Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Which means they will need a complete redesign of everything Mac. MacBook / MacBook Pro / iMac / Mac Pro and Mac mini.

All of them are either outdated, not providing enough value, or has severe design flaws.

it means nothing is perfect...you always can find a situation that puts your thing to the grave

You are correct, nothing is perfect. It just means the Pre 2016 Keyboard are so much more reliable, cheaper to manufacture, slightly easier to repair, less clicks noise, and much better depth of "feel" then what we have now.
 
Which means they will need a complete redesign of everything Mac. MacBook / MacBook Pro / iMac / Mac Pro and Mac mini.

All of them are either outdated, not providing enough value, or has severe design flaws.



You are correct, nothing is perfect. It just means the Pre 2016 Keyboard are so much more reliable, cheaper to manufacture, slightly easier to repair, less clicks noise, and much better depth of "feel" then what we have now.

Not only redesign everything Mac but also change the management and those product designers.
 
as we haggle here, dust and sand all over the world is conspiring to incapacitate the keyboards of all MBP.

For example, Texas is being swamped by a huge Saharan dust storm, that travelled all across the Atlantic to fall upon MBP keyboards.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Breaking Good
So we have to choose between a working keyboard and throttled CPU performance, or a non-working keyboard with better CPU performance. OKAY.

⬅ But just look at how cute that Jony Ive emoji is to the left!

Sometimes Apple sucks. Often great, but when they suck they suck hard.
 
This seems more like it will stop the failures short term, but over the mid-long as dust does work it’s way in and build up it could well be worse at trapping it in there?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Marekul



he release of the new 2018 MacBook Pro models, iFixit last week tore apart the 13-inch version and discovered the presence of a new silicone membrane underneath the keyboard's butterfly keys that Apple internal documents have since confirmed has been added to prevent dust and other small particulates from causing key failures.

To give us a better look at the new third-generation butterfly keyboard included in the new 2018 machines and how it works, iFixit has done a much deeper dive, exposing the keyboard to debris to test it out.

ifixitkeyboarddust.jpg

iFixit exposed the keyboard to a powdered paint additive that glows, allowing the site to track where and how dust accumulates. On the 2018 MacBook Pro keyboard, the dust settled at the edges of the membrane, leaving the butterfly mechanism of the keys protected. The same test was performed on the 2017 MacBook Pro keyboard, demonstrating less protection.With a combination of a lot of dust and aggressive typing, the dust did penetrate the membrane-covered key clips, hitting the top of the switch, suggesting that there's still a small potential for failure. iFixit was indeed able to cause the keyboard to fail by adding "a few poorly placed particles" of sand.

While the silicone membrane does not appear to be impenetrable, and there's no way to tell how the barrier will hold up over time as iFixit points out, it's still more protection than offered in earlier versions of the butterfly keyboard.

Following the dust test, iFixit did a more extensive teardown of the new keyboard, tearing it apart layer by layer. After a grueling experience pulling it apart, which explains why Apple has to replace the entire top case when installing a new keyboard, iFixit found that the silicone barrier is a single die-cut and molded sheet.

ifixitkeyboardteardown.jpg

The keycaps on the keyboard have also been slightly redesigned, measuring in at 1.25mm thickness compared to 1.5mm thickness in the 2017 MacBook Pro, which iFixit suggests is to give the keys room to travel with the addition of the membrane.

The spacebar has been redesigned, with a keycap that easily separates from the butterfly mechanism, a departure from earlier models where the spacebar was more difficult to remove. All of the keys, spacebar included, were easier to remove and harder to ruin, in iFixit's testing.

Apple has not publicly confirmed that the new third-generation butterfly keyboard was introduced to enhance reliability and to cut down on the the key failures that were seen in 2016 and 2017 machines, though the company has informed Apple Authorized Service Providers that this is the case.

Instead, in its 2018 MacBook Pro marketing materials, Apple claims the new silicone barrier was added to introduce a quieter typing experience, an issue that few people seem to have had with the original keyboards.

Article Link: iFixit Tests Silicone Membrane on 2018 MacBook Pro Keyboard With Dust Exposure
So if I jam a rock under the keys it will fail...I would never thought that could happen..."sarcasm"
 
I bought a 2016 which was finally replaced by Apple with a 2017. My 2017 is essentially worthless now. It has already been repaired twice for the keyboard, but the resale value is probably going to nose dive. Who would buy a used laptop with a keyboard that could go out any day?
The keyboard is under warranty until 2020 and there aren’t any other known problems with the 2016/17 that I have heard of.
 
So we have to choose between a working keyboard and throttled CPU performance, or a non-working keyboard with better CPU performance. OKAY.

⬅ But just look at how cute that Jony Ive emoji is to the left!

Sometimes Apple sucks. Often great, but when they suck they suck hard.

He's definitely shoved something up his nose, look at his pupils!

Either that or Cook rammed an iPod up his colon.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Marekul
Instead, in its 2018 MacBook Pro marketing materials, Apple claims the new silicone barrier was added to introduce a quieter typing experience...

I don't remember seeing this connection made by Apple. What I remember, and what I see on their website, is that the keyboard is redesigned and that it is quieter. Obviously we can all make an assumption, but I don't think Apple ever marketed to consumers what the silicone was for, did they?
 
Just remember, if you buy a MBP, you are paying top dollar. Few laptops exceed its price. Competing brands have had and still have things like splash-resistant keyboards, user serviceable and upgradeable parts, useful ports, etc, etc. Apple makes the equivalent of crystalware for day to day use. Most use cases for a portable computer result in finger contact with screens and keyboards, a few bumps, plenty of dust etc, for which 'crystalware' is not suitable. Looks great new, nice OS (used to be better), but one false move and it's chipped or malfunctioning. Then you're at the oxymoronic 'Genius Bar' trying to stop the company from weaselling out of its warranty obligations, making the customer feel like the idiot. To me this keyboard membrane is an admission by Apple that they didn't care about the day to day use of the first Touch Bar MBP keyboards - they just said to themselves 'who cares, let's make money'. Or the screens for that matter! Let's see what they get a class action suit for next.
 
Does anyone know if these new keyboards are only on the touch models or on the 13 inch without touchbar as well? AFAIK Apple didn't upgrade the 13 inch without touchbar at all which essentially means that the 2018 Macbook Pros have been given a price increase.
 
Most common reason of failure on any laptop computer is water damage into the keyboard (and then motherboard etc), with exception to a few like thinkpads for example. It is time all manufacturers make them fully dust and waterproof for devices as expensive as these- Apple especially.
 
In sum, snorting coke while using MacBook Pro 2018 models won't ruin your keyboard.

Well, if you snort a lot some poorly placed particles can mess you up, and your keyboard too!
[doublepost=1532033887][/doublepost]
Most common reason of failure on any laptop computer is water damage into the keyboard (and then motherboard etc), with exception to a few like thinkpads for example. It is time all manufacturers make them fully dust and waterproof for devices as expensive as these- Apple especially.

You speak too much sense!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 0009827
Will a third party make this so those with the 16/17 Pros can install it on their machines?

Huh? Did you read the article? You can't replace the keyboard. No third party would make this part. Replacing the keyboard requires a complete top case replacement. This is ALL MacBook pros from 2016 on. Hell, even the older models with unibody as well. You don't "swap" keyboards.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.