safari
Chrome
Textmate
iTunes
Preview
Adium
VMWare (w/ win7 vm)
4 Terminal windows
and an external monitor

Even when I play full screen video from abc.com I've yet to see my processor go over 80C. Does the 17" really run that much cooler or are people running more software than what they are saying?

 

[MBPi7]

1 MB more of cache will make very little difference, unless you are doing calculations on large data sets. Here's a graph of cache miss rate vs size for the SPEC CPU2000 integer benchmark (an industry standard):

(lower is better)
The cache in my Core 2 Quad is 24-way associative according to CPU-Z, so that puts it somewhere between 8-way and full. I assume the mobile i7's have a similar associativity. As you can see, past 1MB the miss rate is already so low that adding more cache has little effect. Note the scale: the miss rate at 1MB is 10^-6, or one miss per million instructions. Also note that as you approach infinite cache size, the miss rate only improves a little more! Of course larger data sets will benefit from a larger cache, but most applications will not see much or any benefit.

It would be much better to spend the money on a SSD. A typical disk read (~10 ms) takes millions of times longer than a cache (~1 ns, I think) or memory read (~10 ns), and a SSD might reduce that by 100 (to ~.1ms) though that is still 10,000 times longer than memory.

Interesting. Does this take into account the differences between L2 and L3 cache?

 

[Emoo]

I haven't managed to get my temp above 65 right now. Then again, I'm not really putting the CPU under load yet. We'll see, but no, I haven't had any temp issues yet with my i7.

Edit: My apologies, posted this to the wrong thread.