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iMac Retina 5K disappointing: Heat and fan noise!
- Thread starter SmallDane
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iMac Retina 5K dissapointing: Heat and fan noise!
To point out the obvious my 3.4ghz i5 is incapable of heating up enough using Handbrake to increase the fan RPM. Hours on end of use will show a max of 80-82c or so.
Point is one shouldn't be surprised a CPU/GPU that is capable of doing more work (or same work faster) will run hotter. If you could dial your CPU/GPU back to what a slower unit does it would run cooler.
I think sometimes people forget the actual reason higher end Mac's run hotter. They think of it as a design flaw not an inherent characteristic of applied physics.
For mediocre task that don't display any benefits (faster completion, better graphics, etc) it would be very annoying.
To point out the obvious my 3.4ghz i5 is incapable of heating up enough using Handbrake to increase the fan RPM. Hours on end of use will show a max of 80-82c or so.
Point is one shouldn't be surprised a CPU/GPU that is capable of doing more work (or same work faster) will run hotter. If you could dial your CPU/GPU back to what a slower unit does it would run cooler.
I think sometimes people forget the actual reason higher end Mac's run hotter. They think of it as a design flaw not an inherent characteristic of applied physics.
For mediocre task that don't display any benefits (faster completion, better graphics, etc) it would be very annoying.
Nobody has disputed that. The question is if the same workload should cause much higher heat and fan noise on a more powerful machine than on a less powerful one.
I am talking about what I consider ordinary stuff like watching a video stream (even if Flash does suck as mentioned) and playing a game on low graphics settings. This causes very high temps and very high fan speeds (in fact, the maximum possible). Is that reasonable?
High temps and high fan speeds would go together, so expected - but not necessarily reasonable if the noise is objectionable to you.
I think the question is: Is yours normal, or not? (Is the fan mechanically OK ?)
You should compare yours directly with an identical iMac - side by side.
Give Apple an opportunity to checkout/repair, etc - or if you are still within the 14 day from new, return to Apple.
Yes, that would be ideal. But that's not really possible for me unfortunately.
I will be calling Apple on Monday to return it. I am very unhappy with it.
Now comes the question of what to replace it with. Some of the statements in this thread have made me very confused. It sounds very counter-intuitive to me that a cheaper, slower machine will make less noise. But if that is the case, I will certainly go that way.
So now I am considering getting the non-Retina 27" iMac instead. The big question is then
- CPU: i5 vs i7?
- GPU: 775M vs 780M
Again, from some of the comments in this thread it would seem that the slowest of those (i5 and 775M) would give me the most quiet machine. But is that really true? And how much performance do I sacrifice by picking the slower chips? I hope somebody with insight or experience can guide me making this choice.
Rather than throw around questions about technical issues (which may be misinterpreted, with answers that might even be misguided), why not just consider that your iMac may simply be defective, and replacing with the same model may fix your issue.
(Others do report very low fan noise, even with the RiMac.)
Because it's not that easy. If I was convinced or strongly believed that it was defective, I would turn it in for repair. But as it is, I think it's more likely that this is just the way it is meant to be. Though the comments in this thread are not consistent, that is the sense I get.
Under this condition, I feel I run a great risk by turning it in for repair. If Apple decides it has no defect, it will likely be too late to return it and I may even have to pay a fee for having them check it out. I am not willing to run that risk.
I totally get you SmallDane.
I don't have an iMac, but in the process of buying. Reading on this forum has only made my buying decision much harder
Just so I understand you - You don't want to try returning, or getting your iMac checked out, because you fear that Apple will find nothing wrong?
Although I read reports about rather excessive noise, I also continue to read that the fan noise is barely noticeable. This could be exactly the same levels, simply different tolerance - or some may have defective fans, or something else about the cooling is not correct, such as improper paste application on the CPU.
Do you run the risk of Apple finding nothing wrong? Sure, but you also have the (equal) possibility that Apple will say yours is faulty, and repair or replace it.
You say you are disappointed - why not give Apple the opportunity to make that right? You may be pleasantly surprised!
To put this in a different light, keep in mind that folks with no complaints will be less likely to post in these threads.
That's a $3k bet right there. 50/50 chance. Not a good bet if you ask me
Especially, since he loses his right to get a full return, if they don't find anything (as I understand it - I don't know apples return policy).
You are probably right. That's also why threads like these shouldn't be enough to discourage people (like me) from getting the 5k.
In reality, they do though
Yea, it's a matter of risk assessment. I don't know how you come to the conclusion that the chance is "equal" that it is faulty. At the outset, faulty machines should be rare after all. But even if that is the case, "equal possibility" is not good enough. We are talking about a VERY expensive machine here. So there is a lot at stake. And I don't think I owe Apple any courtesy here. My past experience with Apple gives me little reason to trust that they will show me any courtesy in this regard.
I've been following this retina iMac drama since launch, all i can say is if you feel that you are not happy then return it. best to be safe on such a investment if you feel you aren't satisfied with your purchase. personally if it were me i would have it looked at and accept a replacement like for like. nothing I've read so far here concerns me, I would purchase one if i had the funds available. for now it will have to wait.
coming from a noisy pc background, fans on full is just natural for me especially if the machine is getting pushed hard. with regards to software not being optimised for the display, windowed v full screen or flash implementation in sites then thats an issue for the software/web developers. if gaming drives the machines cooling system more than a non retina iMac then that might be the best choice for you. if it in its current form it doesn't perform as you wish then the choice is obvious.
my time as a pc gamer, I've never known of a quiet gaming session!
coming from a noisy pc background, fans on full is just natural for me especially if the machine is getting pushed hard. with regards to software not being optimised for the display, windowed v full screen or flash implementation in sites then thats an issue for the software/web developers. if gaming drives the machines cooling system more than a non retina iMac then that might be the best choice for you. if it in its current form it doesn't perform as you wish then the choice is obvious.
my time as a pc gamer, I've never known of a quiet gaming session!
Yet, despite your financial outlay, you haven't actually checked the possibility (possible!) that yours is faulty. Should a 3k system be perfect? You have good reason to expect that.
I say the chance is "equal", because it's either a normal sound of the fans (maybe not acceptable to you, but still normal), or it's not normal, and Apple will replace (or fix). It's a yes or no - equal chance
You do have the right to return within the first 14 days for any reason (or no reason) You don't give up THAT initial right, regardless of what someone else might tell you - unless you wait too long.
I've taken iMacs out of box, that were totally dead, and out of a sealed box. Not common, in my experience unboxing more than seven hundred a couple of years ago, I recall one or two with problems. Easily swapped out, but it happens. It's technology, and there's nothing perfect about it.
If you don't want to give Apple the opportunity to help, or even hear for yourself that other RiMacs are quiet (or just as noisy), then that's not on Apple.
I say the chance is "equal", because it's either a normal sound of the fans (maybe not acceptable to you, but still normal), or it's not normal, and Apple will replace (or fix). It's a yes or no - equal chance
You do have the right to return within the first 14 days for any reason (or no reason) You don't give up THAT initial right, regardless of what someone else might tell you - unless you wait too long.
I've taken iMacs out of box, that were totally dead, and out of a sealed box. Not common, in my experience unboxing more than seven hundred a couple of years ago, I recall one or two with problems. Easily swapped out, but it happens. It's technology, and there's nothing perfect about it.
If you don't want to give Apple the opportunity to help, or even hear for yourself that other RiMacs are quiet (or just as noisy), then that's not on Apple.
Totally agree with DeltaMac's post, people do assume the worst with any new purchase. making comparisons with our previous machines is normal, but knowing whether there is an issue or not is the key. How does an retina iMac fans compare to even the ps4's fans when gaming? ever heard how loud they get?
We got our 5k iMacs yesterday, both with the i7 cpu and 295 gpu. From all of the complaining I've read about noise while gaming and such I was expecting it to be pretty loud.
We could hear them, but really?....not that loud at all. Even with both of them sitting side by side on the table while we were playing WoW together for several hours at a time(cpu temps around 85C and gpu temps around 100-105C) they weren't anywhere near as loud as our 2012 rMBP's that we've been playing WoW on since we got them in June 2012. If the heat kicked on in the house it would basically mask the noise of our iMacs. Personally, I don't consider these things to be too loud one single bit.
We could hear them, but really?....not that loud at all. Even with both of them sitting side by side on the table while we were playing WoW together for several hours at a time(cpu temps around 85C and gpu temps around 100-105C) they weren't anywhere near as loud as our 2012 rMBP's that we've been playing WoW on since we got them in June 2012. If the heat kicked on in the house it would basically mask the noise of our iMacs. Personally, I don't consider these things to be too loud one single bit.
Ahem! Will the world be destroyed tomorrow by a meteor? That's a yes or no. Does that make it equal chance?
Actually it is on Apple wether or not it's defective. I have received a machine that I'm not satisfied with. Unless I completely misunderstand the return policy, that means I can return it.
The fact that the root cause may be a defective machine is just too bad for Apple. They can improve their quality assurance if they want to avoid that. Again, if that is the case.
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Loudness is subjective. Fan speed is a better measurement, I think. Was the fan running at max speed (2700 rpm) when the GPU temp was at 100-105C?
It was around 2300-2400 rpm I believe. But we also had two iMacs next to each other...which is likely to be louder than a single machine running at the full 2700 rpm.
But I was only doing what another person on these forums were doing (playing WoW) and that other person described it as unbearable and actually returned their iMac for a non-retina.
But I was only doing what another person on these forums were doing (playing WoW) and that other person described it as unbearable and actually returned their iMac for a non-retina.
Within 14 days after purchase, you can return your iMac, and you don't need to provide a reason. - or doesn't fit in your desk, or wrong color, or too heavy,
Or just tell Apple it's too noisy. They can't resell without repairs/inspection for a returned unit. Get your refund, or a like-for-like replacement.
I still say you should check a different RiMac for objectionable noise.
And, yes, exactly, loudness is subjective (to some degree). Some folks report that the fans may be at high speed, yet are not noticeable. YOU may have the same experience - or you may find out that a different RiMac is completely acceptable to you. The fan will always be running, and at 100C should be running at high/highest speed. The noise generated is really the issue, not that the fan is running - am I wrong?
I contend that some units, with the exact same conditions, will generate a different noise level. Maybe you will be lucky and trade out to a RiMac with a less noisy fan.
My situation is a little different from the case discussed here, but I think it might be helpful to some to share my experience. So here it is.
I have been badly annoyed in the past by the very loud fan noise coming from a G5 iMac (almost ten years ago now...) and I was uneasy when I started thinking about ordering a retina iMac. When I read about the heat-fan problems that people seemed to have with the maxed out retina iMac, I decided it would be safer to go for the i5/290x.
I have had the base version for more than a week now and I can say that the noise and the heat have been very tolerable. I don't do anything very demanding on a computer (Word, Preview, Safari, iPhoto) and I haven't heard the fan accelerate noticeably. There is, to be sure, a certain fan noise, but it is discreet. It is certainly nothing compared to my old G5. But it is more noticeable than on my 2012 retina MacBook Pro (which is so silent; how I wish all computers were like this).
This comparison has limited value, but I would say that the fan of the base version makes no more noise than the noise of a refrigerator fan in another room with the door closed. I say this because I found myself unable to discern if the noise I heard at my desk came from my retina iMac or from the refrigerator in the next room, which is probably a good thing for the computer.
Anyway, when I decided to return the computer (not because of the fan, but because of the screen (which had some clouding and bleed), I was bold enough to order the maxed out version (i7/295x), because I wanted to see for myself if the complaints about the noise/heat have been exaggerated and because I felt that my base retina iMac was somewhat slower than my 2012 retina MacBook Pro (which annoys me a little). I will receive the i7/295x in less than a week and I will be able to compare then. I hope to be pleasantly surprised, but I might also be proved wrong, in which case, I don't know really what I will do.
Thank you for that. No doubt it is subjective. 2300 rpm is too loud for my taste when running ordinary tasks. 2700 rpm is unbearable unless it's for only short periods of time.
It's good that you're happy with yours.
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Thank you for confirming. I will indeed tell Apple it's too noisy.
I don't really have that option. That's really why I posted here. To hear from others what their experience was. As I expected it's a mixed bag of opinions. And I do know that some people a much more tolerant of noise levels than I am.
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I hope it works out to your satisfaction. Hopefully you will post your experience here.
I should say that my iMac is indeed very silent when the fan is running at the default 1200 rpm. If you're only doing very light work, then I think you will not find it noisy at all.
I'll mention this again. It just MAY be that a fresh install on a formatted drive with Yosemite downloaded rather than from recovery disk just MIGHT shake something loose (figuratively speaking)
I had various issues with mine which I had migrated from my mini that were ALL solved and then some after I did the above. It was like a freaking miracle.
I went from hating the machine to LOVING the machine.
Easier than returning, for sure, which is something I also did not want to deal with.
I had various issues with mine which I had migrated from my mini that were ALL solved and then some after I did the above. It was like a freaking miracle.
I went from hating the machine to LOVING the machine.
Easier than returning, for sure, which is something I also did not want to deal with.
I will try doing that before returning it. It's a good way to clean the disk, anyway.
On my top-spec 2013 iMac 27, 2700 rpm is quite loud. Below 2,000 rpm is OK, and the vast majority of the time I can't hear it over the noise of my Windows PC under my desk. However at 2700 rpm the iMac is louder than the PC with 7 cooling fans.
This is worsened because the all-in-one design puts the screen near your face, unlike a separate system unit that's under a desk.
Fortunately it almost never reaches that rpm. Under very sustained transcoding it may occasionally reach that. To artificially induce it I had to run a combined CPU stress test plus GPU stress:
CPU: http://osxdaily.com/2012/10/02/stress-test-mac-cpu/
GPU: http://www.geeks3d.com/20140304/gpu...w-fp64-opengl-4-test-and-online-gpu-database/
What we need is a reproducible scenario combined with a graph of temp and fan speed over time. Comparing that between a retina and non-retina iMac would be informative.
The previously-posted streaming video doesn't make my 2013 iMac heat up very much at all.
I will try doing that before returning it. It's a good way to clean the disk, anyway.
Right on
I had come so close to returning mine because of issues. I realize it is shot in the dark. But much stranger things have happened.