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IBM Posts pics and summary of 970

lmalave

lmalave

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Nov 8, 2002
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Chinatown NYC
http://www-3.ibm.com/chips/products/powerpc/newsletter/dec2002/newproductfocus2.html

It's really gonna happen! Samples by Q2 2003 and full production by 2nd half 2003! Does anyone have specs on the 970's power consumption? I hope it's not more power-hungry than the current G4...

I wonder how Apple is going to handle the introduction of the 970. Announcing early will of course kill PowerMac sales, but Apple is so dead in the water with Pro users if it doesn't announce something soon anyway. Desperate times call for desperate measures.

If I were Apple, I would show a prototype of a PowerMac running a 970 as soon as I could get my hands on one, even if it meant killing PowerMac sales for 6 months. If I were SJ I would demo a prototype at MWSF if at all possible, and if not I'd still hold a special press event before the July Macworld. Then at the July Macworld I would demo an actual 970 PowerMac as it will be sold, and start taking pre-orders...
 
Re: IBM Posts pics and summary of 970

Originally posted by lmalave
It's really gonna happen! Samples by Q2 2003 and full production by 2nd half 2003! Does anyone have specs on the 970's power consumption? I hope it's not more power-hungry than the current G4...
Click to expand...
We already knew of those dates. Information here presents nothing new. Full production by second half 2003 does not mean Apple will immediately use them. Apple has to wait for IBM to reach a certain volume before they are shipped to Apple in Asia. Those people in Asia are going to mass-build these systems to its default configurations and stand by for BTO options. All that might mean no PowerPC 970 until January 2004, which would suck.

Last time I checked, PowerPC 970's power consumption were just slightly above the G4, maybe by 10 watts, I forget. Still far less than Pentium 4s and Athlons.
 
Re: Re: IBM Posts pics and summary of 970

Originally posted by edesignuk

The chip maybe gonna happen, but that doesn't mean Apple will use it :(
Click to expand...

Yeah, but why would they emphasize Altivec in the article? Are there any Altivec-optimized applications written for any platform other than the Mac OS? Also, when I see IBM emphasize that the chip is optimized for "bandwidth hungry" applications, I immediately think of multimedia applications that are manipulating very large files, which again fits the profile of the prosumer Mac user...
 
Re: Re: IBM Posts pics and summary of 970

Originally posted by MacCoaster

We already knew of those dates. Information here presents nothing new. Full production by second half 2003 does not mean Apple will immediately use them. Apple has to wait for IBM to reach a certain volume before they are shipped to Apple in Asia. Those people in Asia are going to mass-build these systems to its default configurations and stand by for BTO options. All that might mean no PowerPC 970 until January 2004, which would suck.

Last time I checked, PowerPC 970's power consumption were just slightly above the G4, maybe by 10 watts, I forget. Still far less than Pentium 4s and Athlons.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the power consumption info.

I interpreted the article a bit differently than you did, though. I of course have read these dates before, but for IBM to post this article on December 26 and promise samples by Q2 I think is still striking. That's only a few months away!! And I think when they say that they will be producing in volume by 2nd half 2002, I interpret that as meaning that IBM will start shipping to Apple in that same timeframe.

Think about it. Apple is very, very, very despearate to get these chips, and will make WHATEVER arrangements are necessary with IBM to get them as early as possible, even at lower volume (introducing them first in the PowerMac and XServe). It works out well for IBM too, because what else are they going to use the chips for? From what I've read, IBM has high ambitions to build Linux workstations using the 970, but even they must realize that the pent-up demand for the 970 in the Mac market is by far the most lucrative way to launch the chip.

As I said in my post above, I still predict a "prototype" PowerMac 970 demo well before the July MW, a "production" PowerMac 970 demo at the July MW, and pre-orders to be accepted immediately after the July MW.
 
Re: Re: Re: IBM Posts pics and summary of 970

Originally posted by lmalave

As I said in my post above, I still predict a "prototype" PowerMac 970 demo well before the July MW, a "production" PowerMac 970 demo at the July MW, and pre-orders to be accepted immediately after the July MW.
Click to expand...

What possible reason would Apple have to demonstrate a prototype machine - since it would, as you state, destroy current PowerMac sales.

This newsletter/article was posted in early December, btw.

https://www.macrumors.com/pages/2002/12/20021213103855.shtml

arn
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: IBM Posts pics and summary of 970

Originally posted by arn


What possible reason would Apple have to demonstrate a prototype machine - since it would, as you state, destroy current PowerMac sales.

This newsletter/article was posted in early December, btw.

https://www.macrumors.com/pages/2002/12/20021213103855.shtml

arn
Click to expand...

Ahhh.... sorry I didn't realize that previous post was pointing to the same newsletter...

To answer your question: Apple would show a prototype of a 970 PowerMac for roughly the same reason that Sony showed a refrigerator-size prototype of a multiprocessor Playstation 3 right around the same time that XBox came out. Basically it's to send a message to stick with your platform and that your platform is still the future. Granted, Sony probably did not lose a single Playstation 2 sale because of its prototype since the Playstation 3 is still a couple years away.

But as I said before, desperate times call for desperate measures. When was the last time Apple had to admit in its 10K report that its CPU (or lack thereof) was having a serious adverse impact on its marketing? Exactly.

And also keep in mind that as a general marketing rule of thumb, acquiring new customers is 10 times more expensive than keeping existing ones happy. If Apple predicted that if it stayed silent in the next 6 months that a significant enough number of its existing customer base would switch to PC, then it would make sense to make an announcement earlier.

Here's a scenario: let's say that in the next 6 months, without an announcement, Apple would sell 100,000 PowerMacs, but 50,000 existing PowerMac users would switch to PC. No let's say that if Apple demos a 970 prototype early, it would only sell 50,000 PowerMacs in the next 6 months, but a negligible number of existing users would switch to PC in that same timeframe. Then a rational economic analysis would dictate that Apple should do the early demo, since the negative economic impact 50,000 reverse switchers is far, far greater than the negative impact of just losing 50,000 unit sales of the PowerMac in the short term.
 
agreed.

100 000 - 50 000 = 50 000 short term loses that will NEVER buy another mac

50 000 - 5 = 49 995 short term and ~50 000+ that WILL buy another mac


which is economically better? optioin B

which will apple do? option A



no more thread.
 
Re: Re: Re: IBM Posts pics and summary of 970

Originally posted by lmalave
Are there any Altivec-optimized applications written for any platform other than the Mac OS?
Click to expand...
YES!

There are other applications for Alti-vec other than Mac OS. Cisco's networking gear uses G4 chips with Alti-vec, so I'm sure that their code is Alti-vec enhanced.

I'm not saying that IBM's 970 chips are going to be used in Cisco's gear, just that Alti-vec isn't jump limited to desktop computing applications.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: IBM Posts pics and summary of 970

Originally posted by lmalave


Here's a scenario: let's say that in the next 6 months, without an announcement, Apple would sell 100,000 PowerMacs, but 50,000 existing PowerMac users would switch to PC. No let's say that if Apple demos a 970 prototype early, it would only sell 50,000 PowerMacs in the next 6 months, but a negligible number of existing users would switch to PC in that same timeframe. Then a rational economic analysis would dictate that Apple should do the early demo, since the negative economic impact 50,000 reverse switchers is far, far greater than the negative impact of just losing 50,000 unit sales of the PowerMac in the short term.
Click to expand...

but you're just making up numbers... I could make up numbers that argue the other point.

But regardless, you're trying to balance the number of people who may potentially switch to the PC in those 6 months vs. those people who will NOT buy a current Mac because of the announcement.

I think the people who will NOT buy a Mac is a more concrete number than the "potential" switchers who will be persuaded to wait.

As you stated the PS3 demo is not a good comparison... since it's not a real product any time soon.

arn
 
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