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so

  • yes

    Votes: 4 7.3%
  • no

    Votes: 51 92.7%

  • Total voters
    55
I saw quite a lot of questioning around the screen from articles and reviewers and although it was agreed the screen was good, the question was asked why they didn’t just use the same PPI as the 8+. The XR is the main iPhone in the line up to replace the 6,7,8 etc so it needs to be offering a spec that competes with the competition going forward. As the premium market looks at OLED, I think the very least the mainstream market needs is full HD as we’ve grown used to. It’s fine for this year but Apple need to upgrade and move with the industry standard. The XS is irrelevant to the average consumer at this point.

From the consumer's perspective, I think most see the lack of a telephoto lens as the most important distinction. Consumers talk about battery life, performance, and camera quality. But I don't think typical smartphone buyers seriously compare display resolution these days.

From a sales perspective, it's easy to show a customer the difference between an LCD and OLED device. But a PPI difference? Most sales reps would find it difficult to demonstrate the difference between 326 and 401 PPI.

Apple's product stack doesn't leave much room for a high PPI XR. With two rear cameras on the XR, the only appreciable difference will be the display. If 3D Touch is removed from OLED in 2019, the gap is even narrower.
 
From the consumer's perspective, I think most see the lack of a telephoto lens as the most important distinction. Consumers talk about battery life, performance, and camera quality. But I don't think typical smartphone buyers seriously compare display resolution these days.

From a sales perspective, it's easy to show a customer the difference between an LCD and OLED device. But a PPI difference? Most sales reps would find it difficult to demonstrate the difference between 326 and 401 PPI.

Apple's product stack doesn't leave much room for a high PPI XR. With two rear cameras on the XR, the only appreciable difference will be the display. If 3D Touch is removed from OLED in 2019, the gap is even narrower.
I’m sure you’re right about the average consumer. It’s a weird one for those of us with the 8+ though and although I couldn’t tell much difference myself, it still feels odd to upgrade to what is potentially a lower res screen. Then again there is the choice to simply buy an older OLED model too like people are able to do with the X this year. It’s options like this though that hurts Apple more than it hurts us as it deflects attention away from current models when specs come in to question.
 
It shouldn’t really cost more when the competition can offer the same and more for the same price and even less. Yes those devices don’t run iOS but the hardware is still premium.
I don’t disagree. But everyone here knows Apple good enough to know how they operate and what kind of margins they demand no matter how overpriced we think they are.

Expecting better screens and dual cameras on the XR, at the same or reduced price, doesn’t seem like a realistic expectation to me.

As an example, Apple just released Smart battery cases for the XS, XS Max and XR. Are these cases the same price as the last Smart Battery cases? Nope. 30% higher price. The only difference is built in wireless charging.

None of this should be surprising to anyone that’s been around any amount of time.

I like their stuff a lot, but think my Apple products purchasing days are limited.
 
I don’t disagree. But everyone here knows Apple good enough to know how they operate and what kind of margins they demand no matter how overpriced we think they are.

Expecting better screens and dual cameras on the XR, at the same or reduced price, doesn’t seem like a realistic expectation to me.

As an example, Apple just released Smart battery cases for the XS, XS Max and XR. Are these cases the same price as the last Smart Battery cases? Nope. 30% higher price. The only difference is built in wireless charging.

None of this should be surprising to anyone that’s been around any amount of time.

I like their stuff a lot, but think my Apple products purchasing days are limited.

I love their products too but the question is starting to be asked, how long can they be arrogant about what they offer? They’ve been fortunate their brand is strong enough that they can charge what they like and offer is little as possible for the money. Times are starting to change with the competition offering good packages at comparable prices (XR) and people aren’t upgrading as often as they used to. The market is more limited as a result and this means there is more pressure than ever to compete for consumers upgrades.

I do think Apple will continue to ignore this for a few more years though as we expect. Times seem to have changed but Apple haven’t.
 
I love their products too but the question is starting to be asked, how long can they be arrogant about what they offer? They’ve been fortunate their brand is strong enough that they can charge what they like and offer is little as possible for the money. Times are starting to change with the competition offering good packages at comparable prices (XR) and people aren’t upgrading as often as they used to. The market is more limited as a result and this means there is more pressure than ever to compete for consumers upgrades.

I do think Apple will continue to ignore this for a few more years though as we expect. Times seem to have changed but Apple haven’t.


Apple are banking on people wanting to stay in the Apple eco-system, and thus will do anything to keep themselves in. Even if it means buying an older handset or changing carriers that offer new customers from other carriers an offer that's too good to pass up. And they get to take their number with them.


While flagship Androids are great, most Androids are terrible. And the biggest issue is that the SnapDragon series of SoC simply can't match what Apple makes. Even the upcoming 855 SoC is blown sky high by the A12 SoC from Apple. Then again Qualcomm uses reference designs and doesn't really push the envelope. Why should they? They're not competing with Apple.

No idea what Samsung's own SoC can do. But I doubt it can come close to the A12, let alone the A11. And even then, a Qualcomm processor gets placed into Samsungs for a majority of countries, and not their in-house processor.
 
Apple are banking on people wanting to stay in the Apple eco-system, and thus will do anything to keep themselves in. Even if it means buying an older handset or changing carriers that offer new customers from other carriers an offer that's too good to pass up. And they get to take their number with them.


While flagship Androids are great, most Androids are terrible. And the biggest issue is that the SnapDragon series of SoC simply can't match what Apple makes. Even the upcoming 855 SoC is blown sky high by the A12 SoC from Apple. Then again Qualcomm uses reference designs and doesn't really push the envelope. Why should they? They're not competing with Apple.

No idea what Samsung's own SoC can do. But I doubt it can come close to the A12, let alone the A11. And even then, a Qualcomm processor gets placed into Samsungs for a majority of countries, and not their in-house processor.
I don’t think the SoC really matters. Yes the A12 is significantly faster but for what most people want to do (email, web browsing, watching videos, a few games etc) the latest SD or Exynos chip is good enough.
 
I don’t think the SoC really matters. Yes the A12 is significantly faster but for what most people want to do (email, web browsing, watching videos, a few games etc) the latest SD or Exynos chip is good enough.

Good post. Smart phones have matured enough today where processing power really isn’t necessarily incorporated everything we do (Aside from the technical things like Face ID with A11 Bionic that meshes), it just depends on how you’re using the phone. Granted VR rendering will be more important in the future for those who can appreciate that, but as you said, for every day multitasking tasks with browsing, media and simple games, smart phone competitors really have adequate chip sets in our phones where it meets the basic demands for everyday usage.
 
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I don’t think the SoC really matters. Yes the A12 is significantly faster but for what most people want to do (email, web browsing, watching videos, a few games etc) the latest SD or Exynos chip is good enough.
Actually, it makes a huge difference. The SnapDragon 845 beats the current Exynos 9810 in benchmarks except for GeekBench, both in single core and multi-core testing, along with other goodies. In terms of SnapDragon enabled models, Qualcomm has a history of not delivering SoC drivers to OEMs such as Samsung allowing them to push out new Android versions after a few years. This is the main reason why Android OEMs only offer one major upgrade if any, and then some security updates. There's greener pastures in the far future, but for now, Qualcomm causes a lot of issues. A new OS that's more refined can breathe new life into older devices. The main reason older iPhones work so well on iOS 12 is apps ramp up faster than prior iOS version. There's a few articles out there from this past fall that dive into how iOS 12 differs from prior iOS version.

Aside from getting updates for at least 4-5 years and emergency security updates, iPhones are typically better engineered for long use. In other words, iOS is tuned specifically to the hardware inside, allowing it to be more efficient than a flagship Android device. Now, you ask what's the point?

Point is, even if you're checking email, watching videos, etc. a flagship Samsung S series from 3 years ago will lag. I can speak to that. I've been using Samsung's S series since about its inception. The S5 was the turning point for the Galaxy series, but if I were to use an S6 now for work needs, I can still pickup lag. A 6S doesn't have that lag, and didn't on iOS 11 with a fresh battery. Furthermore, as batteries degrade, so does performance. Apple makes these parts. Samsung stops after a couple of years and you're forced to get a third party battery.

Quality companies like Anker did at one time make an S5 replacement battery after Samsung stopped selling them, but I wouldn't trust an Anker battery, even if I know the company is incredible. If people can get by with iOS 12 and a fresh battery on a 5S and brush off the XR, it speaks volumes for the longevity of an iPhone. The S4 came out when the 5S came out. You can't use an S4 today. It's too damn slow. I use an S9 right now. Sure, I'm harping on about how great iOS is and iPhones are. Truth told, they are, but they're not for me. I like having more options. I can do a lot on my S9. If I did the same stuff with the S6 I had, it would be lagging. Probably stuttering on my old S4.


Make sense now? Unless you've used Android for the last decade plus, then you don't really have a leg to stand on. The current A12 is touching very low end Intel processors. Despite the A12 being a RISC processor and it not extrapolating to x86-64 CISC like most thing, it speaks volumes for how much R&D Apple puts into their SoC. Qualcomm spends a fraction, and the major revision performance shows it.

Most Android OEMs now lock down the bootloader. It isn't as easy to flash an Android phone like it used to be. Even the S9 as good as it is, is good for 3 maybe 3.5 years. And even then, carriers offer trade ins.

Android longevity and performance will never come close to Apple's products until Google clamps down like Apple and pushes out updates OTA and Qualcomm is taken out of the picture. I can't speak for the Exynos SoC, but they use Qualcomm modems, and those require drivers for newer Android versions and if they don't send those out, it cripples the update process, too.

Apple gets those updates because they can. They have the swing to do it.


Oh, an even on a pure Android device (no bloat from an OEM, just pure vanilla Android), there's still lag even on a flagship. The fact you need to enable developer mode and disable animations to eliminate or reduce on screen lag speaks volumes for Android's current performance woes.

Samsungs are getting as expensive as Apple's iPhones, but not offering similar or more performance and longevity. It doesn't make sense for a $1,000+ phone (midrange S10).

Chinese companies are making headway, but good luck getting most Americans outside of hardcore Android enthusiasts to bother with them.
 
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So....
With a 2nd lens the only difference from a user experience perspective from an Xs/Xs max will be a lower res screen and true 3d touch?

Would be a weird fit in the catalogue.

I think a 5s sized iphone xr would be more interesting.
 
Actually, it makes a huge difference. The SnapDragon 845 beats the current Exynos 9810 in benchmarks except for GeekBench, both in single core and multi-core testing, along with other goodies. In terms of SnapDragon enabled models, Qualcomm has a history of not delivering SoC drivers to OEMs such as Samsung allowing them to push out new Android versions after a few years. This is the main reason why Android OEMs only offer one major upgrade if any, and then some security updates. There's greener pastures in the far future, but for now, Qualcomm causes a lot of issues. A new OS that's more refined can breathe new life into older devices. The main reason older iPhones work so well on iOS 12 is apps ramp up faster than prior iOS version. There's a few articles out there from this past fall that dive into how iOS 12 differs from prior iOS version.

Aside from getting updates for at least 4-5 years and emergency security updates, iPhones are typically better engineered for long use. In other words, iOS is tuned specifically to the hardware inside, allowing it to be more efficient than a flagship Android device. Now, you ask what's the point?

Point is, even if you're checking email, watching videos, etc. a flagship Samsung S series from 3 years ago will lag. I can speak to that. I've been using Samsung's S series since about its inception. The S5 was the turning point for the Galaxy series, but if I were to use an S6 now for work needs, I can still pickup lag. A 6S doesn't have that lag, and didn't on iOS 11 with a fresh battery. Furthermore, as batteries degrade, so does performance. Apple makes these parts. Samsung stops after a couple of years and you're forced to get a third party battery.

Quality companies like Anker did at one time make an S5 replacement battery after Samsung stopped selling them, but I wouldn't trust an Anker battery, even if I know the company is incredible. If people can get by with iOS 12 and a fresh battery on a 5S and brush off the XR, it speaks volumes for the longevity of an iPhone. The S4 came out when the 5S came out. You can't use an S4 today. It's too damn slow. I use an S9 right now. Sure, I'm harping on about how great iOS is and iPhones are. Truth told, they are, but they're not for me. I like having more options. I can do a lot on my S9. If I did the same stuff with the S6 I had, it would be lagging. Probably stuttering on my old S4.


Make sense now? Unless you've used Android for the last decade plus, then you don't really have a leg to stand on. The current A12 is touching very low end Intel processors. Despite the A12 being a RISC processor and it not extrapolating to x86-64 CISC like most thing, it speaks volumes for how much R&D Apple puts into their SoC. Qualcomm spends a fraction, and the major revision performance shows it.

Most Android OEMs now lock down the bootloader. It isn't as easy to flash an Android phone like it used to be. Even the S9 as good as it is, is good for 3 maybe 3.5 years. And even then, carriers offer trade ins.

Android longevity and performance will never come close to Apple's products until Google clamps down like Apple and pushes out updates OTA and Qualcomm is taken out of the picture. I can't speak for the Exynos SoC, but they use Qualcomm modems, and those require drivers for newer Android versions and if they don't send those out, it cripples the update process, too.

Apple gets those updates because they can. They have the swing to do it.


Oh, an even on a pure Android device (no bloat from an OEM, just pure vanilla Android), there's still lag even on a flagship. The fact you need to enable developer mode and disable animations to eliminate or reduce on screen lag speaks volumes for Android's current performance woes.
Most of the android OEMS offer two years of updates because google stipulate that they have to offer updates for at least 18 months. It’s only been since iOS 12 that older iOS devices became snappy again. Before iOS 12 many users were moaning about their 5S and 6 phones being slow. Also don’t forget the whole throttle gate debacle on older iPhones.

I think battery replacements and servicing outside of the guarantee period has more to do with the aftercare policy than the chipset.

I think the perceived lag is more to do with the android OS rather than the chipset.

We have just acquired an S5 as my husband has sent his note 8 away to be fixed. It’s not as fast as the note 8, S9 plus etc but it’s useable.
 
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Most of the android OEMS offer two years of updates because google stipulate that they have to offer updates for at least 18 months. It’s only been since iOS 12 that older iOS devices became snappy again. Before iOS 12 many users were moaning about their 5S and 6 phones being slow. Also don’t forget the whole throttle gate debacle on older iPhones.

Google stipulates this, but OEMs rarely follow it. Also, what you are stating is a NEW stipulation only brought up in the press back in late October. We'll still have to see two years from now if this holds any truth. This is for devices used by more than 100K people effective Jan 31 2018. Also, this is about security patches that OEMs must provide to Google and the carrier. However, if you knew anything about Android, you'd know it's up to the carrier to certify these patches just as they must certify OS updates. Apple doesn't do this. They send out the update to phones.

In plain English, a carrier can not certify these patches and Google cannot do anything about them. They can say **** Google and **** these OEMs, we're not going to do anything. That's the end. Google and the OEMs still need these carriers to survive in the markets. You could argue about Google Fi, but it's Sprint and TMobile's backend. Even American ISPs who've dived into carrier service ride on Verizon or ATT.

You don't have to deal with that BS with an iPhone. iPhones do not have the bloat that Androids on carriers do. The iPhone is immensely popular. Apple gets to dictate everything; they have since the first iPhone.

Also, your 2 years spiel about OS updates is about the Android One series. Android phones also throttle down when the battery is bad. The Samsung S series was notorious for this. They were even fined by the EU for this. Even my last S device felt slow at the end, and this is after doing a hard reset of the phone to stock and just adding back my photos through my G account. Not even the apps I was using. If the battery life fell, then it should still offer performance like it did on Day One. But it didn't.

Also, I explained why iOS 12 breathed new life into older devices. Did you not read? iOS 12 was developed with performance in mind. Older phones ramp up the processor differently in iOS 12 than prior iOS.

I think battery replacements and servicing outside of the guarantee period has more to do with the aftercare policy than the chipset.

Yes, but you can't buy OEM batteries after a year or two of a flagship being out. Apple has batteries for a lot of models. That came out years ago!

I think the perceived lag is more to do with the android OS rather than the chipset.

No. Not at all. If a stock Android OS on a flagship device using similar hardware to the S9 still has noticeable lag after disabling all animations through developer mode, both the processor and the OS is at fault. Further solidifying my point that the A processors in older phones still work well with a finely tuned OS.

We have just acquired an S5 as my husband has sent his note 8 away to be fixed. It’s not as fast as the note 8, S9 plus etc but it’s useable.

What you define as usable is what I define as slow. Subjectivity is subjectivity, but at the end of the day, if something is old and slow, it's old and slow. If after a decade plus Android still hasn't gotten good enough to overcome its earlier issues, then it's not a very good mobile OS in the long run. That's the truth. I've probably bought at least 14 flagship devices in the time I've used Android. None of them have been remotely close to an iPhones performance. Why do I still use Android? Because I don't like how iOS works. It doesn't allow me the freedom to do as I please in the way I want to.


When you take your iPhone in for repair or a battery replacement, you know you're getting OEM parts. You're not getting third party, unless you take it to your carrier and they use the cheapest but good third party for parts.
 
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So....
With a 2nd lens the only difference from a user experience perspective from an Xs/Xs max will be a lower res screen and true 3d touch?

If you look at terms of popularity with features, it’s the camera. I don’t believe very much consumers care about features like 3D Touch and 720 P displays (Or 828 P) as much as they do about features they actually understand. The problem with 3D Touch, it’s not marketed by Apple, most users have no idea how to use it, even though someone like myself, use it every day.

If the 2019 XR is updated and receives a dual camera, it’s obvious Apple will market that during the keynote, because they know that will be a selling point for that phone.
 
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I don’t believe very much consumers care about features like 3D Touch and 720 P displays

I think you may have a point with the majority of customers not really caring about 3D in terms of what they actually look for when using the iPhone but I do believe that the current landscape of 4K TVs that customers do demand something in the “high res” category even if in real life usage it doesn’t prevent a user from completing a task or using an iPhone.

Regarding the 2nd lens on an XR and what customers actually understand I feel like it’s a really small group that actually know the 2nd lens isn’t actually being used when they tap 2x in the stock camera app unless you’re in the required lighting conditions. That being said “two lens” and “xxxx megapixels”! Specs! More is better! Lol
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If the 2019 XR is updated and receives a dual camera, it’s obvious Apple will market that during the keynote, because they know that will be a selling point for that phone.

Tech wise single lens portrait mode is a very underrated accomplishment along with the better lowlight portrait mode pic capabilities. To truly put the XR in the “budget” category I feel like apple would need to enable single lens portrait mode on all X’s to further strengthen the argument that 2 lens cameras iPhones are absolutely better options than the XR.
 
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Google stipulates this, but OEMs rarely follow it. Also, what you are stating is a NEW stipulation only brought up in the press back in late October. We'll still have to see two years from now if this holds any truth. This is for devices used by more than 100K people effective Jan 31 2018. Also, this is about security patches that OEMs must provide to Google and the carrier. However, if you knew anything about Android, you'd know it's up to the carrier to certify these patches just as they must certify OS updates. Apple doesn't do this. They send out the update to phones.

In plain English, a carrier can not certify these patches and Google cannot do anything about them. They can say **** Google and **** these OEMs, we're not going to do anything. That's the end. Google and the OEMs still need these carriers to survive in the markets. You could argue about Google Fi, but it's Sprint and TMobile's backend. Even American ISPs who've dived into carrier service ride on Verizon or ATT.

You don't have to deal with that BS with an iPhone. iPhones do not have the bloat that Androids on carriers do. The iPhone is immensely popular. Apple gets to dictate everything; they have since the first iPhone.

Also, your 2 years spiel about OS updates is about the Android One series. Android phones also throttle down when the battery is bad. The Samsung S series was notorious for this. They were even fined by the EU for this. Even my last S device felt slow at the end, and this is after doing a hard reset of the phone to stock and just adding back my photos through my G account. Not even the apps I was using. If the battery life fell, then it should still offer performance like it did on Day One. But it didn't.

Also, I explained why iOS 12 breathed new life into older devices. Did you not read? iOS 12 was developed with performance in mind. Older phones ramp up the processor differently in iOS 12 than prior iOS.



Yes, but you can't buy OEM batteries after a year or two of a flagship being out. Apple has batteries for a lot of models. That came out years ago!



No. Not at all. If a stock Android OS on a flagship device using similar hardware to the S9 still has noticeable lag after disabling all animations through developer mode, both the processor and the OS is at fault. Further solidifying my point that the A processors in older phones still work well with a finely tuned OS.



What you define as usable is what I define as slow. Subjectivity is subjectivity, but at the end of the day, if something is old and slow, it's old and slow. If after a decade plus Android still hasn't gotten good enough to overcome its earlier issues, then it's not a very good mobile OS in the long run. That's the truth. I've probably bought at least 14 flagship devices in the time I've used Android. None of them have been remotely close to an iPhones performance. Why do I still use Android? Because I don't like how iOS works. It doesn't allow me the freedom to do as I please in the way I want to.


When you take your iPhone in for repair or a battery replacement, you know you're getting OEM parts. You're not getting third party, unless you take it to your carrier and they use the cheapest but good third party for parts.
The 18 months of OS updates has been around for a few years. I’ve used Samsung flagship phones since the original galaxy note and they’ve all had 2 major OS updates. All of the major android OEMs like LG, Sony and HTC also offer 2 major OS updates and have for years. I think it’s the Chinese OEMs that have been guilty of not updating their devices. Even google now offer 3 major OS updates on pixel phones. These phones have the same chipset as a Samsung phone and in most cases the flagship Samsung phone has more RAM. The only difference is that a pixel phone runs a less ‘bloated’/bare bones version of android. However regardless of this I just don’t think the android OEMs in general have the same outlook as Apple. Apple want to keep you in their ecosystem. They are playing a long game. They want you to have such a good experience with your iPhone/iPad that you buy another. They don’t mind that you keep your iPhone for 3-4 years and they keep it updated and provided good aftersales support which in turn means you’re more likely to purchase another iPhone when the time comes. In this way they can also get you to buy other Apple devices and services. The android OEMs only seem to be interest in the short term. They want you to buy a phone now and once you’ve bought it they don’t particularly care. They are moving onto the next device and the next sale.


Again I think you’ve said it here many of the issues you are having are to do with the OS not the chipset. Another advantage Apple has it that they design their OS and chip in tandem to work together. Qualcomm design the chip and sell it to whoever wants to use it.

I think it’s fair to say the older android devices were laggy and not as smooth as an iPhone. However the ones I’ve used over the past few years have been just as smooth and fluid as any of my iPhones.
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I think you may have a point with the majority of customers not really caring about 3D in terms of what they actually look for when using the iPhone but I do believe that the current landscape of 4K TVs that customers do demand something in the “high res” category even if in real life usage it doesn’t prevent a user from completing a task or using an iPhone.

Regarding the 2nd lens on an XR and what customers actually understand I feel like it’s a really small group that actually know the 2nd lens isn’t actually being used when they tap 2x in the stock camera app unless you’re in the required lighting conditions. That being said “two lens” and “xxxx megapixels”! Specs! More is better! Lol
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Tech wise single lens portrait mode is a very underrated accomplishment along with the better lowlight portrait mode pic capabilities. To truly put the XR in the “budget” category I feel like apple would need to enable single lens portrait mode on all X’s to further strengthen the argument that 2 lens cameras iPhones are absolutely better options than the XR.
Whilst I do think that 2 lens are better than a single lens, if you can do the same thing almost as well with a single lens (portrait pics) then that’s enough for most consumers. The fact that a dual lens offers you 2x optical zoom will be lost on most people who probably don’t really understand the difference between optical and digital zoom. In the past you needed 2 lens to do portrait mode so that was enough in the mind of the average consumer to justify a second lens and it costing more. However now the technical details and finer points will only be relevant to tech enthusiasts.
 
The 18 months of OS updates has been around for a few years. I’ve used Samsung flagship phones since the original galaxy note and they’ve all had 2 major OS updates. All of the major android OEMs like LG, Sony and HTC also offer 2 major OS updates and have for years.
Offer. But it is up to the carrier to push it out. Not Google, not the OEM. I can't help but repeat myself. Google may require this and that, but it is up to the carrier, at least in the US, to push the update. Let me give you a reference date. S6 came out in 2015. Nougat came out in August 2016. Verizon finally pushed Nougat out on a rolling basis in April 2017. My phone didn't update until nearly July despite checking for updates OTA and on WiFi twice a day. That is over 24 months later. Unacceptable when compared to Apple's updates. Don't tell me devices get 18 months of updates when that is absolutely false. Carriers are not subjected to fines by any regulatory body or the OEMs or Google for not pushing out updates in a timely manner.

Sony isn't popular in the states. LG and HTC carry a bad rep for subpar phones, with LG's latest flagship being rather good, but suffering from technical malfunctions.

I’ve used Samsung flagship phones since the original galaxy note and they’ve all had 2 major OS updates.

Carrier related, again. You live in the UK. There are regulatory bodies for carriers not playing nice. We don't. The FCC does absolutely nothing in this regard. We don't have an ASA like you do to fine companies playing naughty. NEXT.


I think it’s the Chinese OEMs that have been guilty of not updating their devices.
Last I read Huawei and OnePlus regularly push out updates towards carriers.

Even google now offer 3 major OS updates on pixel phones. These phones have the same chipset as a Samsung phone and in most cases the flagship Samsung phone has more RAM. The only difference is that a pixel phone runs a less ‘bloated’/bare bones version of android. However regardless of this I just don’t think the android OEMs in general have the same outlook as Apple. Apple want to keep you in their ecosystem.
Okay, let me explain this to you. Google does do that. But again, it is up to the carrier to certify the update to make sure it plays nice with their network before they release it to handsets. A user may risk bricking their device by flashing their phone with a newer OS provided the handset is unlocked. Samsung uses ODIN. I can't speak for other brands. You can flash an unlocked phone to a universal ROM without carrier bloat, or your carrier's ROM. By doing this you void the warranty on the handset and the carrier is not responsible for any problems that may arise.

On older phones that I didn't need, I have flashed stock Android. There is still considerable lag with or without Samsung's bloated UI.

Also, did you just repeat what I said many posts ago about Apple banking on people wanting to stay into the ecosystem since every service and device integrates with one another? You did.

Apple are banking on people wanting to stay in the Apple eco-system, and thus will do anything to keep themselves in. Even if it means buying an older handset or changing carriers that offer new customers from other carriers an offer that's too good to pass up. And they get to take their number with them.
They are playing a long game. They want you to have such a good experience with your iPhone/iPad that you buy another. They don’t mind that you keep your iPhone for 3-4 years and they keep it updated and provided good aftersales support which in turn means you’re more likely to purchase another iPhone when the time comes.

Sigh. Apple doesn't need to play any game. They've already established themselves in the market. I very much doubt there's a considerable amount of people abandoning iPhones versus Android users abandoning Android and hopping on over to Apple. Low and mid-range Androids from years past left such a bad taste in people's mouth they switched over to iOS. The fact there are people who care about text bubble color means your argument holds no water. People are enamored with iPhones. Apple needn't play a long game or lull people into their space. You either have an iPhone or not. Apple doesn't care. They know most people will opt for an iPhone because it's cool, it works, it's relatively problem free, they hardly slow down, the apps are generally better, cool apps arrive on iOS first, etc.



The android OEMs only seem to be interest in the short term. They want you to buy a phone now and once you’ve bought it they don’t particularly care. They are moving onto the next device and the next sale.
And this falls back on Qualcomm. Qualcomm SoCs are in most Androids around the globe. An OEM may utilize Android Pie or whatever the next one is called, however, Qualcomm must release a drivers set for the phone to work properly. Qualcomm is under zero obligation to provide support for their SoCs years after they've produced them. In other words, Qualcomm decides whether it wants to provide support for Android Nougat or Pie, or whatever, and develops a driver package and SDK to OEMs like HTC, Samsung, etc. to use. Blame goes to Google, carriers, OEMs and especially Qualcomm.

Again I think you’ve said it here many of the issues you are having are to do with the OS not the chipset. Another advantage Apple has it that they design their OS and chip in tandem to work together. Qualcomm design the chip and sell it to whoever wants to use it.
And again, I've explained to you for the third time why you are incorrect. The OS is still buggy and slow. It just is. I've loaded up stock Android images on my older Samsungs that were capable of doing that the moment I didn't need them. This takes away Samsung bloat and leaves a pure Android OS. With or without animations, the experience was laggy.

Secondly, for the third time, I will explain this so you can understand. If Qualcomm doesn't provide a drivers set and SDK to OEMs for the SnapDragon 845 to use in the next 2-3 versions of a major Android release, the OEMs cannot do anything about it. They need those drivers to develop their updates, which they send to carriers, which evaluate and certify. American carriers drag their feet, sometimes never releasing said update. In April 2018, Samsung cut off updates for the entire S6 family, including critical security patches. Not even 3 years of updates, not even 2 since it took everyone way too long to get the ball rolling. People who bought an iPhone 5s are getting iOS 12. Apple promises at least 5 years of major updates, and then some with security patches. You do not get that with Android. You do not get individual phone refinement like you do with Apple. Apple figured out a way to breathe life into older phones by changing how those phones launched applications compared to newer phones. You won't ever get that with Android, through any flagship phone, even a Google phone. Ever.
I think it’s fair to say the older android devices were laggy and not as smooth as an iPhone. However the ones I’ve used over the past few years have been just as smooth and fluid as any of my iPhones.
Missus Z's XS Max runs circles around my S9. It's not just old phones that can't compete with Apple's offerings. I use the XS Max at home, using the same apps available on both platforms. The iPhone does better in each app. My only qualm about iPhones is the way iOS is. I've never liked it, even after having multiple iPads over the years. There's also the volume HUD and quick settings panel HUD that are annoying on iPhones, etc.

I recently played around with a OnePlus 6T. Fast phone. Slightly slower than the S9. Less lag here and there, but it's still a problematic handset. Having used an iPhone 7 and 8 in the past, it feels slower than those.


I don't care about notches or punchouts.
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If you look at terms of popularity with features, it’s the camera. I don’t believe very much consumers care about features like 3D Touch and 720 P displays (Or 828 P) as much as they do about features they actually understand. The problem with 3D Touch, it’s not marketed by Apple, most users have no idea how to use it, even though someone like myself, use it every day.

If the 2019 XR is updated and receives a dual camera, it’s obvious Apple will market that during the keynote, because they know that will be a selling point for that phone.
I still don't know what 3D touch is (then again I don't use iPhones), but people do care about displays. The XR is a good phone, but its screen isn't very good. Usually if I'm watching any video for more than 10 minutes, I want at least 720p if not 1080p which Verizon offers, as well as ATT, too, I believe. I can't speak for the rest of the XR. Someone on here said it best. Don't go from a 7 or 8 to an XR.
 
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